MJHolland 12,725 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Lets put you in immigrants shoes shall we? For this 'story' we will be talking about Manuel. Manuel is living in Mexico Manuel gets payed **** at his job Manuel wants a better life for his kids Manuel cant afford a plane ticket or a VISA Manuel wants a better opportunity for his kids, despite the risks. Manuel heads for the border. Manuel crosses the boarder Manuel manages to get a job, while still getting paid ****. It is more than he got paid in Mexico though. Manuel loves his kids enough to risk anything for them, even his life Manuel gets hate and racist slurs everywhere he goes. Manuel manages to land a job that pays a lot more Manuel pays taxes, like a lot of the immigrants in the USA Manuel's kids go to a nice public school. Manuel gets stopped by a police car for missing a stop sign. Manuel gets asked for his license. Manuel doesn't have said license. Cop gets suspicious, and takes him into custody. Does his research, and realizes that Manuel has no green card. Or visa for that matter Manuel gets deported with his kids Is Manuel a criminal? No. He is a brave ass father risking his life for a better life of his kids. he is a hero. Ready for the "But i'm not in that situation sooooo " comments. Or between steps 3 and 4, Manuel could have looked for a better job in his own country... or tell his kids to study their a**es off so they don't end up like him... or he could have taken advantage of the public education he had, leading to a better career path... or he could have done what any responsible adult does and make sure he is economically secure enough to have children in the first place. "Manuel" represents adults, and all adults are responsible for themselves first, then their families. And if they can't be responsible for themselves first but they make families anyways, then those kids will carry that extra burden too. This applies everywhere, even in the US. It is a tragic situation and unfortunately a cycle, but it doesn't warrant anarchy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minaj 607 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 How do you know they all expect the government to pay for everything?I always see them trying to complain about it, I just think that there should be stricter laws on this sort of thing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lego 44,165 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 I'm from the UK, and literally all I see is people that can't speak a word of English, but expect for the government to pay for them to live here. It's awful.I'm not from the USA so Well you are from a land that colonized America, so think about those first illegal immigrants, you should feel sympathy with people who were not so fortunate in life and who are looking for better one. FreePalestine Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morphine Prince 109,655 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Everything is just so easy for some of you Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minaj 607 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Well you are from a land that colonized America, so think about those first illegal immigrants, you should feel sympathy with people who were not so fortunate in life and who are looking for better one.I completely understand if they need to come here if they physically can't stay in their own country. I think it is fine under extreme circumstances. It just makes me angry to see people get in to the country and get free support and benefits so easily amd it's the working taxpayer that pays for it. Benefits shouldn't be give on out to people unless they have some sort of disability that keeps them from working. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lego 44,165 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 first of all that wasn't the US (the country we are talking about) or claimed land, as 99.9% of the native tribes in the 13 original colonies declared that human can't own land because it doesn't belong to mankind. Second of all, those attempted illegal immigrants walked into that room themselves. Plus those conditions look a lot better than the ones they were likely trying to escape. Why do we need to feel bad for them? The law is the law here in the US. If you coming to america means that you break a law, the law will hit back. That's black and white. How is that not reality? Again, if you don't want to sleep on a concrete floor, don't make yourself sleep on a concrete floor. Oh so because that was native tribes belief it was ok to colonize them, put them to reservations and treat them like ****. They were there before your ancestors which makes all those british, irish, dutch, spanish etc conquerors - illegal imigrants. They migrated from Europe looking for better life just as these Mexicans are doing. FreePalestine Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJHolland 12,725 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Oh so because that was native tribes belief it was ok to colonize them, put them to reservations and treat them like ****. They were there before your ancestors which makes all those british, irish, dutch, spanish etc conquerors - illegal imigrants. They migrated from Europe looking for better life just as these Mexicans are doing. What there a law saying they couldn't immigrate to the land that could later become the US? No Whether you think it's moral or not (it was immoral to do imo too) doesn't make something illegal. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PG lol 277 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 I completely understand if they need to come here if they physically can't stay in their own country. I think it is fine under extreme circumstances. It just makes me angry to see people get in to the country and get free support and benefits so easily amd it's the working taxpayer that pays for it. Benefits shouldn't be give on out to people unless they have some sort of disability that keeps them from working. In my opinion though, I see way more people who are from the UK and claim benefits fraudulently than immigrants who do that. In fact every single immigrant I know works and pays taxes. Now I know that obviously some people will come and take advantage of the system, but that is what is at fault, the system, not the people. Also I know that these people shouldn't come to our country and not pay taxes and not work and receive free financial aid and healthcare, but I make no distinction between people who immigrated here and people who were already here who do the same thing. I just feel it's very dangerous to just blame immigrants because it