Erdogans "no" to Sweden and Finland in NATO still stands: "Don't bother"

[heygurlhi 3,200]

3 minutes ago, ARTPOP said:

It is bad decision for Sweden and Finland but the reasons are actually valid points

Nato and specially US been making world altering long term decisions willy-nilly since the start of the war with no debate at all, someone needs to pull a brake somehow

[Pennywise 36,080]

4 hours ago, KORG said:

I was recently in Turkey and let me tell you.. it would take all of 2 minutes to convince them to do what you want. Give them a shiny coin. That place is seriously left in a pre-1900s state. Horrible place.

not you reading the whole country 

[Melech 9,900]

 

not surprising. Wish NATO could kick them out. 
 

11 hours ago, dit said:

but yesterday they said they would allow Sweden and Finland to join if they stopped supporting the PKK (which is a terorrist organization and its true...many European nations support them sadly). Not everything is so black and white in this matter and I kind of have to agree that it is shameful that some nations are supporting such a terror group under the guise of helping Kurdish people. It's shameful. That said, I'm not sure these are times to be making conditions like this. Finland and Sweden are in really precarious situations with Russia at the moment...

I’m curious, do you consider Hamas or PFLP as terrorist group das well? 

[TheSlash 14,539]

Just give him some

and he will approve  . Merkel made it work when she was chancellor  .

[FATCAT 60,888]

13 minutes ago, TheSlash said:

Just give him some

and he will approve  . Merkel made it work when she was chancellor  .

He just wants to use this as a bargaining chip. He's not going to hold things up for long.

[palma 8,909]

10 hours ago, Economy said:

Don't know much about Turkish political dynamics

 

Can someone explain to me why they are so resistant to then joining NATO?

Money 

Erdogan is in dire straits as lira has been plummeting for ages. The first time I went abroad back in 2011 EUR-TRY exchange rate was like 2.17 liras for a Euro but now its 16.61 liras and there haven’t been a substantial raise in income - we have like 170% inflation this year and some people are starving - we would be Venezuela if if weren’t for Erdogan’s secret deals with the Persian Gulf countries (he basically sold them everything inside the country, from ports, banks, prestigious buildings to even peninsulas at the Turkish riviera, Qatar Foundation owns 50% of Turkey at this point ).

It still is not enough though, Erdogan needs money and support of the West to ensure he can hold elections and actually win them. Next year there will be presidential elections and despite the opposition in Turkey is pretty much incapable, they are still likely to win as people can’t afford basic necessities anymore.

Besides, bullying the West and playing the strong-leader trope always emboldened his base on previous occasions, he even went for New Zealand once I believe 

Nordic countries, but mostly Sweden has been receiving political refugees from Turkey for ages, people who have been connected to Kurdish secessionist movement, and Swedish government funds some foundations in Turkey that our government does not approve (including but not limited to LGBTQ+ rights foundations and Amnesty International). Erdogan basically wants Europe and the international community at large to continually and unconditionally fund him for keeping the Syrian, Afghan, and Pakistani refugees from crossing over to Europe. He demands to be able to do whatever he wishes to do to appease his base, be it threaten the Greeks and Cypriots over gas reserves in the Mediterranean, establish an Islamist and anti-Kurdish regime in Syria and totally transform Turkey into a sectarian dictatorship that is unlike Saudi Arabia basically.

He is trying to force the West into negotiating with him, that’s why one day he says one thing and the next day he says a totally different one.

The thing the West never understood regarding the “Second World” is, rather than supporting democrats and progressives, they always opted for strong men who can shape public opinion in exchange for concessions; political or monetary. That is why they failed with Putin, that’s why they will fail with Erdogan.

They need to stop appeasing him, period. But that being said, giving up on Erdogan should not mean giving up on Turkey. We had a terrible 20 years, some in Turkey even compare it to Nazi Germany, but if we manage to topple Erdogan without bloodshed, things will be back to normal in time. I mean you guys understandably don’t know this but Turkey had been the most pro-Western country in the Middle East along with Israel, that is why we’re in NATO (and had been so since the 50’s).