Tension rises at Russia-Ukraine border, new conflict likely

[Magui 2,654]

15 minutes ago, FfFfFfFF said:

 

Besides the (primal) desire for power and imperialism, the Russian agression towards its neighbours has its roots in its history and geography. Basically, Russia feels exposed and is a perpetual aggresor as a result (from Paris and Berlin to Moscow, there are no mountains or any natural barries, which allowed precendents such as Napoleon's and Hitler's invading Russian territory directly to Moscow). They opress so they won't be opressed themselves.

But who in is right mind would advance to Moscow? Like what european country from today would even think attacking Moscow? Like not even Germany who think it's probably the most strong european country ( probably with a better army, i don't know) could go against Russia ( it's freaking a enormous country)

[FfFfFfFF 58,072]

10 minutes ago, dit said:

wait...those red checkered lines...Russia can't be thinking of taking THAT much land away from Ukraine right?! that's insane. It literally is all the land east of hte Donetsk river...I thought they were only aiming for that Donbas province...this will be disastrous and create a massive refugee crisis and Europe is not prepared to take in another wave of refugees this soon. The continent has hardly recovered from the Syria wave and now a massive Ukrainian wave of refugees would literally send the entire continent into intense right wing - anti immigrant sentiments (even though Ukrainians are europeans tons of Europeans view Eastern Europe as a foreign entity). This is bad. 

I am praying for the people of Ukraine...

I watched a video in the summer that proposed various variants of Russia annexing more lands from Ukraine. Basically

- they could annex just tiny bits over the border

- they could annex the whole of Donetsk and Luhanks oblasts

- they could annex up to the Dnieper river

- they could annex all Ukrainian shores of the Black Sea and connect Transnistria (Moldova's Russian-supported break away state) with Crimea, Donets and Luhanks and Russia itself

The last variants seem rather unrealistic, because they would piss off NATO a bit too much.

(For the record, this video came out in April 2021)

[Gabi001 2,470]

I feel so sorry for Ukranians. I come from country bordering Ukraine, but we are thankfully in NATO and EU, but we have experience with russian occupation 

[Magui 2,654]

1 minute ago, FfFfFfFF said:

I watched a video in the summer that proposed various variants of Russia annexing more lands from Ukraine. Basically

- they could annex just tiny bits over the border

- they could annex the whole of Donetsk and Luhanks oblasts

- they could annex up to the Dnieper river

- they could annex all Ukrainian shores of the Black Sea and connect Transnistria (Moldova's Russian-supported break away state) with Crimea, Donets and Luhanks and Russia itself

The last variants seem rather unrealistic, because they would piss off NATO a bit too much.

(For the record, this video came out in April 2021)

... Basically Ukrainian is screwed. I admit i don't know much about what's going on Ukraine. Why the country is not a part of NATO?

[bionic 50,111]

7 minutes ago, Magui said:

But who in is right mind would advance to Moscow? Like what european country from today would even think attacking Moscow? Like not even Germany who think it's probably the most strong european country ( probably with a better army, i don't know) could go against Russia ( it's freaking a enormous country)

Right? You advance on Russia and the nukes get dropped.  

[Magui 2,654]

Just now, bionic said:

Right? You advance on Russia and the nukes get dropped.  

I mean in my mind that's what will happen, you advance on Russia and Putin just neutralizes you, with whatever he has.

(come on, every time i think on the plane that was shot...like there's no second guessing, or thinking that it's probably a comercial plane, it's just take it down, now imagine someone trying to advance on Russia)

 

 

 

 

[Fanta 5,019]

39 minutes ago, AnnaNicoleSmith said:

I always found it weird that we give power to one man. That should be forbidden, but then i keep thinking who makes decisions and how? And then thought of a sort of congress where people get called to go there and make decisions, lottery style, and it's hwo the country is ran. But if people are bigoted in the country how can u control them, it would be a mess, i mean idk how it could work

The entire system is corrupt. On the outside, 'normal' citizens like us have all these ideas on how to make the world a better and safer place for everyone (especially the generations to come, who deserve a safe and nurturing world). However, the way governments are set up you are bound to become corrupt and your initial message is watered down into literal sh!t.

Alliances, money, greed, power, they will not only sway a person but pressure them into submission. It's not that hard to do the right thing, in fact it is so simple, but that is why governments exist: to complicate it to the point where we are exploited and are left begging rather than standing on equal footing. Like I said before, the systems of ruling (oppression) as we know them have to be dismantled and replaced (with younger, preferably, individuals) in order for the world to change.

All the individuals making life threatening choices are old, with one foot in the grave, clinging on to power desperately. They shouldn't get to control and destroy our lives.

 

[FfFfFfFF 58,072]

4 minutes ago, AnnaNicoleSmith said:

what do u mean by russian separatist country, i googled it but still dont get it  sorry for history lesson

I actually don't mind explaining it, because I am interested in the subject!

Mainly, after the break up of URSS, Russia obviously didn't want to let the other nations go and tried to maintain (and expand) its influence in them, and they did it by supporting Russian minorities in said countries (more of a pretext than a legiminate reason though). They supported and provided aid to many tiny states breaking off from former Soviet republics, without Russia being involved directly. Basically a proxy war https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proxy_war.

