"The Grotesque Is No Longer Shocking In Pop" - Thoughts?

[YaaaasGaga 6,119]

Pitchfork wrote an article recently titled "The Grotesque Is No Longer Shocking In Pop" which explores the idea that dark themes in music and music videos has become tired, stale and not shocking anymore. It credits Gaga for bringing it into the mainstream following on from Michael Jackson and highlights her past works that explore dark themes and how they ushered in a new era for pop music but now says it's become the norm and no one really cares for those themes anymore.

Article Link: https://pitchfork.com/thepitch/how-pop-music-came-to-embrace-grotesque-gory-aesthetics/

I always see members on GGD saying that Gaga needs to go back to using dark themes again like she did in her earlier career to try and recreate that 'shock value' but I wondered whether people think that would probably hinder her if she did as the GP seem to think that those dark themes have lost their originality now? 

When you think about it, is there actually anything more that musicians can explore and incorporate into their work now that WOULD shock us? Tbh it feels like we've seen it all already?

Discuss 

[Mindblown 6,710]

Our society is also completely different from when GAGA stepped on the world stage. We now live in constant cancel culture and everything is hyper political. Theres no way the 2009 VMA performance would survive in our current social climate. Reintroducing shock culture to the point that it's actually shocking for us now would need to cross lines and I feel thats very tricky without getting cancelled and maintaining GAGAs artistic standards. If you do something too shocking it could be tacky and you get thrown to the dogs. 

[Lucas 25,700]

16 minutes ago, YaaaasGaga said:

I always see members on GGD saying that Gaga needs to go back to using dark themes again like she did in her earlier career to try and recreate that 'shock value'

I think we want her to go back to dark themes because that's what she does the best.

Now about the shocking thing, I feel like our generation has seen so much already, when it comes to blood, sex etc... I can't think of anything that an artist could do that would be shocking.

[Chlorine 47,976]

I think what Lil Nas X is doing is genuinely "shocking." 

I never, ever, thought I would see the day that a gay black man would be so upfront and brazen with his sexuality in pop culture and hip hop. The kiss at the BET awards was completely groundbreaking. 

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Lucas said:

I think we want her to go back to dark themes because that's what she does the best.

Now about the shocking thing, I feel like our generation has seen so much already, I can't think of anything that artists could do that could be shocking. Even when Gaga got puked on during that Swine performance it didn't feel shocking tbh.

There could be many things, things that are taboo will shock people. Religious themes especially. If Gaga in a performance is almost naked on a pink bling cross bleeding from her hands, it will be shocking. War themes too, taboo topics like politics, race, anything that people talk about now, if you bring it in ur performance it will be shocking. So easy to shock people

[enissa11 2,984]

41 minutes ago, Mindblown said:

Our society is also completely different from when GAGA stepped on the world stage. We now live in constant cancel culture and everything is hyper political. Theres no way the 2009 VMA performance would survive in our current social climate. Reintroducing shock culture to the point that it's actually shocking for us now would need to cross lines and I feel thats very tricky without getting cancelled and maintaining GAGAs artistic standards. If you do something too shocking it could be tacky and you get thrown to the dogs. 

lmao so dramatic, why the 2009 vmas performance wouldn't survive??? its magestic would be intact, if anything it would be more well received, the same thing with the meat dress, i think in this day and age it would still be pretty shocking and it still be very thought provoking and less deemed as an attention stunt for the gp.

[HuffsAhoy 7,433]

I kind of agree with this take. I feel like pop has been rather stale the last few years and there's been nothing truly groundbreaking. I hope the post-pandemic world ushers in a new era for pop themes, as Gaga said during one her acceptance speeches at the 2020 VMA's there will be a new artistic Renaissance. 

[HuffsAhoy 7,433]

48 minutes ago, Lucas said:

I think we want her to go back to dark themes because that's what she does the best

I mean, she made an entire album last year that dealt with mental illness, including a song about wanting to literally die by suicide. How much darker can you get? 

[enissa11 2,984]

9 minutes ago, HuffsAhoy said:

I mean, she made an entire album last year that dealt with mental illness, including a song about wanting to literally die by suicide. How much darker can you get? 

yeah, but i think the darkness of chromatica wasn't executed visually at least, she decided to explore other facets of it with the few music videos we got

[enissa11 2,984]

59 minutes ago, Frank Potion said:

I think what Lil Nas X is doing is genuinely "shocking." 

I never, ever, thought I would see the day that a gay black man would be so upfront and brazen with his sexuality in pop culture and hip hop. The kiss at the BET awards was completely groundbreaking. 

it could have been groundbreaking but for me it lacked a lot, the kiss didn't feel natural and that shouldn't have happened given that's he's actually gay, and the whole shallow Egyptian imagery have been done before a lot in pop, it feels like a costume, i think he has a lot to improve as a performer still... 

[Chlorine 47,976]

2 minutes ago, enissa11 said:

it could have been groundbreaking but for me it lacked a lot, the kiss didn't feel natural and that shouldn't have happened given that's he's actually gay, and the whole shallow Egyptian imagery have been done before a lot in pop, it feels like a costume, i think he has a lot to improve as a performer still... 

I think you're missing the point. 

[Lucas 25,700]

23 minutes ago, HuffsAhoy said:

I mean, she made an entire album last year that dealt with mental illness, including a song about wanting to literally die by suicide. How much darker can you get? 

I'm talking about sounds, visuals etc.

If we talk about lyrics then yeah, songs about mental illness, depression etc, that's what she has been doing since 2013 basically...

[enissa11 2,984]

Just now, Frank Potion said:

I think you're missing the point. 

i'm not, i just think we have to evaluate things beyond the kiss, of course is groundbreaking just the fact to see a black gay man kissing other men on stage, and it's a great step foward for the community, but i'm speaking groundbreaking from an artistic perspective, i don't think it was.

[HuffsAhoy 7,433]

1 minute ago, Lucas said:

I'm talking about sounds, visuals etc.

If we talk about lyrics then yeah, songs about mental illness, depression etc, that's what she has been doing since 2013 basically...

Personally, I found the juxtaposition of the dance club, happy, beats and the melancholy lyrics to be pretty effective. 

[Chlorine 47,976]

3 minutes ago, enissa11 said:

i'm not, i just think we have to evaluate things beyond the kiss, of course is groundbreaking just the fact to see a black gay man kissing other men on stage, and it's a great step foward for the community, but i'm speaking groundbreaking from an artistic perspective, i don't think it was.

Uhh, no, we don't. Because nothing about the performance good or bad takes away from the fact it is groundbreaking for the reason I already stated. Your not liking the performance from an artistic perspective is completely irrelevant.