2024 US Election Results Discussion Thread

[phantasmas 12,376]

12 minutes ago, Hennycomb said:

 

 

Well, I have to retract, I actually don't know how many countries it is mandatory, but he in Brazil it is and it works. If you're 16-17 years old it's optional, 18-70 it's mandatory and 70+ is optional. If you don't want to vote you have to show up to the polls anyway and hit null or blank, but if you don't show up you have to justify, and if you don't justify you have to pay a fine of around R$3,50 (less than one dollar).

We have a population of 216 million people and on the last presidential election 156 million people had to vote and 126 million showed up. Around 5,4 million votes were blank and around 32 million people didn't show up (which was a record number given the Lula vs. Bolsonaro scenario).

This makes sure that more people participate and makes elections more balanced, with a lot of parties being able to get elected officials.

Another thing that avoids a two-party scenario is that companies are prohibited from donating to politicians campaigns, it's an electoral crime, only people can donate and it needs to be up to only 10% of their income declared to the Brazilian "IRS" the previous year. This avoids an unbalanced funding of campaigns and makes the 29 political parties to be able to elect officials across the Federal Senate, Chamber of Deputies and National Congress, mixing up the government with a lot of different views and make people feel represented on what they want.

We also have a Superior Electoral Court that makes the elections rules and deals with election crimes. Of course it's not paradise and we have LOTS of problems but it's a system that tries to be just and tries to engage the whole population to participate in democracy. Nobody complains about it being mandatory and the ones that want to abstain have the choice to do so with the blank vote.

i want all of this here in the US so bad 

[faysalaaa 5,336]

16 minutes ago, Hennycomb said:

 

 

Well, I have to retract, I actually don't know how many countries it is mandatory, that was dumb of me for saying that.

But here in Brazil it is and it works. If you're 16-17 years old it's optional, 18-70 it's mandatory and 70+ is optional. If you don't want to vote you have to show up to the polls anyway and hit null or blank, but if you don't show up you have to justify, and if you don't justify you have to pay a fine of around R$3,50 (less than one dollar).

We have a population of 216 million people and on the last presidential election 156 million people had to vote and 126 million showed up. Around 5,4 million votes were blank and around 30 million people didn't show up (which was a record number given the Lula vs. Bolsonaro scenario).

This makes sure that more people participate and makes elections more balanced, with a lot of parties being able to get elected officials.

Another thing that avoids a two-party scenario is that companies are prohibited from donating to politicians campaigns, it's an electoral crime, only people can donate and it needs to be up to only 10% of their income declared to the Brazilian "IRS" the previous year. This avoids an unbalanced funding of campaigns and makes the 29 political parties to be able to elect officials across the Federal Senate, Chamber of Deputies and National Congress, mixing up the government with a lot of different views and make people feel represented on what they want.

We also have a Superior Electoral Court that makes the elections rules and deals with election crimes. Of course it's not paradise and we have LOTS of problems but it's a system that tries to be just and tries to engage the whole population to participate in democracy. Nobody complains about it being mandatory and the ones that want to abstain have the choice to do so with the blank vote.

Edit: oh, and Brazilians who live in other countries are also obligated to vote and they go to the Brazilian consulate to do that, and they do it willingly and happily.

No matter how you try to explain it in a positive light, its still dictatorship to forcing people to engage in Democracy. There are positive and negative things about dictatorships, and you just explained the positive side of it. Its not a Democracy if you force people to engage in Democracy, choose one or the other. 

[sarahb 17,189]

3 minutes ago, faysalaaa said:

No matter how you try to explain it in a positive light, its still dictatorship to forcing people to engage in Democracy. There are positive and negative things about dictatorships, and you just explained the positive side of it. Its not a Democracy if you force people to engage in Democracy, choose one or the other. 

I'd rather be in a 'dictatorship' with mandatory voting than hear "go vote!" all the bloody time with more focus on getting people to the polls than policies. 

No one in Australia is suffering from mandatory voting. If we don't wanna vote we can just draw a **** on the ballot paper instead. 

[Pink Eye 4,478]

17 minutes ago, faysalaaa said:

No matter how you try to explain it in a positive light, its still dictatorship to forcing people to engage in Democracy. There are positive and negative things about dictatorships, and you just explained the positive side of it. Its not a Democracy if you force people to engage in Democracy, choose one or the other. 

Calling Brazil a dictatorship for mandatory voting is CRAZY. The fine is less than a dollar and there is like NO CONSEQUENCE if you don't show up. People really engage and they don't complain about doing it. Like, it's not an issue over here.

We had a military dictatorship from 1964 till 1985 that was backed by the U.S because of oil extraction laws they wanted to change to benefit american oil companies. The military tortured people, didn't hold elections, censorship was in full effect, people couldn't express their opinion, artists work were always analysed by the military, a lot of people were killed accused of being communists, and with lots of exiled people. 

The country made demonstrations BEGGING for elections with mandatory voting to be back and democracy restored. That dictatorship is a pain in our history until this day and we are very happy to participate in democracy. 

Don't you dare call us a dictatorship for having mandatory voting.

 

And I won't paste the images of people being executed by hanging here because they're too strong.

THIS is a dictatorship. We are happy with our mandatory vote and will continue to be.

Edit: our former president Dilma Roussef was jailed during the dictatorship and tortured. Common torturing methods were making the person wet and electrocuting them, inserting rats and cockroaches through their orifices, beating them up until they were dead. 

Sorry for the nasty tone but I got a little offended.