To prevent Moldova joining Romania in the 90s, they supported Transnistria breaking away (1/3 of the population there is Russian). When Georgia was getting too close with the West, they supported the separatists in Abkazhia and South Ossetia (funilly enough, North Osethia which is part of Russia stayed part of Russia- talk about hypocrisy an searching for pretexts ). Finally, to prevent a future integration of Ukraine in NATO, in 2014 they helped Russian separatists in Eastern Ukraine and Crimea. Out of all of these, Crimea is the only territory that was officially annexed to Russia.

r 

Estonia is another country with Russian minorities, some say that may be Russia's next target, but that is more complicated because Estonia is already in NATO.

[insight 2,479]

Russia's only raison d'être is to conquer new territories...and that's it. They'd rather amass new territories than take care if its people who are living in utter poverty and desperation.

[Guest]

7 minutes ago, FfFfFfFF said:

I actually don't mind explaining it, because I am interested in the subject!

Mainly, after the break up of URSS, Russia obviously didn't want to let the other nations go and tried to maintain (and expand) its influence in them, and they did it by supporting Russian minorities in said countries (more of a pretext than a legiminate reason though). They supported and provided aid to many tiny states breaking off from former Soviet republics, without Russia being involved directly. Basically a proxy war https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proxy_war.

To prevent Moldova joining Romania in the 90s, they supported Transnistria breaking away (1/3 of the population there is Russian). When Georgia was getting too close with the West, they supported the separatists in Abkazhia and South Ossetia (funilly enough, North Osethia which is part of Russia stayed part of Russia- talk about hypocrisy an searching for pretexts ). Finally, to prevent a future integration of Ukraine in NATO, in 2014 they helped Russian separatists in Eastern Ukraine and Crimea. Out of all of these, Crimea is the only territory that was officially annexed to Russia.

r 

Estonia is another country with Russian minorities, some say that may be Russia's next target, but that is more complicated because Estonia is already in NATO.

ohhhhhhh wow i need to study geopolitics more thank u

[FfFfFfFF 58,072]

19 minutes ago, Magui said:

But who in is right mind would advance to Moscow? Like what european country from today would even think attacking Moscow? Like not even Germany who think it's probably the most strong european country ( probably with a better army, i don't know) could go against Russia ( it's freaking a enormous country)

I don't think any nation whatsoever wants a war in Europe, but Russia's politics and worldview is still shaped by those previous events. Russia is huge, but like 75% of the population lives in its European part. Russia wants to prevent Ukraine joining NATO by all costs, because that would mean external threat would be very close and there are no natual barries containing it.

[FfFfFfFF 58,072]

22 minutes ago, Magui said:

... Basically Ukrainian is screwed. I admit i don't know much about what's going on Ukraine. Why the country is not a part of NATO?

The only former URSS countries that joined NATO are Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania. I assume they managed to integrate very rapidly into EU and NATO because they were aligned with the West while Ukraine was more hesitant because they are closer to Russia culturally, historically, linguistically. The desire to join NATO is strong now but the conflicts in these break away regions gets in the way, conveniently for Russia...

[Magui 2,654]

2 minutes ago, FfFfFfFF said:

I don't think any nation whatsoever wants a war in Europe, but Russia's politics and worldview is still shaped by those previous events. Russia is huge, but like 75% of the population lives in its European part. Russia wants to prevent Ukraine joining NATO by all costs, because that would mean external threat would be very close and there are no natual barries containing it.

I see. I read your previous post, basically they welp those russian separatists that live in Ukraine to prevent Ukraine from reunite the peace conditions on their territory, that's probably something that NATO imposes. But honestly in my mind the natural barrier ( mountains or rivers) are just pretext, cause like you said no one wants to advance on Russia. It's just they want to keep their influence and keep more pressure on European countries (UE).

[FfFfFfFF 58,072]

Just now, Magui said:

I see. I read your previous post, basically they welp those russian separatists that live in Ukraine to prevent Ukraine from reunite the peace conditions on their territory, that's probably something that NATO imposes. But honestly in my mind the natural barrier ( mountains or rivers) are just pretext, cause like you said no one wants to advance on Russia. It's just they want to keep their influence and keep more pressure on European countries (UE).

Russian leaders are obviously highly imperialistic and shelfish, I was just poiting out the lack of natural defences as a reason why Russia became an agressor historically. Abusers were generally abused first, this is true in psychology, but also geopolitics.

[Magui 2,654]

1 minute ago, FfFfFfFF said:

Russian leaders are obviously highly imperialistic and shelfish, I was just poiting out the lack of natural defences as a reason why Russia became an agressor historically. Abusers were generally abused first, this is true in psychology, but also geopolitics.

Yeah. I just don't see a peaceful future to Ukraine, the UE, NATO, won't risk a war. So either they can keep their territories by themselves or Russia will annex whatever they want over time. Most likely there will be words,  speeches, sanctions, but for Russia that's not a treat whatsoever. Hopefully if a conflict is on the way,  at least the cruelty and casualties aren't that much.