Gaga hills you will die on

[Meruk Holland 2,328]

12 minutes ago, River said:

so explain it to me ms. swift

At least with Mary Jane Holland, it felt more like "it's alright because I am rich as piss" is more facetious. We know how much Gaga agonizes over her parents' opinions of her, and thus, especially during the downward spiral of the bridge, it feels more like a hollow defense for herself (and her behaviors) rather than actually making the claim that being rich is virtuous. And if she feels any dissonance over that contradiction (that being rich excuses her but also she claims she doesn't need money)? Well, she'll just smoke a blunt and become someone else - someone who can't feel dissonant. 

I've always been of the opinion that MJH is not a party song about slipping into a fun persona. It's a rebellious tragedy. She's wanting to escape herself and have a good time as someone else, because she's not having a good time as herself, despite or because of her fame, status, and money. 

 

Donatella does affirm how being rich is aesthetic af tho. 

[Jarvin 1,403]

I love this whole ‘rockism’ versus ‘poptimism’ and even the pro-jazz argumentation. One genre is not better than the other. Disease for instance, listen to the production, it is insane. Many, many layers and very nice harmonies. Jazz isnt automatically better than pop. Its a style difference. There is bland pop and there is bland jazz. Pop just sounds ‘easier’ because its so well produced and clear sounding. Gaga would never dismiss Disease, Bad Romance or Abracadabra… These are all equally amazing. Think of it mike this: if pop music is easier, why are there so little BANGERS as Bad Romance, Abracadabra? Why did it take 16 years for Gaga to come with a ‘ tier to Bad Romance’?  Genres differ, art is art monsters!!!

[SEANGT 5,548]

The sour candy music video is coming next week

[Ladle Ghoulash 33,623]

4 hours ago, Head Empty said:

The Joanne era was not as authentic as it was marketed to be.

Gaga needed a stripped down era after the maximalism of ARTPOP, so she crafted one. What rubs me the wrong way, is that she chose a style that, to this day, does not seem to be part of her actual DNA as an artist. She could've taken many paths that would've been much more believable, especially given the theming of the lyrics:

- a modern piano-based album
- a jazz-infused pop album
- a Springsteen-esque album

To name a few.

Instead she forced her voice to sound 3 decades older, put on a cowboy hat, brushed off her best southern accent and forced one of our mods to repeat "it's not country" for more than 10 years after release.

(I know it's not a country album but she sure as hell leaned in to it)

It looks like she wanted to take a left turn for the sake of it. To go down a route that nobody could predict, just to be contrary. That could be an interesting approach, were it not that the lyrical themes of the album are supposed to be very sincere, tragic and deep-rooted in her history as a person. 

I believe most of these songs on paper. But the production, the marketing and even the fashion made it feel like she was hiding herself more than ever.

Disagreed about Joanne not being connected to her sonic DNA. Americana, southern rock, classic rock, and arena rock have all been a part of her musical DNA at least since BTW (Hair, TEOG, YAI, BTW Country Road) and she used to perform Neil Young’s Out on the Weekend as the intro to Fooled Me Again, as well as citing Springsteen as a formative influence. 
 

However, I do agree that the self-seriousness of the era did a disservice to the music, but I also understand why she did it. The public, unfortunately, is profoundly literal and I think her choosing not to lean into the campiness of doing a country singer-songwriter adjacent confessional era was because she wanted it to be read as being thoroughly sincere because she wanted the GP to see that she was capable of being sincere without a wink-wink nudge-nudge. I agree that it’s limiting, tho, and I wish she didn’t feel like she needed to lean so heavily into it in order to be taken seriously. 
 

IMO one of the most explicitly self-aware moments in the Joanne era is when Gaga takes out her tits on camera in front of Ruth Hogben while describing the “uniform” for Joanne as a way of subliminally indicating “I’m still the provocateur you knew before, this is just what I have to do rn.”

Edited 21 hours ago by Ladle Ghoulash

[Borisapillar 9,784]

She didn’t break her hip

[MountainMonster 1,253]

BTW is not the magnum opus everyone likes to claim it is. And it was truly the beginning of the end of imperial Gaga and the start of people souring on her. It’s also the home of the first flop single of her career (by Gaga standards at the time) in Marry the Night. And it’s ham fisted camp and phony high-art persona led to the mess we got in ARTPOP.

 

[Meruk Holland 2,328]

I say this one after having just made a lengthy defense of my interpretation of one of her songs:

Her lyrics aren't as deep as even she claims them to be. She's great at poetic form, and I think that can hide a dearth of substance when it needs to. It's most noticeable when she talks about certain songs and even she seems to not have a strong grasp on the deeper themes and meaning. 

[River 121,014]

14 minutes ago, Meruk Holland said:

At least with Mary Jane Holland, it felt more like "it's alright because I am rich as piss" is more facetious. We know how much Gaga agonizes over her parents' opinions of her, and thus, especially during the downward spiral of the bridge, it feels more like a hollow defense for herself (and her behaviors) rather than actually making the claim that being rich is virtuous. And if she feels any dissonance over that contradiction (that being rich excuses her but also she claims she doesn't need money)? Well, she'll just smoke a blunt and become someone else - someone who can't feel dissonant. 

