Was Joanne Ahead of Its Time, too?

[River 98,275]

It was ahead, somewhere, lost.

[lilboyblue 2,301]

I think it was of its time. Just the promo for that was weird. It definitely should have been A-YO that carried the album. I mean, I remember how "mirror on the ceiling" would trend whenever she performed it on TV, but they just let it die. She was also coming from ARTPOP and she had one shot to re-introduce herself to mainstream with the lead.

My hot take is that a combination of A-YO > Diamond Heart > Million Reasons would have done well as singles. And they really should have tried to do something with some of the other songs, like maybe put Hey Girl or Grigio Girls on a commercial or TV show.

[NATAH 36,170]

i mean... the album really wasn't that heavily folk/country/rock, it was more pop mixed in with those genres and it was still relatively safe

compare it to Cowboy Carter, an actual country album that fully went for it... if Joanne was that bold then it would fair to credit it for being trend setting but it's a pretty safe album in comparison

[KevinWright 1,307]

Joanne was more ahead of the time than ARTPOP was 

[lilboyblue 2,301]

20 minutes ago, NATAH said:

i mean... the album really wasn't that heavily folk/country/rock, it was more pop mixed in with those genres and it was still relatively safe

compare it to Cowboy Carter, an actual country album that fully went for it... if Joanne was that bold then it would fair to credit it for being trend setting but it's a pretty safe album in comparison

I don't think Cowboy Carter is a straight up country album. Beyonce's singing alone moves the needle towards R&B. And to be fair, I think it's more acceptable/safer now for artists to do complete 180s than before. People are more used to this kind of genre-bending experimentation now.

Not saying Gaga is the blueprint, or that Joanne was some mind-blowing album, but I disagree with the opinion that it was safe. Especially for Gaga who was trying to rebuild her stature in pop music back then.

Plus, the fact that Joanne was part of a string of artistic explorations that eventually led to A Star Is Born acclaim makes pop artists be more comfortable doing it now.

Edited July 13 by lilboyblue

[NATAH 36,170]

4 minutes ago, lilboyblue said:

I don't think Cowboy Carter is a straight up country album. Beyonce's singing alone moves the needle towards R&B. And to be fair, I think it's more acceptable/safer now for artists to do complete 180s than before. People are more used to this kind of genre-bending experimentation now.

Not saying Gaga is the blueprint, or that Joanne was some mind-blowing album, but I disagree with the opinion that it was safe. Especially Gaga coming from ARTPOP.

Plus, the fact that Joanne was part of a string of artistic explorations that eventually led to A Star Is Born acclaim makes pop artists be more comfortable doing it.

but between ARTPOP and joanne she had spent a LOT of time repairing her image with C2C, her tribute era and showcasing her talent so honestly, yeah it was kinda safe imo

if joanne had come instantly after ARTPOP then that would have been risky

[lilboyblue 2,301]

3 minutes ago, NATAH said:

but between ARTPOP and joanne she had spent a LOT of time repairing her image with C2C, her tribute era and showcasing her talent so honestly, yeah it was kinda safe imo

if joanne had come instantly after ARTPOP then that would have been risky

Well, that is true. Our girl really worked her as* off to get the industry on her side. I respect that point of view.

I just think it was still very much risky for Joanne to be her return to pop. Like, even Perfect Illusion, while still dance-pop, was leaning very heavily into rock, and it did turn a lot of people away. And there's nothing in the album you can classify as easily digestible pop. I think why it frustrates a lot of fans to this day.

I'm a Joanne truther, what can I say. 

[RenegAde 16,687]

1 hour ago, NATAH said:

i mean... the album really wasn't that heavily folk/country/rock, it was more pop mixed in with those genres and it was still relatively safe

compare it to Cowboy Carter, an actual country album that fully went for it... if Joanne was that bold then it would fair to credit it for being trend setting but it's a pretty safe album in comparison

In this sense then Cowboy Carter still plays is "safe" by heavily incorporating genres like hip pop, R&B and even pop.

Cowboy carter is a country album that incorporates several genres, Joanne is a pop album that incorporates several genres. I feel both these albums fall in the realm of genre ambiguity and the only thing that sets them apart and gave CC a more favourable reception really comes down to CC's polished production,  having better collection of songs and stellar finishing.

Neither of these albums are "safe" and both Gaga and Beyonce should be given credit for taking their sound to unfamiliar territories. Gaga especially for taking that leap in 2016 when trap and pop were dominating the charts. Yes Joanne is a pop album but no one was releasing that Kind of pop. perfect illusion alone stuck out like a sour thumb on the radio.

