The hypocrisy towards witchcraft and Azealia Banks

[Bebe 17,094]

20 minutes ago, Enigma said:

It seems none of you understand the definition of "pain." Pain is defined as a signal of present or impending tissue damage affected by a harmful stimulus, and thus is experienced by almost all multicellular organisms including plants.

No  For plants to feel pain, they need a nervous system and a brain.

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/we-asked-a-botanist-how-sure-science-is-that-plants-cant-feel-pain-302

I literally just googled your definition and was brought to a Guardian "notes and queries" section where some random called Randall from Cleveland made up that definition.  

As the botanist in Vice explained about a plant that recoils at the touch "It's feeling it. I would even use the word "aware," but it doesn't care. A leaf knows when it's been cut, and it will respond, but it's not getting a complex, like 'oh my god. What happens to me if this happens again?'"

and

"Right, and isn't sensing damage, even without a neural system, essentially pain?
The idea that damage has to be pain is mistaken. We feel pain because we have specific types of receptors called nociceptors which are programmed to respond to pain, not to touch. People can have genetic malfunctions where they feel pressure but never feel pain because they don't have pain receptors.

But you said plants are 'aware.' So aren't they cognizant of this damage? 
No. I refuse to use the word cognition. We have no understanding of what cognition is. None whatsoever. Plants are not cognizant. When we cut a leaf, we assume that the plant is suffering. But that's our own anthropomorphism about what's going on."

Plants DO NOT feel pain. They don't have the capacity.

19 minutes ago, lego said:

 

Everyone is a hypocrite. There is a selective outrage about the horrible deaths of human beings just depending on their location on this planet. We witnessed that many times on GGD, one could argue that vegans don't put as much passion and raise voice for all the unjust deaths of humans all over the world. Is that hypocrisy? Child labour, slavery? Is there equal amount of outrage among vegetarians/vegans? 

 

The food industry is not the same in every country and it could be discussed separately, but instead it's always brought up only in discussions about fur or AB killing chickens for her magic spells, just to call out other people. 

Of course everyone is a hypocrite, but that doesn't mean we should just shrug and allow ourselves to be hypocrites  

It just seems silly to claim AB's actions are evil and unforgivable when, based on the actions of the majority, it's so culturally acceptable. The majority of people in her country contribute to industries that place animals in worse conditions and that seems to be okay

If your only argument against AB is "Well, yeah it's hypocritical to brand AB as evil for life for this when we contribute to the same standards of living when it comes to animals - but hey! We are all hypocrites" then I can't have a real substantive discussion with you.

I think AB's actions are morally wrong, it just seems silly to brand her actions as some great moral evil while turning a blind eye to this sort of treatment happening on a giant industrial level. 

[aquariumlust 115]

Just now, lego said:

 

You have no respect for people who ask questions or have different point of view, but you're asking to be respected. That's hypocrisy.

The fact you copy pasted 1st amendment instead of answering the question, that's ignorance. And that "thank you" is as fake as it can be. 'Night. 

I certainly don't respect someone who continues to engage in a conversation with someone and make unsolicited attacks after they themself said they didn't read what I wrote. That's unfortunately how ignorance is spread. You refused to do the research yourself, didn't want to read my response, but decided to continue the conversation anyway.

You can keep me in your mentions if you like, but I've already deemed you uninformed and ignorant and refuse to continue to engage.

[Quark 7,098]

2 minutes ago, Born To Slay said:

Well if to survive we have to kill, I'd say we should strive to kill as least as we can. In the case of the people, we don't need to kill people to survive, so it's not okay to kill anyone.

If u want me to say that killing is bad, then there I said it but we don't have the option of no death. Unless we decide to just stop living.

In this case can you prove more animals are being killed than plants?

[Bebe 17,094]

9 minutes ago, beverlyhills said:

Just watch this: 

 

 

It's a ten minute video  I will watch it later if it's that important, but is it too difficult to write their points yourself?

[Bayonetta 9,844]

1 minute ago, Enigma said:

Didn't I already respond to you?

No , I haven't got a notification about it if you have though 

[Born To Slay 10,996]

3 minutes ago, Enigma said:

In this case can you prove more animals are being killed than plants?

No because more plants are killed then animals and it's literally impossible for it to be the other way around. 

[lego 44,165]

3 minutes ago, Bebe said:

No  For plants to feel pain, they need a nervous system and a brain.

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/we-asked-a-botanist-how-sure-science-is-that-plants-cant-feel-pain-302

I literally just googled your definition and was brought to a Guardian "notes and queries" section where some random called Randall from Cleveland made up that definition.  

As the botanist in Vice explained about a plant that recoils at the touch "It's feeling it. I would even use the word "aware," but it doesn't care. A leaf knows when it's been cut, and it will respond, but it's not getting a complex, like 'oh my god. What happens to me if this happens again?'"

and

"Right, and isn't sensing damage, even without a neural system, essentially pain?
The idea that damage has to be pain is mistaken. We feel pain because we have specific types of receptors called nociceptors which are programmed to respond to pain, not to touch. People can have genetic malfunctions where they feel pressure but never feel pain because they don't have pain receptors.

But you said plants are 'aware.' So aren't they cognizant of this damage? 
No. I refuse to use the word cognition. We have no understanding of what cognition is. None whatsoever. Plants are not cognizant. When we cut a leaf, we assume that the plant is suffering. But that's our own anthropomorphism about what's going on."

Plants DO NOT feel pain. They don't have the capacity.

