I Feel Like Joanne Could Have Been Better Than What it Was

[ELEMENTALITY 1,298]

Overall, and judge me if you want, the Joanne record was a good move for Gaga but it is in no way her best record. If you look at the actual Joanne record, 80% of the album has nothing to do with her aunt, death, or what happened in regards to that. Diamond Heart (I'm good even though I've made mistakes), Ay-o (bop, hilarious, sexual, random middle America references), Dancin' in Circles (trop house/indian masturbation), Perfect Illusion (identity, social media, fake love), Angel Down (Trayvon Martin, social justice), Million Reasons (relationship with fans/personal whether or not it's worth it) don't actually have much to do with the concept of understanding how a death affected your family.

Gaga did not deliver anything groundbreaking and I feel like she really didn't go that deep with the Joanne era. Just because she slowed down her music, went for a stripped down look, and talked about her family in interviews doesn't make it any deeper. We found out more about Gaga personally in her documentary and interviews than we did on the actual record. Think about it....truly. The only songs where Gaga talks about her family/friends relationships on the Joanne album are a bit on Diamond Heart, Joanne, Sinner's Prayer, and Grigio Girls. The rest is about either sex, alcohol, smoking, a relationship (fans or men) gone bad, or social justice issues.

 IMHO....Born This Way and The Fame Monster are far deeper and leagues more interesting than Joanne. The Edge of Glory, Hair, You and I, Marry the Night, Black Jesus + Amen Fashion, and Bloody Mary are far more creative, inspired, and depthy than anything on Joanne. And tracks like So Happy I Could Die, Monster, Speechless, or Dance in the Dark on The Fame Monster give us an actual glimpse into how Gaga views the world around her and how it affects her. 

Now...don't get me wrong....Joanne is a good album. Good. It's still a Gaga record by all means, and it definitely aims to have a concept that challenges the listener in a new way. But mostly instrumentally and aesthetically. Which is the same problem Gaga had on ARTPOP.....a hodgepodge of different themes and ideas swimming around but never really centering themselves in the concept of the record. The difference between ARTPOP and Joanne is that I firmly believe that ARTPOP was a bad concept because all of Gaga's records could be called ARTPOP. It was a bland washover of what "Lady Gaga does" and that is an observation....not a strong concept. Joanne on the other hand could have been a stronger concept. But it didn't come through the way The Fame, The Fame Monster, or Born This Way did. And I'm not saying this because of chart success. I say this genuinely because those first three albums relate to their concepts so well...even in very difficult ways...it can be explained if the listener is willing. Joanne doesn't do this. It's all face value...and the gut wrenching punch of a record about a death you never witnessed but you feel EXISTS in you just never was there. The tears felt forced at moments. And alot of times, there were many filler tracks that musically tie into Joanne but never conceptually relate. In other words...Joanne really should have been a 4 or 5 track EP: 1. Joanne 2. Diamond Heart 3. Sinner's Prayer 4. Grigio Girls 5. (Maybe) Million Reasons. The rest of Joanne literally could have been shifted over and refocused into another Gaga album. And that's not a strong concept if it can be taken out and put on another record so easily. 

I feel in the future, Gaga should really try and focus on making a strong concept she truly believes in. Something that genuinely angers her. Something that breaks not society's rules (like she always has), but maybe....breaks her own? If Gaga made a record where she was angry, truly not perfect, said things that were how she felt about even her fans or Madonna or men in the industry more explicitly rather than through the constant rose colored lens of being fabulous or dramatic or woke or whatever, then it might seem like a true evolution....a human ****ing experience. Often times Gaga talks about being IMPERFECT on the most PERFECT sounding record...and that seems not genuine. She doesn't even have to vocally be pitch perfect... (We get it now....I think everyone knows Lady Gaga is considered a great vocalist, no one doubts that anymore, its not 2011, she proved that). Use some vocal effects if it's creative for you. Break your own limits again. Are you pushing everyone else or yourself Gaga? **** or not if you push the world....push yourself differently. Change your opinion on something. Quit trying to be relatable or relevant again, start by trying to be interesting again.

 But to me, the pink hat was just a costume to relate. I don't see it as her being her at all or a good version of her. I think its a nice gesture record, but not really Gaga at her full potential. And I think more people on here feel that then they are willing to admit. And I think if you read between the lines, Gaga has a better, more terrifying, more gut wrenching album in her that she needs to be honest with and true to. And sorry....now that the era is pretty much over.....I can say I don't think Joanne was it.  

[rumours 45,521]

1 minute ago, ELEMENTALITY said:

If Gaga made a record where she was angry, truly not perfect, said things that were how she felt about even her fans or Madonna or men in the industry more explicitly rather than through the constant rose colored lens of being fabulous, then it might seem like a true evolution.

