Macron under fire for Africa comments

[River 129,083]

Maybe he worded himself badly or the translation is bias or just a mess lol

But he's not wrong.

In Israel the orthodox families can have between 7-12 kids, the record now it's 18 (!!) kids. the father is not working and the mother has no time because she's always pregnant and has many kids to raise..

So Those kids are born to be poor, the country is helping them from the taxes that everyone pays except for those families but the kids are still poor, not educated, barely has food on the table..

So you can't have a lot of kids when you actually can't raise them.

This unproportional number of kids per family is cultural, religious and in Africa case, educational imo, problem and it should be addressed asap.

[PartySick 174,825]

5 minutes ago, BLACKOUTbritney said:

Yikes

He's sexy tho so this will all blow over. Imagine if trump said it  

If Trump said it, we'd all have fake expressions of shock before moving on to the next Trump scandal the day after

2 minutes ago, Lady Gagging said:

I'm not going to suggest that it's "civilizational".

What does this even mean?

Like, is he saying it's an issue that's part of African society? 'Cause it's not a problem that's unique to Africa at all. Hell, I personally know quite a few parents my age that have no means of supporting the kids they should've waited to have 

Spoiler

Ew that sounded so judgmental

Maybe it's supposed to though since I just don't understand why people bring mouths that they can't feed into the world  If you're not financially stable and not personally ready to take on the responsibility of raising a kid, you should be doing everything in your power to avoid having a kid. Even if it means abstinence

And the rest of us should help out by doing everything in our power to provide affordable/free contraception and sex education to everyone we can

...but yeah, it's not a uniquely African problem so it's a bit of an ignorant statement if I've understood him correctly 

[Lady Gagging 428]

2 minutes ago, PartySick said:

What does this even mean?

Like, is he saying it's an issue that's part of African society? 'Cause it's not a problem that's unique to Africa at all. Hell, I personally know quite a few parents my age that have no means of supporting the kids they should've waited to have 

I just think that civilizational is a little strong and it has a pretty negative connotation. It could just be a direct translation from French that sounds weird in english idk 

But it definitely isn't unique to Africa at all but I think the main difference between having a lot of children in more-developed countries vs. less-developed countries is that in countries like Africa, families depend on their children as a form of labor. The more children you have, the more efficient your subsistence farm can be. So in a way, an excessive amount of children is an economic problem because families wanted to solve their own economic problems.

 

[Morphine Prince 110,031]

4 minutes ago, Lady Gagging said:

But it definitely isn't unique to Africa at all but I think the main difference between having a lot of children in more-developed countries vs. less-developed countries is that in countries like Africa, families depend on their children as a form of labor. The more children you have, the more efficient your subsistence farm can be. So in a way, an excessive amount of children is an economic problem because families wanted to solve their own economic problems.

 

Yup! 

[River 129,083]

3 minutes ago, PartySick said:

...but yeah, it's not a uniquely African problem so it's a bit of an ignorant statement if I've understood him correctly 

But the subject was Africa.. there's no reason to talk globally when the subject is very specific..

Again, you can't talk about real problems without a backlash and you need to word yourself carefully without doing mistakes (because all the complainers are wording themselves so perfect..) it's kinda tiring.. and at the end, all those who complains now are not helping to the poor and hungry kids in Africa, all they care is how Macron worded himself.. they are doing nothing to solve a problem, unlike Macron who actually doing something (right or wrong doesn't matter)

Overpopulation in Africa is a problem, we can't close ours eyes and act that it's not true because then we would look like the western monsters..

If it was from Trump I would say that yeah it comes from racism.. but Macron? nah..

 

[MJHolland 12,725]

my president shares Reddit posts depicting himself fake-wrestling our news media 

stfu France, cry me a river sis  

[Lion Heart 15,041]

I don't think he worded it correctly, but I see his point. 

[RAMROD 118,156]

Did he lie tho? Why have more than 2 kids when you can not afford it?

These kids need to live, having good nutrition, good shelter, and education. Parents have responsibilities for these things to their kids when they decide to birthed one. And not making them suffer when you know your income are low to feed even yourself.

 

[GypsyBabe 22,836]

He should have avoided using the word civilizational. In the context of the sentence it appears as though he is being ethnocentric, though I do not believe that was his intent. 

