Star Trek: My Growing Hatred For Voyager

[Economy 50,318]

Hey star Trek fans @gabeoz @Glamourpuss @Woolfsmck @Doot (I know doot ur only a casual whatcher at best but I got few ppl I can tag )

 

I wanna discuss how the 4th series Voyager keeps standing out more and more everytime I rewhatch some episodes how horribly done some of the writing and acting is on this particular star Trek Series 

 

#1 Of all 7 Star Trek series out so far Voyager is arguably the very worst for constantly contradicting itself. I can't even begin to list all the stuff they say in one episode that they totally disregard in another

 

#2 they throw so many obvious problems under the rug when they don't wanna deal with it in the story. Like the maquis crew almost instantly getting perfectly along with the Starfleet crew that absorbed them right on season 1? Really??? They literally had 1 episode in the beggining that showed tension and they instantly moved on wtf is that?

 

#3 Don't get me started on the characters. Captain Janeway can't act to save her life and most characters are either way too overly formal with little human emotion and their lines seem overly rehearsed (yes Harry Kim, Chakotay, Kes I'm talking about you) and the ones that have more personality like the doctor or neelix are the other extreme and a total overkill

 

#4 They do sh*t that makes 0 sense. For example why is Neelix the Cook/Chef or even worse Kes that has 0 skills or importance and the biggest job she ever has being a helping nurse.... Why the heck are they always in important senior officer secret meetings? Are they put there just cause they are part of the main cast with no consideration why it makes no sense that they are there?

 

It was my fav Star Trek as a kid and is what first got me into the franchise but I've developed a serious love hate relationship with it. It's soon poorly done in so many aspects

[berlinforme 5,328]

But is it really worse than the other shows? 

Recently I've found the plot holes in Picard to be way worse (because I don't expect that much from a 90s/early 2000s show like Voyager). Speaking of expectation - I was so disappointed by Discovery. Such a high production quality, but such a bad writing

[gabeoz 7,915]

There's a reason why it's considered one of the worst shows in the Star Trek community and Janeway is often referred to as Warlord Janeway 

I still enjoy Voyager, but there are definitely a lot of aspects of the show that constantly contradicts itself or is just annoying (looking at you Neelix, and those long drawn out episodes of the doctor teaching music to some random civilizations). I really like the premise of the show, but I feel it wasted its potential as it really introduced some interesting species/powers in the Star Trek universe but never really built upon them.

 

26 minutes ago, berlinforme said:

But is it really worse than the other shows? 

Recently I've found the plot holes in Picard to be way worse (because I don't expect that much from a 90s/early 2000s show like Voyager). Speaking of expectation - I was so disappointed by Discovery. Such a high production quality, but such a bad writing

I really really enjoyed the first season of Picard (probably my fav season of any star trek show to date) but I do agree that there were quite a few plot holes, I feel that's a symptom of them trying to branch out the story line in so many places and then piecing it all together at the perfect time in the last episode. I feel if the season had been longer than 10 episodes then it would have given them the chance to really flesh out the bits that needed it.

 As for Discovery, the first season really did struggle with writing in some parts (looking at you, the first episode), but it definitely got a lot better in the second season. So now with Discovery jumping 900 years into the future I'm actually really looking forward to the third season. 

[Economy 50,318]

28 minutes ago, berlinforme said:

But is it really worse than the other shows? 

