Being a Gaga fan is actually the best.

[XoXoJoanneGaga 629]

I think she's a brilliant artist but some of you are overpraising her. This is a woman with insane and broad talent, but she can't control, plan or manage her career for ****. ARTPOP had forty new beginnings and promises, only one happened. Besides her most recent studio time, the last three years have been extremely uncoordinated. Gaga has had her life saved by ten men, did a million team clean-outs and overcame/once again submitted to d--gs/depression countless times, and this was all for what, exactly? Let's take it for what it ACTUALLY IS and admit to ourselves that her mind and plans situationally change and her lack of consistency will always be justified as clever artistry or complex/intricate career planning. It's not always her fault, but God, give some leeway to other people's viewpoints. It actually sickens me that people are blindly praising her and expect others to believe they're being positive and rational just because they claim to be. Gaga is a messy artist that's best when she's coordinated and stellar overall. But God, are the dissapointments (and the fans lucky enough to enjoy them so they can fuel their angel/sophistication complexes by feigning moral superiority by not constructively criticizing so much as a molecule of her existence and are then themselves given blind support because of this 'positivity trumps all' mindset) are annoying. The compromization of positivity and negativity is the only rational thing. Enablement and worship gets us nowhere.

I actually agree with a lot of this  There's certainly nothing wrong with liking everything she does and appreciating her career as it is, but there are fans who seem to have a superiority complex about preferring the messiness, and that she's more ~~real~~ when she's messy, and that they'd be happy if she was a niche artist playing in theatres and it's all part of a magical journey yada yada. It's just so corny and airy-fairy, not to mention inaccurate. And that kind of approach to fandom doesn't lead anywhere interesting. I definitely prefer conversations where fans are matter-of-fact and direct about everything, like acknowledging her mistakes and that she can do better.

 

I've seen plenty of fans, some on this site but many on other sites, who love all of her work but still discuss her career in a straight up way and that it's very messy and far from perfect. Her eras have been mismanaged for years, half of her videos have been rushed and messy, and the albums themselves have been far from perfect with their fair share of questionable songs. Again, I say that as someone who likes pretty much all of this work, but I can still admit that and say it could be way better. Fans like that "understand" Gaga a lot more than the ones who say stuff like "she's only the real her when she's messy". Gaga herself would not agree with that lol, it's not like she wanted her last two eras to pan out the way they did. 

[djBuffoon 12,123]

i dont think that they are trying tosay you cant have an opinion. i think theyre just saying you should respect the different directions she goes in (since she is always changing her sound) and appreciate the ones that you like.

Precisely.

[Sachasuperstar 52]

Absolutely !

[djBuffoon 12,123]

I don't like the idea of being "in the ride" with an artist; I don't understand such personal investment into the life of a celebrity but maybe that's just me

I think you may be misunderstanding. By "enjoy the ride", I mean "chill out and listen."

So we are in agreement.

[djBuffoon 12,123]

So thrilled that most here actually share the same feeling on this. I was losing faith in y'all for a while there. :hug:

[Chic 20,830]

