Russia blows up dam to thwart Ukraine's counter-offensive, causing massive flooding

[Dennis 5,679]

One day after Ukraine allegedly started its counter-offensive in Zaporizhia region, the Nova Kakhovka, dam, currently under Russian control was blown up overnight.

This is causing the city of Kherson, under Ukrainian control, and much of the Kherson oblast to be submerged with water, causing thousands of buildings and homes to be destroyed.

Few weeks ago, Ukraine established a foothold on the left side of the Dnipro river, raising speculation that they were going to launch another counter-attack here. But now it's highly unlikely this will be posssible. The flooding makes it nearly impossible for Ukrainian army to cross. As a result this significantly narrows down the areas Russia will have to defend during the counter-offensive.

Russian soldiers in Kherson oblast seem to celebrate the news saying that this will significantly complicate Ukraine's attempt to launch a counter-offensive in the Kherson oblast:
 

 

Edited June 7 by Dennis

[ALGAYDO 24,135]

He looks like the “straight” guy on gay hook up apps that likes getting dícked-down but has a GF and kids so he has to be DL about it, yet spends his time on social media blasting the “gay agenda” and whatnot.
 

Basically, a sad little shell of a man that’s really just an insecure píece of shít that gets all validation from daddy aka his terrorist overlords telling him he did a good job by destroying innocent lives 

[Dennis 5,679]

This looks like a man-made hurricane flood now 
 

 

[LoliLux 976]

It is not confirmed that it was really Russia. Ukraine also had very strong motifs to destroy the dam:

- The Kachowka dam gathers water for the Crimean Canal. Now the water level is sinking there and less water is on the way to Crimea. Ukraine could have wanted to 'cause a drought on Crimea as it did in the past after 2014, when it stopped the water flow to the the Crimean Canal.

- The Kachowka dam gave also water through rivers and canals to Southern Kherson, important for agriculture. All these areas are currentyl Russian occupied and Russia is now negatively affected because it lacks water there in zones that are already at higher risk of drought.

- While the blowing up of the dam, makes it harder for Ukraine to regain Eastkherson, it also works the other way around: It is now harder for Russia to make its way to Odessa.

I suppose Ukraine was it because the blowing up of the dam ultimately prevents Odessa from being occupied and this is in Ukraine's interests. It was not realistic to retake Eastkherson Oblast anyway as it has been occupied for months now.

Edited June 6 by LoliLux

[Dennis 5,679]

59 minutes ago, LoliLux said:

It is not confirmed that it was really Russia. Ukraine also had very strong motifs to destroy the dam:

- The Kachowka dam gathers water for the Crimean Canal. Now the water level is sinking there and less water is on the way to Crimea. Ukraine could have wanted to 'cause a drought on Crimea as it did in the past after 2014, when it stopped the water flow to the the Crimean Canal.

- The Kachowka dam gave also water through rivers and canals to Southern Kherson, important for agriculture. All these areas are currentyl Russian occupied and Russia is now negatively affected because it lacks water there in zones that are already at higher risk of drought.

- While the blowing up of the dam, makes it harder for Ukraine to regain Eastkherson, it also works the other way around: It is now harder for Russia to make its way to Odessa.

I suppose Ukraine was it because the blowing up of the dam ultimately prevents Odessa from being occupied and this is in Ukraine's interests. It was not realistic to retake Eastkherson Oblast anyway as it has been occupied for months now.

None of these points make sense.

1. First of all, Putin doesn't care about people in Crimea. Crimea is occupied land and as such he doesn't really care. Plus they already stockpiled reserves enough for more than two years: (source: https://tass.com/russia/1535583)

2. Again, you make the assumption that Russia cares about Ukrainian farmers in southern Kherson and how they would suffer from this? You need to wake up really. I don't even know how I can respond to this. They don't care about russian citizens themselves, let alone Ukrainian farmers lol.