[faysalaaa 5,336]

1 minute ago, sarahb said:

I'd rather be in a 'dictatorship' with mandatory voting than hear "go vote!" all the bloody time with more focus on getting people to the polls than policies. 

No one in Australia is suffering from mandatory voting. If we don't wanna vote we can just draw a **** on the ballot paper instead. 

Its fine if you prefer Dictatorships, just dont advocate for a Dictatorship while calling it a Democracy, be honest about what your advocating for.

If you want people to vote and participate in Democracy, the system should create incentives to get peoples votes, and make people trust in the system. But forcing people to vote wont change anything! The American system refuses to change, and this is why we have Trump, he and his voters are the outcome of the bad system.

[faysalaaa 5,336]

7 minutes ago, Hennycomb said:

Calling Brazil a dictatorship for mandatory voting is CRAZY. The fine is less than a dollar and there is like NO CONSEQUENCE if you don't show up. People really engage and they don't complain about doing it. Like, it's not an issue over here.

We had a military dictatorship from 1964 till 1985 that was backed by the U.S because of oil extraction laws they wanted to change to benefit american oil companies. The military tortured people, didn't hold elections, censorship was in full effect, people couldn't express their opinion, artists work were always analysed by the military, a lot of people were killed accused of being communists, and with lots of exiled people. 

The country made demonstrations BEGGING for elections with mandatory voting to be back and democracy restored. That dictatorship is a pain in our history until this day and we are very happy to participate in democracy. 

Don't you dare call us a dictatorship for having mandatory voting.

 

And I won't paste the images of people being executed by hanging here because they're too strong.

THIS is a dictatorship. We are happy with our mandatory vote and will continue to be.

Edit: our former president Dilma Roussef was jailed during the dictatorship and tortured. Common torturing methods were making the person wet and electrocuting them, inserting rats and cockroaches through their orifices, beating them up until they were dead. 

Sorry for the nasty tone but I got a little offended.

I did not call Brazil a dictatorship, I called the action of forcing people to vote is dictatorship.

Almost all countries have some dictatorship laws, but it doesnt make the country a dictatorship.

It doesnt matter if people arent complaining, or if its a small fine, its about the principle of it.

[Pink Eye 4,478]

4 minutes ago, faysalaaa said:

I did not call Brazil a dictatorship, I called the action of forcing people to vote is dictatorship.

Almost all countries have some dictatorship laws, but it doesnt make the country a dictatorship.

It doesnt matter if people arent complaining, or if its a small fine, its about the principle of it.

We are obliged to vaccinate, also. We have to show our vaccination cards to enroll in schools, women are obliged to vaccinate for rubella to enter college. And every 18 year old male HAS to enlist to the army. If you wanna add that to your list. 

[faysalaaa 5,336]

4 minutes ago, Hennycomb said:

We are obliged to vaccinate, also. We have to show our vaccination cards to enroll in schools, women are obliged to vaccinate for rubella to enter college. And every 18 year old male HAS to enlist to the army. If you wanna add that to your list. 

I would argue that some dictatorship laws are a necessary evil that we cant get rid of, and an example of that would be vaccines or taxes. 

But forcing people to join the military is not a necessary evil we cant get rid of, we can easily live without mandatory military and still have a functional country. And same applies to forcing people to vote.

But we cant live without taxes or vaccines..

[Pink Eye 4,478]

5 minutes ago, faysalaaa said:

I would argue that some dictatorship laws are a necessary evil that we cant get rid of, and an example of that would be vaccines or taxes. 

But forcing people to join the military is not a necessary evil we cant get rid of, we can easily live without mandatory military and still have a functional country. And same applies to forcing people to vote.

But we cant live without taxes or vaccines..

I agree with you on the military stuff. But the last war we participated was WW2 and the majority of people who are chosen to serve the military are the ones who want to. Our military works more on border patrol and aiding in national disasters. We don't really fear it THAT much. (I did as a gay man, I was mortified to be chosen to serve for a year)

But I agree that that law is outdated and should cease to exist.

[faysalaaa 5,336]

2 minutes ago, Hennycomb said:

I agree with you on the military stuff. But the last war we participated was WW2 and the majority of people who are chosen to serve the military are the ones who want to. But I agree that that law is outdated and should cease to exist.

I just want to make it clear im not disrespecting or speaking against your country, im speaking in general in a philosophical way.

[Pink Eye 4,478]

Just now, faysalaaa said:

I just want to make it clear im not speaking or disrespecting your country, im speaking about this in a philosophical general way.

I understand what you mean, it's just that the word is triggering 

[Pink Eye 4,478]

55 minutes ago, phantasmas said:

i want all of this here in the US so bad 

Rooting for an election reform for you guys  (and it's for us too cause it also influences the rest of the world )

[artd0me 841]

I have a question, since I am not too familiar with the US system:

What I saw in the media was, that there are of course Republicans that do not want Trump.
Is it possible that some (or even enough) republicans in the Electoral College will not elect Trump?

[Morphine Prince 109,683]

5 hours ago, artd0me said:

I have a question, since I am not too familiar with the US system:

What I saw in the media was, that there are of course Republicans that do not want Trump.
Is it possible that some (or even enough) republicans in the Electoral College will not elect Trump?

Not likely at all. Plus his total will be way above 270. Nothing will make a difference.

[Lucas 31,135]

So is anyone still sick to their stomach from this? Because I am, I barely ate anything for like 1 week because of the stress before and the loss of faith in humanity after.