Recently I've found the plot holes in Picard to be way worse (because I don't expect that much from a 90s/early 2000s show like Voyager). Speaking of expectation - I was so disappointed by Discovery. Such a high production quality, but such a bad writing

I find discovery weak too tbh especially for a new show. I've whatched it just cuz I'm a star trek fan but it could have been better

 

Which plot holes did u find in Picard? I honestly didn't notice any

 

But yes Voyager is worse than the others. Especially when it comes to contradictions or the characters not being believable. They were over rehearsed robots

 

Obviously Voyager had better graphics than say TOS for example and even the next generation simply because it was newer. And some aspects of TOS the production is far too old and dated to compare

 

But in some aspects I do find Voyager exeptionally poorly done when it came to the stuff I mentioned

 

 

[Economy 50,318]

10 minutes ago, gabeoz said:

There's a reason why it's considered one of the worst shows in the Star Trek community and Janeway is often referred to as Warlord Janeway 

I still enjoy Voyager, but there are definitely a lot of aspects of the show that constantly contradicts itself or is just annoying (looking at you Neelix, and those long drawn out episodes of the doctor teaching music to some random civilizations). I really like the premise of the show, but I feel it wasted its potential as it really introduced some interesting species/powers in the Star Trek universe but never really built upon them.

 

I really really enjoyed the first season of Picard (probably my fav season of any star trek show to date) but I do agree that there were quite a few plot holes, I feel that's a symptom of them trying to branch out the story line in so many places and then piecing it all together at the perfect time in the last episode. I feel if the season had been longer than 10 episodes then it would have given them the chance to really flesh out the bits that needed it.

 As for Discovery, the first season really did struggle with writing in some parts (looking at you, the first episode), but it definitely got a lot better in the second season. So now with Discovery jumping 900 years into the future I'm actually really looking forward to the third season. 

I agree discovery improved in season 2

 

Yeah honestly, if Voyager built up on stuff more without constantly rushing thru obvious plots and situations (like the Maquis-Starfleet crew blend I mentioned or big powers they encountered like u said) it would have at least made more sense

 

And the crew like I said sounded overly rehearsed and not human. They were way too formal

 

DS9 and Enterprise did much better if having a cast that actually sounded and acted human. Even the Next Generation did better than Voyager there

 

In Voyager I didn't feel like I was whatching people. I was whatching robots that perfectly remembered their lines

[Doot 2]

I think it's been decades since they've made a Star Trek show that's become a massive hit within their fandom. 

[Economy 50,318]

8 minutes ago, Doot said:

I think it's been decades since they've made a Star Trek show that's become a massive hit within their fandom. 

Tbh lol

 

Discovery and Picard which are both running now have very good ratings (especially Star Trek Picard) but it almost seems more popular among gp and casual fans than real hardcore fans

 

And the 5th series Enterprise (the last one before Discovery) was probably the least successful of all 7 series to date

 

Voyager was probably the last major hit both with fan base and gp at the same time

 

But tbh fans are being sucks. Did they honestly expect a remake of The Next Generation? The audience and times have changed. Of course u have to change the style

 

I'm a huge fan of the new Star Trek Picard and accept it for its changes. Although the 6th series Discovery was a bit of a let down for me

 

I don't know which if the star Trek series uve whatched tho so I dunno what u can compare

[Woolfsmck 2,763]

8 hours ago, Economy said:

Hey star Trek fans @gabeoz @Glamourpuss @Woolfsmck @Doot (I know doot ur only a casual whatcher at best but I got few ppl I can tag )

 

I wanna discuss how the 4th series Voyager keeps standing out more and more everytime I rewhatch some episodes how horribly done some of the writing and acting is on this particular star Trek Series 

 

#1 Of all 7 Star Trek series out so far Voyager is arguably the very worst for constantly contradicting itself. I can't even begin to list all the stuff they say in one episode that they totally disregard in another

 

#2 they throw so many obvious problems under the rug when they don't wanna deal with it in the story. Like the maquis crew almost instantly getting perfectly along with the Starfleet crew that absorbed them right on season 1? Really??? They literally had 1 episode in the beggining that showed tension and they instantly moved on wtf is that?

