Bernie doesn’t support defunding the police either

[Lion Heart 15,041]

I keep saying that "DEFUNDING police" is political suicide outside a few hyper liberal districts. Its really smart of him and Biden to distance themselves from such a drastic position. Only a small minority of voters actually support defunding police according to most recent and relevant polls.

[mucinex 4,260]

Just now, StarstruckIllusion said:

and have what, lawlessness? Clearly that’s not what you mean. Since Bernie supports radial and effective change here, as he usually does, seems like you’re literally getting hung up on the name “police.”

I want a new form of law enforcement where officers are trained to deal with situations more properly. In order for my ideal law enforcement to happen, we have to get rid of the system that's currently in place, not just give officers extra training. The social contract is broken and the system is corrupt. I know this is something that would take time and compromising, but I am not willing to settle for extra money to be wasted training the people who are currently upholding the corruption. 

[Morphine Prince 109,983]

“Defund” is the wrong word because most people do not understand what it actually means. 

But police needs to be demilitarized and new training needs to take place. 

They SHOULD defund it and take that money and invest it in vulnerable communities. 

[StarstruckIllusion 53,681]

10 minutes ago, Matt Amor said:

I want a new form of law enforcement where officers are trained to deal with situations more properly. In order for my ideal law enforcement to happen, we have to get rid of the system that's currently in place, not just give officers extra training. The social contract is broken and the system is corrupt. I know this is something that would take time and compromising, but I am not willing to settle for extra money to be wasted training the people who are currently upholding the corruption. 

You’re literally getting hung up on the word police then... the majority of the west agrees paragraph. 

Reform ≠ defund.

[StarstruckIllusion 53,681]

13 minutes ago, Lion Heart said:

I keep saying that "DEFUNDING police" is political suicide outside a few hyper liberal districts. Its really smart of him and Biden to distance themselves from such a drastic position. Only a small minority of voters actually support defunding police according to most recent and relevant polls.

It’s at 16% support acc to a YouGov poll... I think it was a radical statement just to push everyone to talk about reform, so in that way, it’s kinda smart. Thank god Bernie and Biden didn’t fall for it. 

3 minutes ago, Morphine Prince said:

“Defund” is the wrong word because most people do not understand what it actually means. 

But police needs to be demilitarized and new training needs to take place. 

They SHOULD defund it and take that money and invest it in vulnerable communities. 

Tea to everything but training isn’t free tho. We should get all radical change we need, and worry about the cost later. If giving the police +$1B prevents things like George Floyd... write the check and leave a lipstick kiss.

[AsleepOnTheCeiling 6,998]

52 minutes ago, PunkTheFunk said:

Why are small town police departments equipped like armies from sci-fi movies but doctors have to operate on patients with some toothpicks and scotch tape?

Because hospitals are private businesses. 

[mucinex 4,260]

2 minutes ago, StarstruckIllusion said:

You’re literally getting hung up on the word police then... the majority of the west agrees paragraph. 

Reform ≠ defund.

 

The tone you're taking in this thread is very hostile & it makes me not want to interact anymore. It's especially frustrating when you're the one who started this thread. You should've expected opposition in a thread about politics. I feel like you invited us all over for a party but you're yelling at us for suggesting a different party game. 

 

I understand that reform ≠ defund.

I want reform + defund, it's that simple. 

 

I'm not afraid of the word police, I'm afraid of the literal police who are brutalizing people like me who attend peaceful protests. It's ridiculous that I have to prepare riot gear to protest in the 'land of the free.'

 

[AsleepOnTheCeiling 6,998]

I've seen so many ideas about how police reform could be handled, and some of them seem decent.

Police should not be allowed to choke people in any circumstance. 

They should not be allowed to use tear gas or less than lethal weapons. 

Attacking marked medics should be treated like the war crime it is. 

Police should be held accountable, legally and financially. Lawsuits should not be paid for by taxpayers. A recommendation I saw was requiring them to carry liability insurance or taking it out of pensions. 

There should be a two year phase in period during which law enforcement would have to obtain a 2 year degree. No extra bs classes determined by universities, but the essentials. 

Reducing the number of officers patrolling, and taking steps to ensure there is no police state. 

[StarstruckIllusion 53,681]

2 minutes ago, Matt Amor said:

 

The tone you're taking in this thread is very hostile & it makes me not want to interact anymore. It's especially frustrating when you're the one who started this thread. You should've expected opposition in a thread about politics. I feel like you invited us all over for a party but you're yelling at us for suggesting a different party game. 

 

I understand that reform ≠ defund.

I want reform + defund, it's that simple. 

 

I'm not afraid of the word police, I'm afraid of the literal police who are brutalizing people like me who attend peaceful protests. It's ridiculous that I have to prepare riot gear to protest in the 'land of the free.'

 

??? what negative tone? You’re the one adding that, not me. I always debate people in political threads, and you can ask dozens of people here to verify that too

[Morphine Prince 109,983]

11 minutes ago, StarstruckIllusion said:

Tea to everything but training isn’t free tho. We should get all radical change we need, and worry about the cost later. If giving the police +$1B prevents things like George Floyd... write the check and leave a lipstick kiss.

The thing is, some police departments get funding increase every period and that same money could be used for training, etc. 

But an initial increase and then gradual defunding is what I think will be the most realistic approach. 

[auburn 1,072]

Welp. Defund it anyways. 

[mucinex 4,260]

1 minute ago, StarstruckIllusion said:

??? what negative tone? You’re the one adding that, not me. I always debate people in political threads, and you can ask dozens of people here to verify that too

 

Your response felt fairly hostile given the context in which you responded to me. You pretty much just claimed I was hung up on one word and then treated me as if I don't know that defunding and reform are two completely separate ideologies.

If I wanted to argue semantics with you I would've focused on the grammatical errors in your response. If I was hung up on words I would've only centered my response on one word. 

I am trying to have a focused conversation, telling you my methods on how I would approach this situation because you seemed to be opposed to my first comment and doubted my knowledge on the subject. 

 

17 minutes ago, StarstruckIllusion said:

You’re literally getting hung up on the word police then... the majority of the west agrees paragraph. 

Reform ≠ defund.

 

[StarstruckIllusion 53,681]

Just now, Morphine Prince said:

The thing is, some police departments get funding increase every period and that same money could be used for training, etc. 

But an initial increase and then gradual defunding is what I think will be the most realistic approach. 

Also, a lot of police departments are already underfunded, so they resort to “broken window policing” which attacks low hanging fruit crimes to boost funding. It serves aggressive over-policing of minority communities, which often creates more problems than it solves.

Plus a lot of officers can’t think as clearly as we do sometimes, partly bc of PTSD from seeing blown out brains from suicide and things like that constantly. So I hope the reform includes better therapy for officers + a nice goodbye-salary package if it’s decided they’re too out of it to serve too. 

I’m absolutely not trying to get sympathy for bad cops, but clearly their lack of reckoning with what they’ve seen + other things, are harming the whole planet. 

[Bt1 5,213]

Wow. Thank you Bernie. That takes courage. 

[Economy 53,112]

6 hours ago, PunkTheFunk said:

Why are small town police departments equipped like armies from sci-fi movies but doctors have to operate on patients with some toothpicks and scotch tape?

The extreme exxageration tho

 

Healthcare is the biggest cost for pretty much every Government in the world even the US which covers so little. 

 

The medical equipment in hospitals is way more expensive than police equipment as are doctors wages

 

Healthcare should be a priority anyway and theres good arguments that police departments could do with less but ppl always acting like the police gets all this money and not healthcare. That's not based on any truth what's so ever