I think she's a brilliant artist but some of you are overpraising her. Okay…how so? Most of what is being said is also being explained with facts. And it’s just our personal opinions. This is a woman with insane and broad talent, but she can't control, plan or manage her career for ****. Good point here. I guess it’s unfortunate that she had so much trouble with her previous management. None of us know what happened, but I’ve read some pretty bad things about Troy from various sources and the way Gaga has avoided even mentioning his name makes it seem as if he was a major part of her issues with her confidence. Obviously not everything is to blame on her management but is everything to blame on Gaga? ARTPOP had forty new beginnings and promises, only one happened. Not sure what you’re referring to here. Please explain further. I can only think of that ridiculous press release that began the era with promises of an app. Besides her most recent studio time, the last three years have been extremely uncoordinated. I’m not sure what aspects of the BTW era were uncoordinated in your opinion, but we can all agree that ARTPOP at many factors working against it, like management, her injury and her mental health (which is absolutely not her fault). Gaga has had her life saved by ten men, wha? And if so, what’s the point here? did a million team clean-outs I can think of  only 4: Laurianne, Niccola, Dada and Troy). Help me out if I'm missing more but I hardly think any of those (except Dada) were in any way unjustified. Not to mention her current team has been around her for just as long as the others and basically just received promotions when they left. It just doesn’t really sound like a total “clean up†to me. and overcame/once again submitted to d--gs/depression countless times are you blaming this on her being weak or something? If there’s anything I’d like you to clear up in your comment, it’s this part. How exactly do you expect us, her fans, to critique for this? Do you want us to create topic on how much of an addict she is? Seems kinda ****ed up to me. Even if we’re just having casual conversations about her missteps – and I hope I don’t sound like I’m coming off morally superior here, it’s just my opinion – we have no place in that discussion to being talking about her personal struggles with addiction and this was all for what, exactly? Seriously. Clear this one up for me. Do you think she had some kind of scheming agenda when fell back into her d--g habits? Let's take it for what it ACTUALLY IS and admit to ourselves that her mind and plans situationally change and her lack of consistency will always be justified as clever artistry or complex/intricate career planning. I’m not sure if there is anyone on this forum who thinks that way. I’ll admit, I’m not here everyday but most of what I see is the exact opposite. For the past two years most of what fans have complained about is her inconsistency. What do I think? I think fans expect her career to have the same trajectory as her contemporaries and I feel like that’s unfair. If you take how many shows she’s performed on tour in the past six years, the number is something like 1 show every 4.5 days. Take that fact and try to imagine how she can also fit in everything she does into her life (writing, recording and producing her albums, rehearsing televised performances, making televised performances, developing music videos, filming music videos, doing photo shoots, doing interviews to accompany said photoshoots, making public appearances, doing charity work / public speeches, meeting with / stopping for fans, being a daughter, being a sister, being a girlfriend) and maybe you’ll see that sticking to plans and following up with promises is kind of hard. I’m sure she wants to do everything she says and tells us about, but it doesn’t seem like her life and career are always going to be flexible for it. The fact is, we are not blindly praising her when we say: she works really, really ****ing hard and that we don’t blame her if she sometimes falls short of our expectations or even her own. Can any of us say we love something and work as hard for it as she does being a pop star? I don't think so but if anyone can, they should share. I have so much love and respect for anyone that passionate about anything. It's not always her fault, but God, give some leeway to other people's viewpoints. Not sure if this is a general statement but if you’re referring to the comments in this thread, I was responding to a fan who thinks its important that the rest of us know they’re not going to buy her next jazz album and that nobody else will either. Pointless, negative **** like that gets on my nerves. Otherwise, I totally agree with you. Having room for everyone’s constructive opinion is important. Last year I tried to shed some light on Gaga’s involvement with Terry Richardson and R. Kelly and many fans tried to insult me or shut me up. It was quite frustrating. It actually sickens me that people are blindly praising her and expect others to believe they're being positive and rational just because they claim to be. Gaga is a messy artist that's best when she's coordinated and stellar overall. But God, are the dissapointments (and the fans lucky enough to enjoy them so they can fuel their angel/sophistication complexes by feigning moral superiority by not constructively criticizing so much as a molecule of her existence and are then themselves given blind support because of this 'positivity trumps all' mindset) are annoying. The main points of this thread’s original post were about her musical talent and her ability as a multifaceted talent… I’m not sure how responding with positivity or defending her from nonconstructive, baseless negativity are just displays of moral superiority. It’s seems pretty random to bring up her issues with addiction, management and organization in a thread that's predicting her longevity because of her musicianship. But if that’s what you want, then mission accomplished. The compromization of positivity and negativity is the only rational thing. Enablement and worship gets us nowhere.  Most of us are here because we see things in her that we love and are important to us. For me, it’s her passion. So I will always defend that aspect of her character and if it comes off as enablement or worship, then I guess I apologize? I doubt Gaga reads this forum anyhow or even listens to anybody but her family, peers and creative team.

Also, I believe no-one who says this isn't blind praise. That's just blind validation to blind praise and nobody's going to take the immense amount of time and fluency to combat your intangible irrationality. Really? It seems like you’re willing too ;) That's why I hate these topics. Positive, blind followers take the higher moral ground so everyone else looks less educated or appreciative Don’t see any comments about education here…And I don't think it’s wrong to point out that those who demand certain things from her are unappreciative, especially when she’s obviously been working pretty hard for 6 years straight. Then of course that isn't the case because they say so and there's no way to disprove it. A forum is a place for constant dialogue, nobody is going to cut you off and the thread isn’t going anywhere if you don’t want it too. And you can prove or disprove anything with facts or articulating your opinion much like you've done with this comment. It sickens me more than people who hate her work. Strange reaction in my opinion but to each their own. Blind love more annoying than blind hate? Shouldn’t they be equally annoying? Hate is pretty rough. It's not positivity, it's complex negativity and borderline egoidm disguised with positive arguments. Well that’s just your opinion. I personally think your assertions and deductions here come off as egotistical too.