When he mentions failed states and complex democratic transitions, I immediately think of western influence in exploiting Africa's resources by funding civil wars and political unrest. The continent of Africa has suffered greatly at the hands of colonization, and it will take an extremely long time to gain any form of stability. I don't see this happening any time soon, because countries, like France, benefit in resources from Africa's lack of political infrastructure. 

He could have chosen his words a bit more carefully. Though factual, the ones he used were laden with negative associations.  

[GypsyBabe 22,836]

I also see that a lot of people are commenting on the amount of children that African families have. 

Firstly lets talk about birth control and condoms. Here, condoms are a negotiation between unequal partners and represent a power struggle. In many African countries, women have little to no control over their bodies and sexuality. In cultures like this, we see an extreme reluctance for women to assert dominance over a sexual act and insist on using birth control because it breaks with gender norms in a society with gender based inequality.

Next is trust. Many Africans in underdeveloped areas are very mistrustful of western influences (rightfully so). Males that I have discussed condom use with believe that they are a way for western societies to make them sterile and control their virility. It also goes into trust between two partners. In many societies, if you are using a condom with your "woman" then you are telling everyone that she is promiscuous, unclean, and not to be trusted.

Finally, education. We have an issue regarding a general understanding of health principles in a continent that is largely uneducated. We have classes the teach us how things work on a cellular level. This is not the case in Africa. STD's etc are not diseases, they are bad luck brought upon them by a jealous neighbor or the universe. Birth control is not widely understood or absorbed by individuals who have a completely different paradigm regarding life. 

It is also important to note that in areas that lack any form of infrastructure, having many children is not seen as being detrimental. There are more children to help with agricultural and childcare needs. And pregnant women feel safer because they are less likely to be the victims of sexual violence. 

So it is not an issue of "they should just stop having so many kids if they can't afford them." It goes deeper than that. 

[Qualle1 1,385]

Yes, the wording might not be perfect but I fully agree with him on this subject. 

[Melech 9,900]

13 hours ago, GypsyBabe said:

I also see that a lot of people are commenting on the amount of children that African families have. 

Firstly lets talk about birth control and condoms. Here, condoms are a negotiation between unequal partners and represent a power struggle. In many African countries, women have little to no control over their bodies and sexuality. In cultures like this, we see an extreme reluctance for women to assert dominance over a sexual act and insist on using birth control because it breaks with gender norms in a society with gender based inequality.

Next is trust. Many Africans in underdeveloped areas are very mistrustful of western influences (rightfully so). Males that I have discussed condom use with believe that they are a way for western societies to make them sterile and control their virility. It also goes into trust between two partners. In many societies, if you are using a condom with your "woman" then you are telling everyone that she is promiscuous, unclean, and not to be trusted.

Finally, education. We have an issue regarding a general understanding of health principles in a continent that is largely uneducated. We have classes the teach us how things work on a cellular level. This is not the case in Africa. STD's etc are not diseases, they are bad luck brought upon them by a jealous neighbor or the universe. Birth control is not widely understood or absorbed by individuals who have a completely different paradigm regarding life. 

It is also important to note that in areas that lack any form of infrastructure, having many children is not seen as being detrimental. There are more children to help with agricultural and childcare needs. And pregnant women feel safer because they are less likely to be the victims of sexual violence. 

So it is not an issue of "they should just stop having so many kids if they can't afford them." It goes deeper than that. 

You also need to Religion into that!

Pentecostal and the Catholic church are growing forces in those place and both preach not to use condoms or having an abortion. I think that plays a factor too.

[GypsyBabe 22,836]

Just now, Simon said:

You also need to Religion into that!

Pentecostal and the Catholic church are growing forces in those place and both preach not to use condoms or having an abortion. I think that plays a factor too.

Yes! Absolutely. I completely forgot to add that. Thank you. 

The continent is being torn apart from all sides and from many different influences. My advisor and friend is from Senegal and she has always said that Africa is both the most blessed and the most cursed place in the world. It is plentiful in resources, but that of course is the reason that it has been controlled, exploited, and destroyed.  

[darkwolf 590]

He's kinda right though ...