No Gaga, I am NOT Lebanese, NOR am I ORIENT!!!

[littlepotter 74,657]

13 minutes ago, Adarsh said:

@littlepotter I think we’re all Lebanese 

Periat

I know the gays here were shook by it and of course loved it

People should really stop trying to play smartasses. When a song's message is clearly inclusivity don't go getting hung up on semantics

[Bonkers 28,469]

1 minute ago, littlepotter said:

When a song's message is clearly inclusivity don't go getting hung up on semantics

wow, so I guess it's ok to be anti-semantics on GGD now.  

[Oriane 20,069]

For real, everytime she says "you're orient", I hear "you're Oriane" and I'm like

[Galactic Mess 1,393]

1 hour ago, LaLa said:

The word "oriental" is used for objects. You're totally cool to say "oriental art" or "oriental rug" for example. But people are Asian broadly, not Oriental. @Franch Toast explainer on the previous page is great

Can't you call a building or an object western, though? That doesn't dehumanize western people. I am aware orientalism throughout the 19th and the beginning of the 20th century was all about the west creating a stereotypical - and imaginary - image of all eastern cutures, describring "orientals" as less rational and less trustworthy people, and so on (i.e. racially inferior). However, I'm not sure the word oriental still preserves its offensive meaning nowadays. At least in my language, it's mostly not considered offensive to call somebody oriental. In english, I don't know.

[Oriane 20,069]

3 minutes ago, Galactic Mess said:

Can't you call a building or an object western, though? That doesn't dehumanize western people. I am aware orientalism throughout the 19th and the beginning of the 20th century was all about the west creating a stereotypical - and imaginary - image of all eastern cutures, describring "orientals" as less rational and less trustworthy people, and so on (i.e. racially inferior). However, I'm not sure the word oriental still preserves its offensive meaning nowadays. At least in my language, it's mostly not considered offensive to call somebody oriental. In english, I don't know.

That's what I was thinking, isn't "oriental" to the Orient world just what "western" is to the Western world?

[LaLa 19,265]

3 minutes ago, Galactic Mess said:

Can't you call a building or an object western, though? That doesn't dehumanize western people. I am aware orientalism throughout the 19th and the beginning of the 20th century was all about the west creating a stereotypical - and imaginary - image of all eastern cutures, describring "orientals" as less rational and less trustworthy people, and so on (i.e. racially inferior). However, I'm not sure the word oriental still preserves its offensive meaning nowadays. At least in my language, it's mostly not considered offensive to call somebody oriental. In english, I don't know.

In English, it is considered offensive. Not the same level as a slur, per se, but outdated for sure. Sort of like if your Grandma called a Black person 'coloured'. She's not trying to be offensive or hurtful, but language has evolved and we don't say that anymore. 

[Sneaky Oliver 21,550]

6 minutes ago, Oriane said:

That's what I was thinking, isn't "oriental" to the Orient world just what "western" is to the Western world?

That would be eastern 

[Bonkers 28,469]

6 minutes ago, LaLa said:

In English, it is considered offensive. Not the same level as a slur, per se, but outdated for sure. Sort of like if your Grandma called a Black person 'coloured'. She's not trying to be offensive or hurtful, but language has evolved and we don't say that anymore. 

I agree with this.  

The only reason I would "argue" it is because I was there when the change happened.  Young people already were using the word "asian" but old men mostly just couldn't stop themselves from saying "orientals".   What we were being taught in school - and what asians were saying was "WE'RE NOT ALL ORIENTAL".   They weren't saying "we're not objects!"

This thing where it's about non-human nouns is new to me.  Since it's in the dictionary, and since I don't know anybody who would have a reason to want to call someone oriental, it makes sense to accept it, I guess I'm just stuck on it because it wasn't the reason we were given at the time.  

And then like i said there are other regions like Mediterranean, Polynesian, Eastern European where we do use those to describe humans and usually rules in English apply across the board. 

Like you said, it's not a slur in the same way as other words so I agree with you, but if it is accurately used for someone FROM the Orient (not their ethnicity or heritage) then it's worth avoiding but not really all THAT offensive.   People are always looking for new ways to be offended, I guess that's why I'm saying something when I could just shut up.  

[FfFfFfFF 54,411]

Gaga pulling a:

[LaLa 19,265]

6 minutes ago, Bonkers said:

I agree with this.  

The only reason I would "argue" it is because I was there when the change happened.  Young people already were using the word "asian" but old men mostly just couldn't stop themselves from saying "orientals".   What we were being taught in school - and what asians were saying was "WE'RE NOT ALL ORIENTAL".   They weren't saying "we're not objects!"

This thing where it's about non-human nouns is new to me.  Since it's in the dictionary, and since I don't know anybody who would have a reason to want to call someone oriental, it makes sense to accept it, I guess I'm just stuck on it because it wasn't the reason we were given at the time.  

And then like i said there are other regions like Mediterranean, Polynesian, Eastern European where we do use those to describe humans and usually rules in English apply across the board. 

Like you said, it's not a slur in the same way as other words so I agree with you, but if it is accurately used for someone FROM the Orient (not their ethnicity or heritage) then it's worth avoiding but not really all THAT offensive.   People are always looking for new ways to be offended, I guess that's why I'm saying something when I could just shut up.  

Yeah, I'm 34 so while I used 'Grandma' in my example, for me it was people of my parents generation still using Oriental.

And in thinking about it, I don't ever hear anyone describe Asia as The Orient these days. Like, I can't imagine anyone saying 'oh, I'm going to the Orient on holiday' or 'she's from The Orient', that in itself seems quite old fashioned to me. I think outside of objects (rug, pottery, etc) I just never hear it, so I don't question the change in usage. I would still say "I'm going to the Mediterranean", that seems more normal. 

I really don't see it as "people looking to be offended", it's like Gaga said in her recent speech, we're all in the process of un-learning problematic things we've never thought twice about. I really do wonder what she thinks about those lyrics now. 

[auburn 1,072]

1 hour ago, littlepotter said:

Periat

I know the gays here were shook by it and of course loved it

People should really stop trying to play smartasses. When a song's message is clearly inclusivity don't go getting hung up on semantics

Between this and the government banning BTW because of Judas, Lebanon was really shook by anything this woman did.

[Gagas lil monster 2,432]

2 hours ago, LaLa said:

The word "oriental" is used for objects. You're totally cool to say "oriental art" or "oriental rug" for example. But people are Asian broadly, not Oriental. @Franch Toast explainer on the previous page is great

But Orient has many countries. Wouldn't it be like saying people are European and objects are European. I'm not trying to come across as ignorant or rude just trying to understand 

[littlepotter 74,657]

2 hours ago, auburn said:

Between this and the government banning BTW because of Judas, Lebanon was really shook by anything this woman did.

Don't forget bloody mary hitting #1 on our irrelevant charts