 

#3 Don't get me started on the characters. Captain Janeway can't act to save her life and most characters are either way too overly formal with little human emotion and their lines seem overly rehearsed (yes Harry Kim, Chakotay, Kes I'm talking about you) and the ones that have more personality like the doctor or neelix are the other extreme and a total overkill

 

#4 They do sh*t that makes 0 sense. For example why is Neelix the Cook/Chef or even worse Kes that has 0 skills or importance and the biggest job she ever has being a helping nurse.... Why the heck are they always in important senior officer secret meetings? Are they put there just cause they are part of the main cast with no consideration why it makes no sense that they are there?

 

It was my fav Star Trek as a kid and is what first got me into the franchise but I've developed a serious love hate relationship with it. It's soon poorly done in so many aspects

I wasn't into the story that much...and most of the characters were kinda blah...

[Economy 50,318]

14 hours ago, Woolfsmck said:

I wasn't into the story that much...and most of the characters were kinda blah...

U sound like a Next Generation kind of guy 

[Guest]

So far it's the best I've seen pre-Discovery. TNG is a snooze fest tho, the later seasons are especially horrible, filler after filler except for a few notable episodes. It focused way too much on the crew, every episode about a crew member with a problem, and hardly on space/exploration. Voyager's first five seasons are great and entertaining, on season 6 now

[Woolfsmck 2,763]

6 hours ago, Economy said:

U sound like a Next Generation kind of guy 

Next gen...almost the movies ... AND.. 

The originsl...

The spin offs aren't bad , I just didn't follow along with the characters very much....😴

[Economy 50,318]

6 hours ago, BadMonster said:

So far it's the best I've seen pre-Discovery. TNG is a snooze fest tho, the later seasons are especially horrible, filler after filler except for a few notable episodes. It focused way too much on the crew, every episode about a crew member with a problem, and hardly on space/exploration. Voyager's first five seasons are great and entertaining, on season 6 now

Ur whatching Voyager now? U enjoy it?

[Guest]

6 hours ago, Economy said:

Ur whatching Voyager now? U enjoy it?

Yeah, seen the first five seasons now and I like it a lot. I started with TOS, but had to stop. Then tried Enterprise but couldn't get into it, I'll try them again after I finish VOY or after DS9, think it might help now I'm more familiar with the universe. I really didn't like TNG all that much in the end, cuz it dragged on for too long. The later seasons were too predictable and kinda repetitious, it should've ended after five seasons or they should've done more with space exploration

[Jonathanholland 5,365]

As a kid I loved Voyager and I still do. Janeway, Chakotay, Seven of Nine, Doc and Torres are all great characters. Some episodes are tedious but the overall story is pretty great. 

Neelix should have been left in season one tho 

[Economy 50,318]

2 hours ago, BadMonster said:

Yeah, seen the first five seasons now and I like it a lot. I started with TOS, but had to stop. Then tried Enterprise but couldn't get into it, I'll try them again after I finish VOY or after DS9, think it might help now I'm more familiar with the universe. I really didn't like TNG all that much in the end, cuz it dragged on for too long. The later seasons were too predictable and kinda repetitious, it should've ended after five seasons or they should've done more with space exploration

DS9 is my fav Star Trek series. It has the most in-depth stories and ongoing plots. It has deep political problems too. It's also a much darker side to the federation that shows humans and federation in the future still have have their dark sides and when faced under pressure situations don't always resort to the moral thing to do

 

I warn u tho DS9 started slow AF and took time to start building. I'm not sure the writers at first knew where they were going with it. It's not until well into season 2 or 3 that a lot of the major plots start to develop

 

Deep Space 9 starts very episodic in the beggining like The Next Generation, Original Series and Voyager... But in time it starts to also develop long arc plots... Plots that develop and continue over many seasons which I found cool

 

Enterprise is the only other one of the first 5 series besides DS9 that also has long arc plots too but DS9 has more of them and over a longer period of time

 

Speaking of Enterprise, I did not like it at first either but u may appreciate it more later... When u have a good feel of the star Trek universe it's a little easier to appreciate a prequel and see how things developed in the beggining