Although i agree that I wish Gaga was more bold with joanne but more in the sense of being unapologetic about her work. I feel like when it got mixed reactions  she got very discouraged and scared. I mean even chain smokers who turned out to be one hit wonders were talking smack about her unwarranted.

 

Edited July 13 by RenegAde

[Nathaniel Arven 1,376]

i wouldn't say ahead of it's time since it's not gender bending enough to create something completely new and futuristic. Though I think it's deeply misunderstood, underrated, unappreciated enough for what it is. Mature. 

[chromaticainmyhead 5,759]

Retrospectively it's just another "personal" album like the ones in any other mega stars' career. There was no way she had met commercial success with another electronic music album in 2016. Joanne was here to let a lot of the masquerades fall that she built up over the years, musically it definitely influenced other musicians by going country but I guess it mainly was here to save her career and less about the music itself

[NATAH 36,170]

4 hours ago, lilboyblue said:

Well, that is true. Our girl really worked her as* off to get the industry on her side. I respect that point of view.

I just think it was still very much risky for Joanne to be her return to pop. Like, even Perfect Illusion, while still dance-pop, was leaning very heavily into rock, and it did turn a lot of people away. And there's nothing in the album you can classify as easily digestible pop. I think why it frustrates a lot of fans to this day.

I'm a Joanne truther, what can I say. 

i guess for the core fanbase who were looking forward to what came next after ARTPOP then yeah, it was risky there (but i guess that helped cull a lot of immature fans lol)

i was a joanne truther back in the day, i still like the album but overtime, i really wished she had pushed the rock/folk further on some tracks

[Juanjo 1,424]

11 hours ago, Nessun Dorma said:

I love Joanne! And whoever finds it hard to acknowledge this masterpiece has a major inability to appreciate good music 

Was it innovative by the standards of its time though? I don’t think so. It was sure innovative for Gaga. Contrary to what some people say, she didn’t play it safe and delivered a totally different sound from her past works. 

I consider it mainly a folk rock album with strong country, jazz and R&B elements. And the road that led to Joanne was already paved a long time before. I can mention Fleetwood Mac, Paul Simon, Bod Dylan, Joni Mitchell and Cat Stevens as examples of folk rock true pioneers. 

Sorry about the confusion, I wasn’t speaking ahead of the game in terms of innovation, I was talking about trends in music at the time. I am fully aware that she didn’t invent or revolutionize rock-acoustic, cottagecore sounds. Lol

When Joanne was released, the sound of mainstream pop was very different than what she gave us. Same with Gaga’s debut, no one was doing dance, electronic pop. However, with Just Dance and The Fame, she was both extremely successful AND a trend-setter. I want this for LG7, so bad! 

[Versace 7,558]

I think the only album of hers ahead of its time is BTW. It finding relevance and having its songs go viral with an entirely new gen kinda proves that. At its release sure it did well but that was cause she was at her peak post TF/TFM, but it was clear to me a lot from the GP did not appreciate it the same way its finding appreciation today.   It was mainly a record for the fans and loved by the fans only. Joanne was just right for its time. It’ll probably do worse today given that she takes long breaks now and people mainly expect pop music from her. 

Edited July 13 by Versace

[Nessun Dorma 799]

1 hour ago, Juanjo said:

Sorry about the confusion, I wasn’t speaking ahead of the game in terms of innovation, I was talking about trends in music at the time. I am fully aware that she didn’t invent or revolutionize rock-acoustic, cottagecore sounds. Lol

When Joanne was released, the sound of mainstream pop was very different than what she gave us. Same with Gaga’s debut, no one was doing dance, electronic pop. However, with Just Dance and The Fame, she was both extremely successful AND a trend-setter. I want this for LG7, so bad! 

Oh I see! Sorry I misinterpreted too! I’m really not capable to answer if she set a new trend in pop music cause I’m not a big consumer of this genre nowadays except for Gaga 

But I stand by what I said, it was innovative and bold for her. I mean, she already had the success formula, so especially after ARTPOP, she could have chosen to play it safe and release an album like TF or BTW, but she took a completely different path. 

I’d say she was ahead of her time during TF era when she presented something totally different and unexpected considering the pop scene back then, as you said. Songs like Just Dance, Poker Face and Bad Romance were groundbreaking and it never gets old. 

I want another disruptive album with LG7 too! 

[Lextyr97 18,364]

Idk but I listened to Joanne about a month ago and was shocked by how well I thought it aged