Of course everyone is a hypocrite, but that doesn't mean we should just shrug and allow ourselves to be hypocrites  

It just seems silly to claim AB's actions are evil and unforgivable when, based on the actions of the majority, it's so culturally acceptable. The majority of people in her country contribute to industries that place animals in worse conditions and that seems to be okay

If you're only argument against AB is "Well, yeah it's hypocritical to brand AB as evil for life for this when we contribute to the same standards of living when it comes to animals - but hey! We are all hypocrites" then I can't have a real substantive discussion with you.

I think AB's actions are morally wrong, it just seems silly to brand her actions are some great moral evil while turning a blind eye to this sort of treatment happening on a giant industrial level. 

 

 

It doesn't mean it's ok, it means that it wasn't the subject of discussion. The food industry could be discussed separately, but it never is...

It seems like calling out other people's hypocrisy is more important and just another way of defending people like AB. 

You didn't answer to my other points. 

 

[Quark 7,098]

3 minutes ago, Paris Hilton said:

No , I haven't got a notification about it if you have though 

I did respond and what I said was that pain is pain. You still feel uncomfortable even if you are not thinking about it.

[lego 44,165]

Arrogance and superiority complex will never help anyone "spread information" or reduce what you think is - ignorance. It will just push people away. Maybe the lack of arguments makes person to talk in condescending manner, I don't know. Just talking in general.  

[YeehawKylie 7,817]

2 hours ago, RainbowBlonde said:

What's your rebuttal? 

Killing turkeys for Thankgsiving result in food. They're not being killed as a sacrifice. If I'm correct, animal sacrifices on religious grounds was rejected by the Supreme Court via a case in Florida where a religious group was trying to sacrifice goats...I could be wrong though. But I'm pretty sure animal sacrifice is not covered and is considered animal cruelty.

[lego 44,165]

1 minute ago, koonsisme said:

If I'm correct, animal sacrifices on religious grounds was rejected by the Supreme Court via a case in Florida where a religious group was trying to sacrifice goats...I could be wrong though. But I'm pretty sure animal sacrifice is not covered and is considered animal cruelty.

 

 

Please dig into this, I'm interested to know the details. 

[Quark 7,098]

8 minutes ago, Born To Slay said:

No because more plants are killed then animals and it's literally impossible for it to be the other way around. 

Exactly

[aquariumlust 115]

I really have no idea how people can justify ignorance and uninformed hysteria. A bunch of privileged Americans on laptops with wifi don't get to tell African practitioners how to practice their religion.

Plants do not feel and they are in no way sentient creatures able to even understand the concept of suffering or pain. This conversation is entirely ridiculous and unfounded by science and common sense.

Sacrificing animals is not my thing and I don't like it. Killing animals in horrible conditions for mass consumption pumped with hormones is a horrible horrible practice. In no way is ritual sacrifice (practiced by very very few even in witchcraft) even on the same plane of cruelty and ecological impact. The very very few who practice animal sacrifice to do so with reverence and respect for all life which is the basis for witchcraft. Anything that loses it's life to benefit the practitioner is treated with the utmost respect, in the best conditions possible in order to please the god/goddess. You would never disrespect that process and deliver to your holy being a traumatized and brutalized animal. It is their belief that their god/goddess created the animal and they are gifting it back to them on the spiritual plane. To each their own.

Respect and compassion are crucial. You may not understand others' religions but calling it BS and spreading uniformed messages is dangerous and hurtful.

Also download my free app Spellcaster for Android and iOS devices (including smart watches!!!) worldwide!!! It has horoscopes, spells, tarot readings, runes readings, crystal guides, and is 100% vegan and free of animal sacrifice!

[Bebe 17,094]

23 minutes ago, lego said:

 

 

It doesn't mean it's ok, it means that it wasn't the subject of discussion. The food industry could be discussed separately, but it never is...

It seems like calling out other people's hypocrisy is more important and just another way of defending people like AB. 

You didn't answer to my other points. 

 

I've seen multiple threads on here about the food industry and about animal rights that are separate from discussions like this  

I think that's just you being defensive honestly, of course Azealia Banks slaughtering chickens in her house is going to get some attention, of course it's going to bring up issues to do with animal rights and of course it's going to get attention on places like GGD

I think it's a legitimate point to make too, it's not about pointing out people's hypocrisy for the fun of it - it just does seem bizarre for people to care so deeply about these chickens while ignoring the larger problem. For those of us who do actually care about the welfare of all chickens - we're sitting here like... What? People care? This is how we treat animals, we keep them locked up and slaughter them...Okay... Lets fight against factory farming and stuff then? Because that's far worse and is what will actually help chickens like these...

I'm hardly going about trying to defend AB's character either. She has proven enough that she is a violent, bigoted, racist bully with poor moral fiber. It's just that to some of us this seems like a strange point of attack, yeah what she did is morally wrong in my eyes - but so much worse is happening on such a large scale that it genuinely feels bizarre for so much outrage to be directed at this comparatively small instance of cruelty.

What other points did you make? I wasn't trying to ignore anything. 

If you are talking about this: "one could argue that vegans don't put as much passion and raise voice for all the unjust deaths of humans all over the world. Is that hypocrisy? Child labour, slavery? Is there equal amount of outrage among vegetarians/vegans? " 

It seemed unrelated to what we are talking about  Pointing out any perceived hypocrisy of others in other instances doesn't erase the hypocrisy we are discussing here... It just seems like irrelevant mud slinging to avoid the topic at hand.

[Born To Slay 10,996]

1 minute ago, Enigma said:

Exactly

Exactly? What does that have to do with the morality of the situation? By the numbers of course since animals eat plants, plants are dying more. People who eat meat are more at fault for plant death then vegans ever will be.