However, this might make for a record where she sounds super petty like Taylor's Reputation. 

[Sebs 1,809]

no t no shade but i always wonder why people spend time writing very long posts about stuff they didnt like

[ryanripley 86,575]

some of the songs you listed as being unrelated to her aunt can be linked by theorising they've been written through the eyes of Joanne

she was a living human being with her own thoughts, feelings, emotions and experiences that were expressed through songs like DH, DIC, MR etc

it can be about Joanne as a person and Joanne in relation to Gaga

[He8MyHeart 9,765]

I see the album as living the life of a woman that couldn't live hers. So that's how the sex, alcohol etc. comes into it, in my opinion.

[getto 1,552]

4 minutes ago, ryanripley said:

some of the songs you listed as being unrelated to her aunt can be linked by theorising they've been written through the eyes of Joanne

she was a living human being with her own thoughts, feelings, emotions and experiences that were expressed through songs like DH, DIC, MR etc

it can be about Joanne as a person and Joanne in relation to Gaga

How would Gaga know how Joanne lived her life though?

[ryanripley 86,575]

1 minute ago, JeremiJello said:

How would Gaga know how Joanne lived her life though?

her family can explain what Joanne was like as a person, you see it in 5F2 whilst she visits her grandma and digs through Joanne's possessions

gaga and her family are very close and traditional, she probably heard enough stories over her 30+ years of being alive to have a good idea of who Joanne was as a person

[getto 1,552]

1 minute ago, ryanripley said:

her family can explain what Joanne was like as a person, you see it in 5F2 whilst she visits her grandma and digs through Joanne's possessions

gaga and her family are very close and traditional, she probably heard enough stories over her 30+ years of being alive to have a good idea of who Joanne was as a person

so her possessions talk about getting high with john wayne, masturbating and calling people's name out, and telling everybody to be like the godly man in a lab coat? sure jan.

[Haroon 49,685]

10 minutes ago, Sebs said:

no t no shade but i always wonder why people spend time writing very long posts about stuff they didnt like

The same reason why people write long posts about stuff they do like  We're on a Gaga forum and sharing positive and negative criticism is fair play if done maturely and that's what the OP did. It shares an opinion and people are free to agree or disagree and state why. Also it helps see things from a different perspective and possibly open our eyes to what we didn't see before, or appreciate different things in different ways because of seeing things in a different light

[Irrelevant 20,282]

The Fame was hardly about The Fame. ARTPOP songwise didn't exactly relate to the theme.

[Delulu Rogers 7,251]

The concept wasn't about her dead aunt though. It was her trying to find herself after all these years of fame and drama and to do that she went back to her family roots which included having to acknowledge her aunt's death. When you think of it as gaga finding herself, DIC, MR, PI, DH, Joanne, JAD, Hey Girl, GG, JW, and SP all fit the bill. She explains this concept of the album in all those interviews that she kept saying that "i'm my dad's daughter, sister's sister, Italian-American etc etc"

[Arcanum 5,155]

Actually she spoke about Joanne a lot in her early interviews and she had the tattoo. I think it was a burden in her family for a long time. You don't need tk have 14 fitting tracks to create a concept album. It was a more organic record. No electronic music, no autotune. Actually I dont't understand your point but I respect it.

[ryanripley 86,575]

Just now, JeremiJello said:

so her possessions talk about getting high with john wayne, masturbating and calling people's name out, and telling everybody to be like the godly man in a lab coat? sure jan.

i mean, you're missing the point on purpose  

Joanne had a sexuality so she probably did that, she probably could have had crushes on bad boys, she probably made mistakes but is a good person, she may have experienced a "perfect illusion"

it doesn't have to be 100% true to the bone, it's a concept and i said theorising, meaning it's a possibility gaga wrote the album in that way as well as others

plus gaga has said SO many times she feels she is Joanne/feels Joanne inside her

[ELEMENTALITY 1,298]

5 minutes ago, ryanripley said:

her family can explain what Joanne was like as a person, you see it in 5F2 whilst she visits her grandma and digs through Joanne's possessions

gaga and her family are very close and traditional, she probably heard enough stories over her 30+ years of being alive to have a good idea of who Joanne was as a person

So Jo sat and had a convo with Stef about how his dead sis used to finger herself?

 

 

 

....seems plausible 

[getto 1,552]

1 minute ago, ryanripley said:

i mean, you're missing the point on purpose  

Joanne had a sexuality so she probably did that, she probably could have had crushes on bad boys, she probably made mistakes but is a good person, she may have experienced a "perfect illusion"

it doesn't have to be 100% true to the bone, it's a concept and i said theorising, meaning it's a possibility gaga wrote the album in that way as well as others

plus gaga has said SO many times she feels she is Joanne/feels Joanne inside her

How does she know she feels Joanne? Even her grandmother thinks it's weird.