Men of color running Grammys 2018

[RAMROD 109,352]

Just now, StrawberryBlond said:

Are whites never allowed to dominate one year? Is all music dominance by whites a bad thing?

1 year of POC dominance compared to all white dominance pretty much in almost 60 years of its run and the POC one is the bad guy

[LordEnigma 11,313]

5 minutes ago, StrawberryBlond said:

So, one year throws it all out the window? Does it erase 2004 when it was an all-black Billboard #1 list? Are there not allowed to be one-off years? Are whites never allowed to dominate one year? Is all music dominance by whites a bad thing? If whites are producing good music, are they allowed to be dominant then?

Sure, no one says that they want white people off the charts...but there are ones who clearly think that secretly. You know the type. I think such a mindset is the antithesis of what music is about - bringing us together and not caring about superficial stuff.

Well, I could turn this statement around on you - if you want to make the claim that black people are not dominating the charts, where's your evidence? It's always the same when people try to convince me of racism in the music industry. They have next to no evidence, yet they want me to believe it. Yet, as someone who studies the charts and Grammys, reviews albums and sales statistics and I've got ample evidence against their view...they throw it all out and don't even reply to it. They don't want to admit to the facts because they find them uncomfortable as they don't fit the convenient fantasy of "amazing black artists being held down" that they've believed all these years. If anything, it's white artists who are struggling to release albums now, getting them delayed because they can't get hits and and are being forced into making a generic body of work to get it released. Black artists, on the other hand, have the most amazing artistic freedom, hence the really contemporary, avant garde bodies of work from them now and they have absolutely no problem getting them released, they don't even need a hit single preceding them. White artists on the other hand, have to be hit makers if they want to succeed. They might get more freedom on an indie label but if they're mainstream, it's another matter. It's no wonder that black artists are getting such amazing reviews right now - because they're allowed to release the music that's in their heart. Whites are being forced into making albums that don't suit their vision because labels like bigger control over them for some reason.

For your first paragraph I was just commenting how you used 2004 as an example of black artists ruling the charts but then 9 years later - no black artists got a number one. So you can’t just use 2004 as an example just like you told me 😂

Girl, white people have dominated the entertainment business for decades upon decades - I’m glad that black artists are finally being represented more and more. 

[StrawberryBlond 14,822]

51 minutes ago, RAMROD said:

1 year of POC dominance compared to all white dominance pretty much in almost 60 years of its run and the POC one is the bad guy

I didn't say one year of POC dominance is "the bad guy." My point was that if POC dominating a whole year is seen as a positive, why is white artists dominating a whole year seen as a negative? The suggestion is that if black people dominated a whole year, they must have been making the best music, but for whites to do the same must suggest that they were making bad music but succeeded because they were white. No, that's a massive double standard and highly insulting. It's like people don't even realise the stuff they're insinuating lately.

48 minutes ago, Alexander Levi said:

For your first paragraph I was just commenting how you used 2004 as an example of black artists ruling the charts but then 9 years later - no black artists got a number one. So you can’t just use 2004 as an example just like you told me 😂

Girl, white people have dominated the entertainment business for decades upon decades - I’m glad that black artists are finally being represented more and more. 

Surely you'd agree that 2004 was a more racist time than 2013, right? But yet, it was an all-black #1 year. That tells you that things can't have been as bad in the music industry at least, as we were led to believe. If blacks can dominate then, why can't they in the future? Again, why is an all-black year positive but an all-white year negative? If the music's good, who cares?

Yes, white people have dominated the entertainment business for decades...but all that has been changing for some time. We need to stop pretending it's 1950 and look at the facts. I have no problem with blacks being represented so long as they're providing music at the same quality as their white peers.

[LordEnigma 11,313]

11 minutes ago, StrawberryBlond said:

I have no problem with blacks being represented so long as they're providing music at the same quality as their white peers.

Oh my - that is quite a statement.

[StrawberryBlond 14,822]

17 minutes ago, Alexander Levi said:

Oh my - that is quite a statement.

You've misinterpreted it. Another way of saying it could be: "Everyone should be held to the same musical standard and nominated based on nothing but the music." No need to read anything sinister into it.

[Thomas P 18,479]

On 2017-11-28 at 12:29 PM, Phoenix said:

here for music that deserves it getting nominated, no matter which race the artist is.

despacito and jayz dont deserve 70% of what they are nom for.

Jay Z I agree with, but even though I don’t like Despacito, I genuinely would have been shocked if it weren’t nominated. It was unarguably the biggest song of the year AROUND THE WORLD and it represented something huge for Latin music.

[LordEnigma 11,313]

Just now, StrawberryBlond said:

You've misinterpreted it. Another way of saying it could be: "Everyone should be held to the same musical standard and nominated based on nothing but the music." No need to read anything sinister into it.

