ARTPOP Debate: Is ARTPOP Gaga's best album?

[Benji 20,113]

1. Well, like I said, anything can be a theme. Even if that theme is rotten like you say.

2. Yes her previous albums have great storytelling but ARTPOP also has those. They are just different stories.

3. Because you said that ARTPOP has nothing fresh sounding. And even if you think the songs are messy, it doesn't mean that they are dated.

4. The album has many genres and all the songs explore different sounds.

5. Yeah, but their are things that are more subjective than others. Specially when you are debating.

 

1. Anything isn't a theme

 

2. Nah it doesn't

 

3. They are incredibly dated, a song doesn't have to sound exactly like another to sound dated? The literal production just sounds like it walked out of 2012.

 

4. Is English your first language? I know but it doesn't explore them at any length at all, it simply dips it's little toe into a genre and goes "nah"

 

5. Pretty much everything I've said is pretty subjective, I don't need to add on an "in my opinion" after every single sentance because it's pretty obvious it's in my opinion. Can you produce evidence that proves why someone should like ARTPOP other than "I think it's good?"

[idldte 2]

Cause I just tell you I KNEW u were gonna say it. That's all. 

 

My opinion won't magically change.

[Quark 7,098]

1. Anything isn't a theme

2. Nah it doesn't

3. They are incredibly dated, a song doesn't have to sound exactly like another to sound dated? The literal production just sounds like it walked out of 2012.

4. Is English your first language? I know but it doesn't explore them at any length at all, it simply dips it's little toe into a genre and goes "nah"

5. Pretty much everything I've said is pretty subjective, I don't need to add on an "in my opinion" after every single sentance because it's pretty obvious it's in my opinion. Can you produce evidence that proves why someone should like ARTPOP other than "I think it's good?"

1. How is it not? If I choose to have many meanings and possibilities on purpose than that is a theme in itself.

2. So you think songs like Gypsy don't have a good story?

3. Complextro has never really been mainstream. It was dubstep. And even if you think the song sounds dated, if the song sounds good, it shouldn't matter even if it sounds like the 1940s.

4. So you can't enjoy songs that aren't extremely explored?

5. Like I said some things are more of a fact, while others can be more arguable

[Benji 20,113]

1. How is s it not? If I should have many meanings and possibilities on purpose than that is a theme in itself.

2. So you think songs like Gypsy don't have a good story?

3. Complextro has never really been mainstream. It was dubstep. And even if you think the song sounds dated, if the song sounds good, it shouldn't matter even if it sounds like the 1940s.

4. So you can't enjoy songs that aren't extremely explored?

5. Like I said some things are more of a fact, while others can be more arguable

 

1. Just like the genre issue I've raised though, it's not exploring it's actual meanings and possibilities. You can't say your album means "anything" when it's mediocre pop music attempting to (only very slightly) dabble in other genres. I like the album but pretending it's more than a simple pop album is hilarious, building it up to be this supposed incredible artistic hybrid of genres, art and pop culture makes the album we actually got sound like utter crap.

 

2. We're not talking about the stories? Gypsy's story is literally "I'm lonely, oh look there's someone." which is the same story as thousands of other love songs. The lyrics are average for a Gaga ballad.

 

3. There's a difference between taking samples of an era and sounding like it should have been released in an era. Complextro has never been mainstream (Well Dubstep did have a run in Britain only a few years ago) but that doesn't mean it can't sound dated?

 

4. Yes I can? Although that's the standard of music I expect from Katy or another high profile pop icon. Gaga's music to me has always been a step above but not ARTPOP.

 

5. Why are you attempting to argue though? I made my mind up on the album within a couple of weeks that it sucked in comparison to her previous work. I still kind of like it but you attempting to prove me wrong isn't going to change mine or anyone's feelings towards the album?

[Guest]

Lol y'all don't have to fight about this. Everyone has different tastes and opinions!

 

ARTPOP is my favorite album of hers; actually it's my favorite album ever. Is it up to par with her work on The Fame Monster? Not quite. I still recognize that that's rightfully considered her best album, but that doesn't mean it has to be my favorite. I love ARTPOP and everything about it. I love the fun, carefree, rebellious spirit that it carries with it. It's just a fun record, and it's a damn good one. The entire ARTPOP experience has really impacted and changed my life, even more so than Born This Way did. I'm really thankful for this album and era even if it wasn't her brightest moment.

