Venezuela announces the creation of Guayana Esequiba (land dispute with Guyana)

[FfFfFfFF 58,127]

If triggered, a war in LATAM might involve the Unites States, Brazil, Colombia and other regional and international actors.

[bionic 50,111]

Yet more contemporary damage of colonialism

[Fernster7 7,976]

Imagine how tired we are of my country 

[River 127,521]

Another proxy of Russia

[tomsches 17,550]

Venezuela , sweety… to say it in the words of Joe Biden: Don’t, don’t, don’t. 

[Dennis 8,391]

I mean this is the problem when there is no deterrence anymore and Russia was allowed to pretty much get away with invading Ukraine, wars will happen more often, and wait for the big one, Taiwan.

Had the U.N not been obselete and had there been a stronger response against Russia from the international community, countries would think twice before invading their neighbors, but not the case today.

[Ayesha Erotica 1,924]

This is a centuries-old conflict. Ideally, the disputed territory should have been independent and the indigenous population in their indigenous languages as primary language(s) should govern there, should govern all of Guyana (it is a shame that there is no indigenous-led country in indigenous languages anywhere in the Americas). In fact, often the rulers are élites with connections to their ex-colonial countries who have adopted their ideology. The fact that West Guyana remains in Guyana is also one-sided, because the UK and USA decided in favor of Guyana because Guyana is English-speaking and Venezuela, as an ex-Spanish-speaking colony, falls outside their ideology.

Guyana wanted to distribute oil mining licenses to ExxonMobil, from which it would make little profit itself, and ExxonMobil would make billions of dollars in profits, a form of neo-colonialism. Also, Irfann Ali (Guy. Pres.) wanted to build a US military base there, and the real reason for Venezuela taking it is because it wants to pre-empt the military base, which is actually a reflection of why Russia went to Ukraine @FfFfFfFF. Venezuela wouldn't be taking it, if the US didn't plan to build military bases there.

[FfFfFfFF 58,127]

1 hour ago, Dennis said:

I mean this is the problem when there is no deterrence anymore and Russia was allowed to pretty much get away with invading Ukraine, wars will happen more often, and wait for the big one, Taiwan.

Had the U.N not been obselete and had there been a stronger response against Russia from the international community, countries would think twice before invading their neighbors, but not the case today.

History didn't start in 2022. Before Russia, did the US get away with hmm any of its invasions? You know the answer.

[Dennis 8,391]

49 minutes ago, LoliLux said:

Also, Irfann Ali (Guy. Pres.) wanted to build a US military base there, and the real reason for Venezuela taking it is because it wants to pre-empt the military base, which is actually a reflection of why Russia went to Ukraine @FfFfFfFF. Venezuela wouldn't be taking it, if the US didn't plan to build military bases there.

Oh here we go again! People already justifying a new war in the name of "pre-empting bad U.S" 

And your source of "U.S wants a military base" is either the Venezuelan government itself, or TASS (Russian state media) which shared this claim.

VP of Guyana denied such claim, but of course it doesn't matter to you. https://www.kaieteurnewsonline.com/2023/11/10/us-made-no-request-for-military-base-in-guyana-jagdeo-says/

Y'all go crazy on Israel, but literally any other war that's started by a non-western aligned country, your immediate reaction is to try to justify it.
 

[Ayesha Erotica 1,924]

33 minutes ago, Dennis said:

VP of Guyana denied such claim, but of course it doesn't matter to you. https://www.kaieteurnewsonline.com/2023/11/10/us-made-no-request-for-military-base-in-guyana-jagdeo-says/

 

The US is very adept at making it seem as if they are not the ones taking the initiative first.   The US is also very smart because they sometimes have their military bases paid for by their host countries and they have noticed that there are willing countries. Poland, for example, pays for the US missile shield itself and built this shield with EU and its own state subsidies. The US wanted to wait for Guyana to use the revenue it earned from oil production contracts to then pay for a US base on its own.

The US outsourced the matter to their loyal vassal, UK, whom they sent out. The UK should create new military bases in South America and has made this public. Guyana was mentioned as one of several possible locations:

"Mr Williamson is working on plans for two new UK bases in Caribbean and the Indo-Pacific region so Britain can project her influence militarily after Brexit.

Britain already has permanent joint operating bases in Cyprus, Gibraltar, the Falkland Islands and Diego Garcia in the Indian Ocean.

A source close to Mr Williamson said the new bases could be sited in Singapore or Brunei in the South China Sea, or Montserrat or Guyana in the Caribbean "within the next couple of years"."

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/12/29/britain-become-true-global-player-post-brexit-new-military-bases/

https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/b/guyana-silent-british-military-base-plans

Guyana's gov neither confirmed nor rejected it. This military base would then be co-used with the USA and only be registered by name to the UK only. Then, there was the chaos surrounding Brexit, Corona, other crises and then these military projects lost their priority and were not continued so far, but that doesn't mean that it has been completely discarded - Guyana is just not ultra-important for the US and UK, and is on hold.

Also this year, Guyana conducted military drills with the US:

https://www.dvidshub.net/news/449815/us-army-soldiers-conduct-multinational-public-affairs-training-workshop-with-guyana-defense-force

Of course, Venezuela isn't stupid. They read the clues. They will react before it is too late. They do not want to become the Next Grenada.