 

----------

 

You didn't originally respond directly to me, but seeing as a lot of your commentary relates to my previous comments, I decided to address yours. I actually think we’ve had a big argument before and it wasn’t very pretty. I hope I haven’t been rude and I’m genuinely curious as to why you take this stance, especially in this particular thread.

 

*edit: I am so, so sorry. You really have no idea how much you've written until you submit your post.

I don't even know who you are and I didn't see any of your posts so I don't know how my post applies to you :sweat:

[SpaceAce 1,058]

I actually agree with a lot of this  There's certainly nothing wrong with liking everything she does and appreciating her career as it is, but there are fans who seem to have a superiority complex about preferring the messiness, and that she's more ~~real~~ when she's messy, and that they'd be happy if she was a niche artist playing in theatres and it's all part of a magical journey yada yada. It's just so corny and airy-fairy, not to mention inaccurate. And that kind of approach to fandom doesn't lead anywhere interesting. I definitely prefer conversations where fans are matter-of-fact and direct about everything, like acknowledging her mistakes and that she can do better.

 

I've seen plenty of fans, some on this site but many on other sites, who love all of her work but still discuss her career in a straight up way and that it's very messy and far from perfect. Her eras have been mismanaged for years, half of her videos have been rushed and messy, and the albums themselves have been far from perfect with their fair share of questionable songs. Again, I say that as someone who likes pretty much all of this work, but I can still admit that and say it could be way better. Fans like that "understand" Gaga a lot more than the ones who say stuff like "she's only the real her when she's messy". Gaga herself would not agree with that lol, it's not like she wanted her last two eras to pan out the way they did. 

 

How is it that I agree with your comment (mostly) and not the one that you agree with...? Am I just misreading it?

[RainingOnMe 7,280]

Rihanna doesnt write for ****. 

This. I have absolutely 0 respect and sympathy for those who don't write a single lyric. 

[Pop 4,541]

agreed!

no matter what she does, you know it will be a whirlwind with gaga! love her bravery and art!! MOTHER

[SpaceAce 1,058]

I don't even know who you are and I didn't see any of your posts so I don't know how my post applies to you

 

You were responding to comments in this thread that were in her defense. I simply responded because relates to what I've had to say. I cleared that up in the end? It's okay if you don't want to respond :) I just figured I had to respond because I really disagree with you.

 

Oh and I thought you were the user that got really pissed with me when I argued that jazz standards aren't "just covers". You write the same way as that user.

[Chic 20,830]

You were responding to comments in this thread that were in her defense. I simply responded because relates to what I've had to say. I cleared that up in the end? It's okay if you don't want to respond :) I just figured I had to respond because I really disagree with you.

I'm sorry, I wrote my comment when I was rather upset (and pissed off I had to type it from a Nintendo 3DS...the struggle. I'm not as invested in my argument as I was and didn't read yours for that reason. I hope that doesn't offend you. I don't mind the positivity, I just dislike the borderline egoism. I would have clarified that it wasn't directed at this topic because I don't know the OP personally but these sorts of topics occasionally bother me

[SpaceAce 1,058]

I'm sorry, I wrote my comment when I was rather upset (and pissed off I had to type it from a Nintendo 3DS...the struggle. I'm not as invested in my argument as I was and didn't read yours for that reason. I hope that doesn't offend you. I don't mind the positivity, I just dislike the borderline egoism. I would have clarified that it wasn't directed at this topic because I don't know the OP personally but these sorts of topics occasionally bother me

 

I see your point. I just thought it was quite random. No need to respond to all of that text. I guess I was venting too. lol

[djBuffoon 12,123]

And for those who keep harping on the management issues: I am talking about the music. Y'know, that part that will actually matter in 50 years.

[SpaceAce 1,058]

And for those who keep harping on the management issues: I am talking the music. Y'know, that part that will actually matter in 50 years.

 

I could have saved myself so many words on page 5 using this statement. lol

[Chic 20,830]

I see your point. I just thought it was quite random. No need to respond to all of that text. I guess I was venting too. lol

I will say that the d--g/depression thing was meant to showcase as proof of her general inconsistency rather than something she could control. It shows her lack of control, or anyone's lack of control in the situation and that it acted in ways to cause her fluctuations in plans.