Kazakhstan Bans Face Coverings, Muslim Women Asked To Embrace National Style

[SHALLOW 16,469]

28 minutes ago, ALGAYDO said:

Yes, I 100% support women to do what they want with their bodies. If they feel the need to cover their entire face because that’s what they wish to do (e.g. because it’s their own personal religious beliefs) then yes, idk why anyone would want the opposite for them? You’re basically advocating for forcing women to do with their bodies what YOU want them to do. 

Nah. Those women have internalized values that go against their humanity and dignity.

It's like a man with internalized homophobia who thinks he must be straight and have a family because anything else is wrong. They believe it's the right thing but they've just been brainwashed.

Remember that at the end of the day all religions have been created by men, who in fact have always had a lot of interest in keeping women down. It's important to deconstruct religions and not only accept them just cause "you want to accept everyone". There are things which are just wrong and we shoild be able to see that and speak about it. I criticize these practices just as much as i criticize Christianity. There's nothing wrong with that and whoever made you think that is wrong.

[Oriane 22,778]

1 hour ago, A Fried Egg said:

We always criticize Christianity but not Islam? At the root of it all it’s the same. The face covering is meant to suppress women and has almost nothing to do with being prude. It’s a practice concocted by men in power who wanted to treat women like property since medieval times (and perhaps it was necessary back then for political stability? Powerful men making harems is not uncommon, think Chinese and Greek concubines.). It signifies that women should keep their mouths shut and obey.

I grew up around Muslims and an independent woman is an unthinkable and dangerous prospect. 

Do you think I sound cynical? I consider myself rather conservative but I’ve never supported women having their faces hidden. You gays should know what it’s like to hide our selves from the public and pretend we’re straight.

 

And incase you’re not convinced. Look at what happened to Iran before and after the 1979 Islamic revolution: 

Women were attending universities in the 70s, and in 2024, the morality police beat them for dancing in public. You can look it all up. 

The problem is that laws like this will only punish the women in question, not the men enforcing this culture. Freedom can't be achieved with restriction.

[PartySick 172,545]

1 hour ago, A Fried Egg said:

We always criticize Christianity but not Islam? At the root of it all it’s the same. The face covering is meant to suppress women and has almost nothing to do with being prude. It’s a practice concocted by men in power who wanted to treat women like property since medieval times (and perhaps it was necessary back then for political stability? Powerful men making harems is not uncommon, think Chinese and Greek concubines.). It signifies that women should keep their mouths shut and obey.

I grew up around Muslims and an independent woman is an unthinkable and dangerous prospect. 

Do you think I sound cynical? I consider myself rather conservative but I’ve never supported women having their faces hidden. You gays should know what it’s like to hide our selves from the public and pretend we’re straight.

 

And incase you’re not convinced. Look at what happened to Iran before and after the 1979 Islamic revolution: 

Women were attending universities in the 70s, and in 2024, the morality police beat them for dancing in public. You can look it all up. 

 

1 hour ago, PopMusicForever said:

So ur ok with women being covered their whole face? What the ****?

Y'all are absolutely missing the point of why this is outrageous

Restricting religious freedom, something as simple as a head dress, in the interest of collecting a government owned data bank of citizens' faces for facial recognition technology and to enforce some weird insistence on a "national style" as opposed to individual expression of beliefs or customs

 

All religion is gross but if you're truly suggesting it's totally cool to fine people for wearing a religious garment, you've lost the plot on what freedom is supposed to mean

Make laws against hate crimes, make laws protecting women that decide to not take part in Islamic customs despite living in largely Muslim areas, but telling people they can't wear what they wanna wear is nuts

[Gabi001 2,470]

I wonder if all people here fighting for "women's right" to be covered in cloth are also fighting for womam circumcision, as it is also a religious and cultural belief and women from some cultures are socially pressured by their religion into doing it, same as islam is socially pressuring covering the face

[SHALLOW 16,469]

1 minute ago, Oriane said:

The problem is that laws like this will only punish the women in question, not the men enforcing this culture. Freedom can't be achieved with restriction.

I think they'll get used to it and women who want to keep practicing that are probably too far gone.

Something has to be done to give dignity to women who deserve it even if it looks like an obligation at first.

There's nothing negative that could come from this so while they're forced to do this, it's really nothing that can really hurt them. Instead, they'll probably realize in time that they actually enjoy it.

Just now, PartySick said:

 

Y'all are absolutely missing the point of why this is outrageous

Restricting religious freedom, something as simple as a head dress, in the interest of collecting a government owned data bank of citizens' faces for facial recognition technology and to enforce some weird insistence on a "national style" as opposed to individual expression of beliefs or customs

 

All religion is gross but if you're truly suggesting it's totally cool to fine people for wearing a religious garment, you've lost the plot on what freedom is supposed to mean

Make laws against hate crimes, make laws protecting women that decide to not take part in Islamic customs despite living in largely Muslim areas, but telling people they can't wear what they wanna wear is nuts

Party, i get your point, but when i think how much damage religion has made and keeps making. I just think these kinds of law can't do anything but result in a positive outcome longterm.

It is forced but I'm sure they will understand life is much better when you're not covered 24/7.

You can either be pro women or pro religion in this case. I get that it's a strong statement from me but that's what i think

[River 127,497]

I honestly really don’t give a f-ck, I will not fight for homophobic people anymore, they are not the victims in this story, they are just another oppressors.