 

[Dennis 8,391]

5 minutes ago, LoliLux said:

The US is very adept at making it seem as if they are not the ones taking the initiative first.   The US is also very smart because they sometimes have their military bases paid for by their host countries and they have noticed that there are willing countries. Poland, for example, pays for the US missile shield itself and built this shield with EU and its own state subsidies. The US wanted to wait for Guyana to use the revenue it earned from oil production contracts to then pay for a US base on its own.

The US outsourced the matter to their loyal vassal, UK, whom they sent out. The UK should create new military bases in South America and has made this public. Guyana was mentioned as one of several possible locations:

"Mr Williamson is working on plans for two new UK bases in Caribbean and the Indo-Pacific region so Britain can project her influence militarily after Brexit.

Britain already has permanent joint operating bases in Cyprus, Gibraltar, the Falkland Islands and Diego Garcia in the Indian Ocean.

A source close to Mr Williamson said the new bases could be sited in Singapore or Brunei in the South China Sea, or Montserrat or Guyana in the Caribbean "within the next couple of years"."

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2018/12/29/britain-become-true-global-player-post-brexit-new-military-bases/

https://morningstaronline.co.uk/article/b/guyana-silent-british-military-base-plans

Guyana's gov neither confirmed nor rejected it. This military base would then be co-used with the USA and only be registered by name to the UK only. Then, there was the chaos surrounding Brexit, Corona, other crises and then these military projects lost their priority and were not continued so far, but that doesn't mean that it has been completely discarded - Guyana is just not ultra-important for the US and UK, and is on hold.

Also this year, Guyana conducted military drills with the US:

https://www.dvidshub.net/news/449815/us-army-soldiers-conduct-multinational-public-affairs-training-workshop-with-guyana-defense-force

Of course, Venezuela isn't stupid. They read the clues. They will react before it is too late. They do not want to become the Next Grenada.

 

Not you quoting an article from 2018 that said UK would establish a base "within the next couple of years", except that we're almost in 2024 now and it didn't happen. Is this the best thing you've got to justify a war? Plus last month VP of the country denied the claim that U.S would establish a base.

Just stop already. And let me entertain your conspiracy theory, even if a country invites another country to establish a military base, that does not justify an invasion. Countries are free to militarily cooperate with each other.
 

[Ayesha Erotica 1,924]

32 minutes ago, Dennis said:

Is this the best thing you've got to justify a war? Plus last month VP of the country denied the claim that U.S would establish a base.

 And let me entertain your conspiracy theory, even if a country invites another country to establish a military base, that does not justify an invasion. Countries are free to militarily cooperate with each other.
 

You're the only one who claims that we (me and @FfFfFfFF) use it as a justification for war, as you tend to see everything black and white and not the shades in between

We, or at least me, show understanding for Venezuale being displeased about what is happening in Guayana Esequiba, considering Venezuela has been claiming that territory since the 19th century and Guyana is not a clear owner of the land. We do not encourage it to attack Guyana, though. We are not cheerleaders for Guyana. But we aren't cheerleaders for Venezuela either. Guyana simply didn't deliver us enough reasons to convince us to become Guyana-cheerleaders.  We think Guyana could have handled the situation better, then it could have avoided Venezuela's reaction. We would not think this way if there wasn't a 170 year old border dispute and if Venezuela had accepted the borders before, then Guyana would be morally in the right. 

Plus: one could equally say that this is a "conspiray theory" to say that there will be a war. There is no evidence that this is evolving into a war so far. Guyana has less than one milliion inhabitants and will likely not go to war about it and the territory is mountainous, rich in rivers and rivers serve as obstacles, has jungles, it is hard to defend and hard to capture and Venezuala hasn't begun a widescale attack yet. (But I'm not ruling out that there could be a war if US delivers weapons to Guyana and motivates Guyana to go to a war)

 

[FfFfFfFF 58,127]

34 minutes ago, LoliLux said:

You're the only one who claims that we (me and @FfFfFfFF) use it as a justification for war, as you tend to see everything black and white and not the shades in between

We, or at least me, show understanding for Venezuale being displeased about what is happening in Guayana Esequiba, considering Venezuela has been claiming that territory since the 19th century and Guyana is not a clear owner of the land. We do not encourage it to attack Guyana, though. We are not cheerleaders for Guyana. But we aren't cheerleaders for Venezuela either. Guyana simply didn't deliver us enough reasons to convince us to become Guyana-cheerleaders.  We think Guyana could have handled the situation better, then it could have avoided Venezuela's reaction. We would not think this way if there wasn't a 170 year old border dispute and if Venezuela had accepted the borders before, then Guyana would be morally in the right. 

Plus: one could equally say that this is a "conspiray theory" to say that there will be a war. There is no evidence that this is evolving into a war so far. Guyana has less than one milliion inhabitants and will likely not go to war about it and the territory is mountainous, rich in rivers and rivers serve as obstacles, has jungles, it is hard to defend and hard to capture and Venezuala hasn't begun a widescale attack yet. (But I'm not ruling out that there could be a war if US delivers weapons to Guyana and motivates Guyana to go to a war)

 

I am personally not well-informed enough by LATAM to emit opinions - I let this task to people more knowledgeable than me or who live in region/ know or have access to media in Spanish, Portugese etc. But what  I will say is that I know America has a skin in the game based on the seeing the sentiments play out in real time.  Usually this level of emotional investment is reserved for conflicts that are relevant to the American foreign policy (Ukraine, Taiwan, Israel, Kosovo etc). This is unsettling because it seems, we might be looking at a proxy war in the making.