[Mills 446]

No. Born This Way is. Lyric-wise, vocal-wise, production-wise, branding-wise, and even promotion-wise, BTW as a whole easily comes off as her strongest album to date. It wasn't just a mere collection of songs, it's an album with a clear and cohesive message, which AP lacks. Whether it's through the songs, the tour, or even her non-music-related endeavours such as her own youth empowerment foundation - it's crystal clear what she wanted to say and share. The delivery of her message was effective. And effectiveness is what makes something the "best" in whatever one does. 

[Quark 7,098]

1. Just like the genre issue I've raised though, it's not exploring it's actual meanings and possibilities. You can't say your album means "anything" when it's mediocre pop music attempting to (only very slightly) dabble in other genres. I like the album but pretending it's more than a simple pop album is hilarious, building it up to be this supposed incredible artistic hybrid of genres, art and pop culture makes the album we actually got sound like utter crap.

 

2. We're not talking about the stories? Gypsy's story is literally "I'm lonely, oh look there's someone." which is the same story as thousands of other love songs. The lyrics are average for a Gaga ballad.

 

3. There's a difference between taking samples of an era and sounding like it should have been released in an era. Complextro has never been mainstream (Well Dubstep did have a run in Britain only a few years ago) but that doesn't mean it can't sound dated?

 

4. Yes I can? Although that's the standard of music I expect from Katy or another high profile pop icon. Gaga's music to me has always been a step above but not ARTPOP.

 

5. Why are you attempting to argue though? I made my mind up on the album within a couple of weeks that it sucked in comparison to her previous work. I still kind of like it but you attempting to prove me wrong isn't going to change mine or anyone's feelings towards the album?

1. First you are mixing your points. And the album means anything in the sense that Gaga talked about many different things in her life and in the sense that you could give many of the songs your own meaning. Even if that meaning is that the album is crap.

2. But the lyrics are well written. And even if her story is the same as others, it doesn't mean is not good. Also sometimes simple lyrics are the best.

3. Than how is complextro dated if it was never really mainstream? And again how is being dated a bad thing?

4. Isn't ARTPOP at least somewhat better than those other pop artists?

5. Well, this is a debate so I am debating.

[Benji 20,113]

1. First you are mixing your points. And the album means anything in the sense that Gaga talked about many different things in her life and in the sense that you could give many of the songs your own meaning. Even if that meaning is that the album is crap.

2. But the lyrics are well written. And even if her story is the same as others, it doesn't mean is not good. Also sometimes simple lyrics are the best.

3. Than how is complextro dated if it was never really mainstream? And again how is being dated a bad thing?

4. Isn't ARTPOP at least somewhat better than those other pop artists?

5. Well, this is a debate so I am debating.

1. I was simply bringing it down to your level, if "anything" is a theme, it certainly isn't a good one considering the outcome.

2. They're not

3. A song can sound dated with or without it's genre being in the mainstream? It's a bad thing if your album sounds dated on release, ARTPOP will do well to even sound remotely listenable in ten years, whilst The Fame Monster and Born This Way will probably stand ageing very well.

4. Yes, but that isn't what you were asking? We're talking about Gaga's high standards, not others. You asked if ARTPOP is Gaga's best album, not is ARTPOP better than (insert random other artist's) album or discography.

5. This isn't really a debate though, we're both set in our ways and at the end of this neither one of us is going to change our minds on the album. I've said multiple times across the site (as some members like to point out) that I think the album, for what it is (not this amazing hybrid of EDM, art blah blah blah etc but a very simple pop album), is good. Fans are just really overrating it because it's the latest album.

[Quark 7,098]

1. I was simply bringing it down to your level, if "anything" is a theme, it certainly isn't a good one considering the outcome.

2. They're not

3. A song can sound dated with or without it's genre being in the mainstream? It's a bad thing if your album sounds dated on release, ARTPOP will do well to even sound remotely listenable in ten years, whilst The Fame Monster and Born This Way will probably stand ageing very well.