[PartySick 172,545]

7 minutes ago, SHALLOW said:

Party, i get your point, but when i think how much damage religion has made and keeps making. I just think these kinds of law can't do anything but result in a positive outcome longterm.

It is forced but I'm sure they will understand life is much better when you're not covered 24/7.

You can either be pro women or pro religion in this case. I get that it's a strong statement from me but that's what i think

Trust, I hate religion with a passion

I just don't think replacing religious tyranny with government tyranny is the right move

[RaveMonster 613]

1 hour ago, PopMusicForever said:

It’s getting tiring when Christianity gets all the **** from the liberal western people but not Islam when Islam is 1000 times worse when it comes to human rights and everything else.

As queer people respecting Islam in any way or shape in my opinion is degrading yourself to the worst point. It is worse than Christianism by far and its believers are the worse and bunch of ignorants who will do anything to spread their religion in every corner.

im Muslim technically and in no shape or form I respect it. Seeing it close by it is by far way worse than any other religion.

I hate religion as much as the next person but forcing people to leave their religion is very problematic. Regardless of your religious trauma this is obviously a form of fascism.
There are way better ways to promote women’s rights within religious groups other than this. Letting governments do this is what causes authoritarianism and they will come for your rights next. The only thing I can agree with in this scenario is that if security needs to identify you then your religion shouldn’t protect you from identifying yourself but that’s about it, everything else is a clear threat to freedom in general 

[RaveMonster 613]

10 minutes ago, Gabi001 said:

I wonder if all people here fighting for "women's right" to be covered in cloth are also fighting for womam circumcision, as it is also a religious and cultural belief and women from some cultures are socially pressured by their religion into doing it, same as islam is socially pressuring covering the face

Those things are clearly not the same. You can’t compare mutilation to wearing a piece of  fabric everyday. Let’s just think critically for a minute.

I also don’t think Mormons should go through all the stuff they go through but I don’t believe the government should interfere and force them to watch tv and drink coffee. There’s clearly a fine line between promoting freedom and forcing someone out of their beliefs. 

[gumzy3000 7,901]

There are some women that choose to cover their face by their own choice. Why should the government have a say in that? Stop dictating what women wear based on your morals. Just let them be and give them the freedom to figure it out themselves. Yes, I can acknowledge I find it weird when I see it but I’m not going to stop them from practicing their religion because it makes me uncomfortable. Most of them go about their lives and never ever bother anyone around them. 

[PartySick 172,545]

16 minutes ago, Gabi001 said:

I wonder if all people here fighting for "women's right" to be covered in cloth are also fighting for womam circumcision, as it is also a religious and cultural belief and women from some cultures are socially pressured by their religion into doing it, same as islam is socially pressuring covering the face

"I wonder if people believing women should legally be allowed to wear a headdress also support women having their genitals mutilated. They're basically the same thing!"

Like. I have to wonder if y'all hear yourselves sometimes  

[PartySick 172,545]

11 minutes ago, RaveMonster said:

I hate religion as much as the next person but forcing people to leave their religion is very problematic. Regardless of your religious trauma this is obviously a form of fascism.
There are way better ways to promote women’s rights within religious groups other than this. Letting governments do this is what causes authoritarianism and they will come for your rights next. The only thing I can agree with in this scenario is that if security needs to identify you then your religion shouldn’t protect you from identifying yourself but that’s about it, everything else is a clear threat to freedom in general 

 

3 minutes ago, gumzy3000 said:

There are some women that choose to cover their face by their own choice. Why should the government have a say in that? Stop dictating what women wear based on your morals. Just let them be and give them the freedom to figure it out themselves. Yes, I can acknowledge I find it weird when I see it but I’m not going to stop them from practicing their religion because it makes me uncomfortable. Most of them go about their lives and never ever bother anyone around them. 

There are ways to coax people out of religion. Education, discrimination protections being enshrined in law, expanding communities beyond the family unit.

The government making a law dictating what people can and can't wear or what they can or can't believe and pretending it's for "security" is a huge red flag and it's unfortunate that others can't see that.

[River 127,497]

Kazakhstan is a country with Muslim majority, you gays should see it as a progress.

I feel like people who comes from Christian countries where the oppression on women and what they wear and were their place in the world is doesn't exist, don't understand how these laws are actually liberating women, even if their reasons are bad.

Judaism is as oppressive as Islam, orthodox women needs to wear a wig or cover their faces, to wear long clothes, all this and all that, like just imagine yourself covering all your body during the current heat wave please.

 

Ya'll gay men fighting for women for their "right" to be oppressed, are much worst than the muslim man who wears chill clothes near his covered wife on a summer day, take a seat and let women fight for themselves.

[Horny Chicken 10,935]

Politics isn’t black and white and we all have to pick our fights. At the very least, in a democratic society everybody gets a vote.  

But you can be sure those rights will be gone once that religion grows large enough and takes over the law, which is what those of us who grew up around it witnessed. Please don’t take your freedom for granted.

[PartySick 172,545]

1 hour ago, River said:

Ya'll gay men fighting for women for their "right" to be oppressed, are much worst than the muslim man who wears chill clothes near his covered wife on a summer day, take a seat and let women fight for themselves.

And y'all gay men that assume a woman that chooses to embrace her culture and religion must be oppressed and unable to think or act for herself so she needs the government to forbid her from wearing a headdress to liberate her should also take a seat