3. Russia already exhausted their offensive potential lmao, they're not going on the offensive towards Odessa. Another non-sensical argument here. Ukrainian's counter-offensive just started however. So even from tactical POV this hurts Ukraine more than Russia militarily.
 

Please, if you're not following this conflict closely, and you're not in the loop of what's happening, refrain from making such ridiculous claims that can end up helping Russian propaganda. There was never an immenent "Odessa offensive". This is literally straight out of your imagination. So Ukraine destroying their cities for something that even Russians don't currently expect to happen is ridiculous.

Putin will do anything possible to prevent another political humiliation for him by losing more land to Ukraine. This has become a war for his own survival. He thinks his position  in power is in jeopardy if he loses the war. So for now, I think the only thing he won't do is nuclear weapons, given China and India's warnings.

Edited June 6 by Dennis

[27monster27 8,716]

Sounds like history lessons are needed here. They should have researched China in 1937 before thinking this was a good idea.

[FfFfFfFF 53,227]

1) After Ukrainian supported attacks on Russian villages in Belgorod (which is Russian territory proper which pro-Ukrainian factions attack with American and Western support), what do you expect? If there are no red lines, there are no red lines. Which is fine if this is the game you want to be played but don’t get Pichacku surprised when you get something in return.

2) I wonder what mainstream media and the pro-Ukraine at all cost crowd will do when it will come out that perhaps it was Ukraine who blew up the dam (like the US turned to be the ones who likely blew up Nord Stream, and like it turned out Ukraine lied when he said Russia bombed Poland). There is no coming back from this at this point. Both sides seek to win the war according to their terms and they use all the means available with no pushback.

Edited June 7 by FfFfFfFF

[Debithius 4,883]

20 minutes ago, FfFfFfFF said:

1) After Ukrainian supported attacks on Russian villages in Belgorod (which is Russian territory proper which pro-Ukrainian factions attack with American and Western support), what do you expect? If there are no red lines, there are no red lines. Which is fine if this is the game you want to be played but don’t get Pichacku surprised when you get something in return.

2) I wonder what mainstream media and the pro-Ukraine at all cost crowd will do when it will come out that perhaps it was Ukraine who blew up the dam (like the US turned to be the ones who likely blew up Nord Stream, and like it turned out Ukraine lied when he said Russia bombed Poland). There is no coming back from this at this point. Both sides seek to win the war according to their terms and they use all the means available with no pushback.

I mean Ukraine is the country who got invaded so I think they have nothing to apologize for at this point lol.

[Dennis 5,679]

Russia will have to add ecoterrorism to all the types of terrorism they've done so far
 

 

Edited June 7 by Dennis

[Bowman 5,211]

I’ve just seen this on the news, devastating 

[Economy 42,966]

On 6/6/2023 at 10:56 AM, Dennis said:

None of these points make sense.

1. First of all, Putin doesn't care about people in Crimea. Crimea is occupied land and as such he doesn't really care. Plus they already stockpiled reserves enough for more than two years: (source: https://tass.com/russia/1535583)

2. Again, you make the assumption that Russia cares about Ukrainian farmers in southern Kherson and how they would suffer from this? You need to wake up really. I don't even know how I can respond to this. They don't care about russian citizens themselves, let alone Ukrainian farmers lol.

3. Russia already exhausted their offensive potential lmao, they're not going on the offensive towards Odessa. Another non-sensical argument here. Ukrainian's counter-offensive just started however. So even from tactical POV this hurts Ukraine more than Russia militarily.
 

Please, if you're not following this conflict closely, and you're not in the loop of what's happening, refrain from making such ridiculous claims that can end up helping Russian propaganda. There was never an immenent "Odessa offensive". This is literally straight out of your imagination. So Ukraine destroying their cities for something that even Russians don't currently expect to happen is ridiculous.

Putin will do anything possible to prevent another political humiliation for him by losing more land to Ukraine. This has become a war for his own survival. He thinks his position  in power is in jeopardy if he loses the war. So for now, I think the only thing he won't do is nuclear weapons, given China and India's warnings.