leads to an awful public perception of immigrants (even the word sound bad nowadays) and then people like UKIP can use these perceptions to initiate racism and hatred where it really didn't have to be. I guess I don't even disagree with you I just didn't find your argument totally clear and sometimes I read into things wrongly and assume people are being too harsh when I've just mis-understood them :) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minaj 607 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 In my opinion though, I see way more people who are from the UK and claim benefits fraudulently than immigrants who do that. In fact every single immigrant I know works and pays taxes. Now I know that obviously some people will come and take advantage of the system, but that is what is at fault, the system, not the people. Also I know that these people shouldn't come to our country and not pay taxes and not work and receive free financial aid and healthcare, but I make no distinction between people who immigrated here and people who were already here who do the same thing. I just feel it's very dangerous to just blame immigrants because it leads to an awful public perception of immigrants (even the word sound bad nowadays) and then people like UKIP can use these perceptions to initiate racism and hatred where it really didn't have to be. I guess I don't even disagree with you I just didn't find your argument totally clear and sometimes I read into things wrongly and assume people are being too harsh when I've just mis-understood them I wasn't actually attacking the people, although it may come across like that, I was attacking the system as it is deeply flawed, as you just outlined in your post :hug: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PG lol 277 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 I wasn't actually attacking the people, although it may come across like that, I was attacking the system as it is deeply flawed, as you just outlined in your post oh, oops Thanks for being so nice about it though :) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whispering 18,865 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Everything is just so easy for some of you Some people simply lack empathy. They must be a joy to be around in real life, huh? Karma will catch up with people like this one day...it always does. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Essence 244 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 I mean, the thing is, they ARE a financial burden on the US. Over a 100 billion a year goes to illegal immigrants. But (shocker), I understand where you're coming from. Yes, this is a huge issue, but can we stop demonizing these people? The way illegal immigrants are talked about, you'd think they're all mass murderers. I agree wholeheartedly Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,845 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Not pressed. The best defense is a good offense :/ Nowadays in the modern world economic power is just as big a thing. Thats how Germany has a pretty big grip in Europe right now because they are the economic powerhouse there And the Russia-Ukraine Crisis? Much of the pressure on Russia was done with economic sanctions and not direct military force My Country Canada is also heavily swaed by the US. But the US hasnt attacked us sinse 1812. You have a heavy influence on us because of our economies and markets being so interlinked and you guys are the bigger wing As China grows to surpass the US GDP within the next year... As India over the long term (estimates say 15-25 years) is set to pass the US as well, and Emerging markets take up a bigger portion of the World economic pie... US influence and influence from the Developed World for that matter will diminish gradually as it already has began... Especially with Developig Nations particularly China having created massive wealth funds that hold Government debt and other foreign currencies from the US and other Developed Nations. That gives them a lot of power to manipulate currency to their advantage by simply selling and buying when they need a change. Thats a major advantage the Developing world has over us No Country in the forseable future will have the influence America has WW in terms of media, entertainment and cultural influence tho But as far as actual power... The gradual decay for the US is real :toofunny: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LStephens11 15 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 I don't know who to blame in this situation except parents who blindly lead their families into a country where they are not legally allowed. It's bad on both sides...one, they shouldn't be crossing illegally...two, it said HUNDREDS came in at once...I don't think this reflects that they WANT to keep them in these conditions, but where else are they supposed to put them? 1.) If they really are fleeing their countries because of instability, the conditions in those photos looks MUCH better than the place they left behind. Plus, it's not like it's an unsafe place. It's totally secure, heated/cooled, plus food and water. 2.) The US has no responsibility in providing shelter for these people at the border. What they were trying to do was very illegal and creates MASSIVE problems domestically. Why should I, as a tax paying citizen, have to pay for the children of criminals who aren't even citizens themselves? Why can't the US gov. just keep all the criminals on the opposite side of the border where there is no shelter for them? It's extremely generous that all these illegals were provided shelter at all! They could have just told them to turn around and go home! SPILL THAT TEA Y'ALL, especially MJHolland Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,845 Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Oh so because that was native tribes belief it was ok to colonize them, put them to reservations and treat them like ****. They were there before your ancestors which makes all those british, irish, dutch, spanish etc conquerors - illegal imigrants. They migrated from Europe looking for better life just as these Mexicans are doing.what people did many generations back and what people do now u cant compare The settlers coming in and taking land without permission doesnt give others the right to do the same even if it was the same generation U might have half an argument if the Natives were the ones breaking the laws. But on top of that most of these are Central Americans who had nothing to do with the European Settlers and never owned this land Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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