4. Yes, but that isn't what you were asking? We're talking about Gaga's high standards, not others. You asked if ARTPOP is Gaga's best album, not is ARTPOP better than (insert random other artist's) album or discography.

5. This isn't really a debate though, we're both set in our ways and at the end of this neither one of us is going to change our minds on the album. I've said multiple times across the site (as some members like to point out) that I think the album, for what it is (not this amazing hybrid of EDM, art blah blah blah etc but a very simple pop album), is good. Fans are just really overrating it because it's the latest album.

1. Well, I liked the outcome. But your point here was that anything does not count as a theme but it clearly does. Plus all her previous albums have many themes.

2. But they are for the most part. I mean what is bad lyrically about the song ARTPOP for example?

3. Not necessarily. There are many songs right now that have 70s or 80s sounds and they still sound great today.

4. The only reason I am comparing Gaga to other artists is because you started bringing up other artists like Katy into this.

5. Well, isn't a debate started because there are people with different opinions?

[Benji 20,113]

1. Well, I liked the outcome. But your point here was that anything does not count as a theme but it clearly does. Plus all her previous albums have many themes.

2. But they are for the most part. I mean what is bad lyrically about the song ARTPOP for example?

3. Not necessarily. There are many songs right now that have 70s or 80s sounds and they still sound great today.

4. The only reason I am comparing Gaga to other artists is because you started bringing up other artists like Katy into this.

5. Well, isn't a debate started because there are people with different opinions?

1. It doesn't anything = nothing

2. The entire middle eight is absolutely atrocious.

3. I've already said this there's a difference between an era influencing your sound and making an album that already sounds old does Get Lucky for example sound like it should have been released in a different era than ours?

4. To just mention that I do like the album for what it is if you compare it to other artists? But ok, doesn't back up your point at all but cool

5. Yes but this one isn't going anywhere, you're trying to convince me a mediocre album is something it's not, there's no grey area in this debate. We both like the album but I simply don't agree with you, there's no facts saying why we should like or dislike the album.

It's late here and I'm already on mobile, if I don't respond I have fallen asleep :ARTPOP:

[Ronk 14,762]

Yes.  It's a masterpiece.  When it was released, there were "no fillers", remember?  But fans' opinions of ARTPOP have been influenced by the lies of stans of other artists and my disingenuous critics who have their own agendas.  We should not allow ourselves to be influenced.  Listen to the album again with an open mind and you will hear how amazing it is.

[Stephen 30,423]

For me it is second best behind Born This Way. Both albums have flaws but the high points of BTW are stronger than those of ARTPOP imo. However, I will say ARTPOP is the most fun album :)

[rivingtonreject 2]

I don't think it's bad (it's pretty good), but it's definitely... I don't want to say a step down, but I don't think it was as good as Born This Way. There are certain things about ARTPOP that kind of made it fizzle a bit for me, but I don't know if I want to get nitpicky with it.

Exactly. The things that make make me prefer BTW are very subjective and probably to most people irrelevant, but I like what I like and I like BTW more so that's that.

[Quark 7,098]

1. It doesn't anything = nothing

2. The entire middle eight is absolutely atrocious.

3. I've already said this there's a difference between an era influencing your sound and making an album that already sounds old does Get Lucky for example sound like it should have been released in a different era than ours?

4. To just mention that I do like the album for what it is if you compare it to other artists? But ok, doesn't back up your point at all but cool

5. Yes but this one isn't going anywhere, you're trying to convince me a mediocre album is something it's not, there's no grey area in this debate. We both like the album but I simply don't agree with you, there's no facts saying why we should like or dislike the album.

It's late here and I'm already on mobile, if I don't respond I have fallen asleep :ARTPOP:

1. OK, it seems like we will never agree with this one. I just don't get how anything is the same as nothing

2. No is not because it fits perfectly with the rest of the song.

3. In that case, does Aura sound like any other era?

4. Well, depending on how you respond to my questions that is how I am going to respond too.

5. And your trying to convince me that this is a mediocre album. I understand that you don't think that this is her best album, but I just don't agree with you in that the album is mediocre.

[lugh121 50]

IMO is

 

BTW >TFM > AP > TF