I've always been of the opinion that MJH is not a party song about slipping into a fun persona. It's a rebellious tragedy. She's wanting to escape herself and have a good time as someone else, because she's not having a good time as herself, despite or because of her fame, status, and money. 

 

Donatella does affirm how being rich is aesthetic af tho. 

yeah that's make sense actually.

I read it more about "don't worry about me, at the end I'm rich so I can fix any damage".. like similar to Amy's Rehab vibe, so it's more a sudden epiphany that she's addicted, but then she's igniting the flame and all the rush of the good feeling is back again.

[Ladle Ghoulash 33,623]

7 minutes ago, MountainMonster said:

BTW is not the magnum opus everyone likes to claim it is. And it was truly the beginning of the end of imperial Gaga and the start of people souring on her. It’s also the home of the first flop single of her career (by Gaga standards at the time) in Marry the Night. And it’s ham fisted camp and phony high-art persona led to the mess we got in ARTPOP.

 

Disagreed about BTW leading to the pomposity of ARTPOP because I think that was more a consequence of her getting defensive about the industry and commercial backlash to BTW than it was about the content of the album itself. Also just because the GP didn’t appreciate it doesn’t mean it isn’t good lol. It’s actually the album that seems to have gotten the most significant commercial and critical reappraisal, which I think actually reveals that the album was both more influential and was more ahead of its time than folks realized at the time.

Edited 22 hours ago by Ladle Ghoulash

[Togekiss 2,612]

I’m sure this is obvious to us all here, but I can’t tell you how many times I’ve gone on a Reddit tirade explaining that the concept of “Born This Way” HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HAVING PLASTIC SURGERY OR NOT

[Ladle Ghoulash 33,623]

5 minutes ago, Togekiss said:

I’m sure this is obvious to us all here, but I can’t tell you how many times I’ve gone on a Reddit tirade explaining that the concept of “Born This Way” HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HAVING PLASTIC SURGERY OR NOT

In the video, she literally lays out that the concept of being “born this way” is both literal and figurative: it’s being able to accept the hand you’ve been dealt while simultaneously acknowledging your agency in creating your own identity. People are dense asf, I swear 

[NUTELLA 16,619]

14 minutes ago, Meruk Holland said:

Her lyrics aren't as deep as even she claims them to be. She's great at poetic form, and I think that can hide a dearth of substance when it needs to. It's most noticeable when she talks about certain songs and even she seems to not have a strong grasp on the deeper themes and meaning.

"This song is about celebrating the healing process of celebration through healing & embracing the healing power of celebration, because it helped me heal & I celebrate that"

[Chromanne 2,085]

4 hours ago, PartySick said:

It's not the era that drags it down, it's the album itself that's just not great imo.

As I nodded to in the OP, every other album, even her jazz albums with Tony, take you through a myriad of sounds while the album that's ironically named "Chromatica" is the same sound from beginning to end. The lyricism isn't up to her standard either.

When she says she wasn't in a good place creatively, I believe it, 'cause it shows  

But the concepts were cool. If she revisited the album now, worked on it with anyone other than Bloodclot, and rewrote some lyrics (and finished writing certain songs like the snippet of Alice that made the album ) it'd be good  

 

But sh*t, some people would say the same thing about my personal favorite (Joanne). None of us are an authority on this, not even Gaga  

Yeah I understand why Chromatica is not her best work. Usually Gaga experiments with different kinds of sounds within the same album, but Chromatica is her most sonically cohesive and polished album. Almost all the songs strictly adhere to house music, whereas only a handful of songs like Stupid Love, 911, and Replay were sonically unique from the rest of the songs.

Little monsters may not have been used to this but most popular artists release most of their albums like this and resonate well with the GP. The album was also critically acclaimed because of its cohesiveness which was one of the "criticism" of ARTPOP. 

I do appreciate Chromatica as an incredible album for what it is and I always love revisiting this album, but it really shows that she wasn't in a good place and she also didn't involve much in the production of the album which might have kept away from the experimenting diverse and multiple genres which she usually did in her previous albums.

Edited 22 hours ago by Chromanne

[Starmie25 20,545]

5 hours ago, PartySick said:

95% of Monsters don't know how to recognize a genre  

It's more the rabid, online fans, so I'd say about 70% 

It is strange though because Gaga really isn't your typical popstar, despite what many have said. Her first few albums were quite industrial sounding, electro pop and even techno-ish. It was very in your face too, especially on ARTPOP and BTW@HotLikeMexico

Edited 22 hours ago by Starmie25

[Bronco 15,965]

1 hour ago, gagzus said:

The thing is though, with the exception of a handful of songs made by DJs (which wouldn’t have been remotely successful without Gaga making dance music popular again btw) none of the “dance” songs on the radio were actual EDM though, where as ARTPOP was. Nothing on radio was close to songs like Mary Jane Holland, Sex Dreams, MANiCURE, Aura even GUY was nothing like the singles Zedd had on the radio because he had dance-pop singles but EDM album tracks.

I can't tell what point you're trying to make in relation to mine. 

But having hit the clubs the year ARTPOP came out and been addicted to the Big Top 40 radio show. I definitely remember EDM tracks like Martin Garrix doing very well at the exact same time Gaga dropped ARTPOP. So EDM was definitely on the radio. Hell, Annie Mac was still a mainstay on Radio 1 at the time.