I'm not sure Putin not caring about the ppl is irrelevant or automatically makes what the user said impossible

 

Economic damage is damaging to Russia whether or not he cares about the ppl

 

Whether or not they were gonna advance now it makes it harder should it be done in the future

 

If we don't have 100% confirmation on anything and there's possibilities still in the air, stop acting all know it all and self righteous to someone who wonders about the possibility of something u disagree with.

 

I don't necessarily disagree with u that it wasn't Ukraine but I think ur agressive and judgemental tone was overblown given what he said has some possible logic and there's no total confirmation at this time.

Edited June 8 by Economy
Typo

[Dennis 5,679]

44 minutes ago, Economy said:

I'm not sure Putin not caring about the ppl is irrelevant or automatically makes what the user said impossible

Economic damage is damaging to Russia whether or not he cares about the ppl

Whether or not they were gonna advance now it makes it harder should it be done in the future

If we don't have 100% confirmation on anything and there's possibilities still in the air, stop acting all know it all and self righteous to someone who wonders about the possibility of something I disagree with.

I don't necessarily disagree with u that it wasn't Ukraine but I think ur agressive and judgemental tone was overblown given what he said has some possible logic and there's no total confirmation at this time.

This matter is too serious to give misinformed and uneducated opinions about. Refraining from commenting on a topic when you don't know enough about it is fine, but willingly choose to give a misinformed opinion without having a basic understanding is wrong. And this goes for everything, covid, Ukraine, and any contemporary topic. They didn't just say "we don't know for sure who did it". They said they "suppose it was Ukraine". And that's the offensive part.

Tens of thousands of civilians are killed in this war. People are currently drowning as we speak. So yes sorry, I have no patience for victim-blaming again, especially without evidence. Not only these people have to deal with the pain and suffering being inflicted on them, but they have to deal with stupidity coming from the supposedly "educated" West (and I wish it was just Tucker Carlson). To put in simple words anyone can understand, if someone killed your mother, and at a time you're seeking justice and accountability for a murderer, someone shows up and without providing any proof claims that "well she probably killed herself". How would you feel? So be considerate when discussing these matters. There's people whose lives are destroyed as a result of this tragedy. If someone is gonna deny them justice and say well they probably did it to themselves, they better have solid proof or be quiet.

And again before you say there's logic in what they said, explain such logic? The user suggested that Ukraine could've done it to themselves to thwart an imminent Odessa offensive. I was honest in saying that this is straight out of their imagination. There's nothing logical about it, considering that not even the russians themselves expect such offensive lol. If you say otherwise, please provide evidence. But I'm sick and tired of the misinformation about this particular topic. People just wanna start conspiracy theories for the fun of it without providing a single proof. This is not a game.

Edited June 8 by Dennis

[Economy 42,966]

40 minutes ago, Dennis said:

This matter is too serious to give misinformed and uneducated opinions about. Refraining from commenting on a topic when you don't know enough about it is fine, but willingly choose to give a misinformed opinion without having a basic understanding is wrong. And this goes for everything, covid, Ukraine, and any contemporary topic. Tens of thousands of civilians are killed in this war. People are currently drowning as we speak. So yes sorry, I have no patience for victim-blaming again, especially without evidence. Not only these people have to deal with the pain and suffering being inflicted on them, but they have to deal with stupidity coming from the supposedly "educated" West (and I wish it was just Tucker Carlson). To put in simple words anyone can understand, if someone killed your mother, and at a time you're seeking justice and accountability for a murderer, someone shows up and without providing any proof claims that "well she probably killed herself". How would you feel? So be considerate when discussing these matters. There's people whose lives are destroyed as a result of this tragedy. If someone is gonna deny them justice and say well they probably did it to themselves, they better have solid proof or be quiet.