It was worded incorrectly - I’m just reacted to how you wrote it. Sorry - I just won’t take what you wrote how you wrote it any more 😂

[Thomas P 18,479]

On 2017-11-28 at 7:02 PM, StrawberryBlond said:

Quality is the most important thing. Music is nothing to do with race. If black people deliver quality, they will get nominated, as white people will. Do you want equal rights or better rights? That is the thing is passing a lot of people who think like you by. You don't realise you're asking for better rights. If you want to be nominated for no other reason than "representation" and "diversity," then that is asking for special treatment. I'm a woman. I wouldn't want to be nominated purely for being a woman, I'd want to get nominated for making a good album. I'd feel offended if I was granted a place for the sake of being PC and nothing else. That makes a mockery of art and awards.

I review lots of albums a year and I'm sorry to say that black artists are just not cutting it for me and haven't for some time. Black artists just don't make music like they used to back in the 90's. The last above average album that came from a black rapper, in my opinion, was Dr Dre's Compton album in 2015. Everything else has been average at best. Not only are they sending anti-white messages in their albums now (there's a difference between being black positive and completely alienating your non-black fans) but they're also being too pretentious and avant garde. I really don't know what critics are seeing anymore. Plus, there's a lot of names I simply don't recognise now. I look up a list of albums coming out every month to review, so I should have heard of them, but honestly, there's a lot of names on the Grammy nominations list that I've never heard of. I don't know where they get them from now. It's like they're picking the most obscure ones for the sake of it.

He was nominated for 8 awards, 4 of them in the rap category, the other 4 elsewhere. That's not "mainly," that's half. That's the really odd thing about it. Sweeping in rapy? Perfectly acceptable. Sweeping in the general? Suspicious.

Most of us don't support the belief that only whites can be racist. You might be surprised to find that even people of colour also support this theory.

You act as if blacks have never won the award. Just because your favourites didn't win in their respective years didn't mean they were "snatched" or "snubbed." This is the special treatment thing again. When a white artist wins, you think it's undeserved. When a black artist loses, you think it's a racist snub. Have you ever thought that quality played a role in the decision? Why do you think any "snub" was the result of racist decisions? I don't know why black artists are seen as the most deserving in every situation without question. Do you not believe that white artists can make good material?

I'll give you a little fact - Eminem has been nominated for AOTY 3 times and has never won. He has no problem winning in the rap category but has always fallen short when it comes to AOTY. Gaga has also been nominated 3 times and has never won. Beyonce has just joined their little club of "3 time AOTY nominee who's never won." It's not a race thing, it's a frustrating thing a lot of artists go through. Only difference is, white artists think it's just one of those things when it happens to them, black artists think it's racism. Don't you think if that really was the case, that no black artists would even get a nomination? 2011 is the most recent year where there were all white AOTY nominations. Most other years have 2 or more.

No they aren't. They come from the same umbrella of prejudice. I'm a woman, so yeah.

So, a person says that musical quality should matter more than the colour of the artist (which should be completely irrelevant) and you think that's bitter? Wow. The knives are really out for anyone with a dissenting opinion on this, aren't they? I mean, what you can say in response when your opinion gets shot down that quick with nothing else to say?

I find it funny how that's all you have to say. Representation matters. Nothing else. Not even musical quality. Even as a woman, I don't want to be nominated in something just to fill a diversity quota. That's an insult, not a compliment. To know that you're only there because people didn't want to look close-minded? What's good about that, exactly? I think acceptance is so much better when it's genuine, not forced.

We do understand it. We just don't think it should have any bearing on what gets nominated and wins in a music awards show.

Music is subjective, and just because you don’t like some of the albums doesn’t mean the rest of the world didn’t. Black music has been a literal force the past couple of years because that’s what people want to hear. It’s quality has nothing to do with your opinion, it has to do with everyone’s opinion, and most people agree that albums like CTRL, Lemonade, DAMN, TPAB, Awaken My Love, etc. are the best albums that have been released these past few years.

Popularity and quality go hand in hand, and this is the first time that the albums and songs nominated (for the most part) have had both. 

[StrawberryBlond 14,822]

On 11/30/2017 at 2:16 AM, Thomas P said:

Music is subjective, and just because you don’t like some of the albums doesn’t mean the rest of the world didn’t. Black music has been a literal force the past couple of years because that’s what people want to hear. It’s quality has nothing to do with your opinion, it has to do with everyone’s opinion, and most people agree that albums like CTRL, Lemonade, DAMN, TPAB, Awaken My Love, etc. are the best albums that have been released these past few years.

Popularity and quality go hand in hand, and this is the first time that the albums and songs nominated (for the most part) have had both. 

I know that and I'm aware that critical reception is the biggest factor. I just wish the academy would have more of a backbone and form their own opinions about albums rather than just basing nominations on how the critics in general ranked them. So many critics get paid to make good reviews and are sheep who just follow what the others do anyway. Not to mention, they tend to go along with the public reaction to an artist, giving a well-received one good reviews and a badly received one bad reviews. Hardly worth taking as the gospel truth.

Most people haven't heard those albums you mentioned. Most people only listen to albums from their favourites. I'm one of the few who listens to all, so I'm different, but most are completely ignorant to other names out there. And you really think the songs nominated this year were both popular and high quality? The latter's subjective but the former sure as hell isn't. Especially from a non-American perspective.