And again before you say there's logic in what they said, explain such logic? The user suggested that Ukraine could've done it to themselves to thwart an imminent Odessa offensive. I was honest in saying that this is straight out of their imagination. There's nothing logical about it, considering that not even the russians themselves expect such offensive lol. If you say otherwise, please provide evidence. But I'm sick and tired of the misinformation about this particular topic. People just wanna start conspiracy theories without providing a single proof. 

Trying to figure out military tactics and the example u came up with is a complete incomparable situation. Even obvious covid misinformation and conspiracy theories that came from it I don't think are applicable here. Ur talking about stuff that has irrefutable facts and trying to compare it to a situation that we do not yet even as to the cause (even if we can say with relative confidence it wasn't Ukraine), As one user here likes to call everything "false symmetry".

 

There can still be a tiny degree of doubt with this. Not the case with the covid stuff that was well studied or ur mother getting killed if u knew of it

 

I agree with u it sounds far fetched and I don't think it's what happened either. I wouldn't have bothered to make such a comment when it's so unlikely.

 

I also agree it's a little insensitive for the ppl whose town got flooded to suggest their own government did it to them when rn there's no evidence of it.

 

But I also think ur comparisons and tone is disproportionate. At best he came up with theories that are unlikely and sound insensitive at this time would be best not to say out loud (I agree he shouldn't have said them). But ur tone was making him equivalent to antivax science deniers or Donald Trump Election fraud theorists coming up with theories that are completely and factually irrefutable which as unlikely as it may be I don't think is totally the case here yet

 

In my opinion, not at all in the same level in terms of implausibility

 

You talk about harm. Yet this attitude where when someone challanges something that isn't certain anyway with an unpopular belief is immediately shot down and gas lighted with comparisons to the most outrageous stuff that isn't even remotely on the same scope to shut down any potential for ideas is also harmful in society. Maybe in this specific case it changes nothing, but the attitude in society as a whole is dangerous imo even if more often than not the ones mocking the "crazy" one are in the right. Cuz everyone is wrong about something at least sometimes even society as a whole. And it's increasingly becoming impossible for ppl to challenge stuff in something as simple as civilized discussion because of this

 

Had ur comment been merely telling him that it's insensitive to say that right now unless more evidence comes out and given him reasons why u think it's very unlikely, I would have simply thumbed u up and not even responded to you

Edited June 8 by Economy

[Dennis 5,679]

9 hours ago, Economy said:

You talk about harm. Yet this attitude where when someone challanges something that isn't certain anyway with an unpopular belief is immediately shot down and gas lighted with comparisons to the most outrageous stuff that isn't even remotely on the same scope to shut down any potential for ideas is also harmful in society.

So you subjectively decided that it's not remotely on the same scope? You say that falsely starting conspiracy theories without evidence about elections being rigged, or vaccines being harmful, is a lot more harmful than conspiracies about Ukraine? You made this wrong subjective call, that's on you not me.

For me it is AS harmful. I don't decide to downgrade the gravity of it because I don't care about it as much or because it doesn't affect me. This conflict caused tens of millions of lives to be upended. Millions are displaced. Tens of thousands of civilians are killed, by conservative estimates. Hundreds of thousands of casualties. And that's not even talking about PTSD that is probably more widespread.

I'm sorry that you got desensitized to it, and you don't think it's as bad. But for me it is. Not to say that Ukraine is immune from criticism, when you see such a mass tragedy, even today Russia was shelling rescue operations in Kherson, and your immediate thought is to say well it's ukrainians killing themselves, that is beyond insanity.
 

 

Edited June 8 by Dennis

[4th Street 1,008]

None of this has been confirmed. Why would Russia blow up a dam that supplies so much water to Crimea? its just as probable that Ukraine blew it if not more likely. Remember back when Nordstream happened and western media was reporting that Russia did it and now we know that was proven to be untrue. People need to recognize that mainstream news has become a massive cycle of propaganda in regards to the Ukraine conflict on both sides, nobody really knows what is happening and saying Russia blew the dam when it just as easily could have been Ukraine is another example of trying to spin a narrative.

Edited June 8 by 4th Street