Is Gaga still an idea leader?

[C1trus 4,341]

Yeah she is. It's just that she's not credited much.

[AJRocketMan 2,684]

Unfortunately, no, she isn’t. She hasn’t done something truly subversive or challenging towards the social norm in years. ARTPOP was the last time she was actually subversive. It may have been the only time. Born This Way was more transgressive than it was subversive. TF + M weren’t subversive or transgressive, just interesting and refreshing. I’m hoping she still has it in her. I’

On 5/5/2019 at 3:38 PM, AlexanderMagno said:

I don’t agree. I think the “simple” idea started much sooner, back to Adele’s incredible success. The only pop artist who was not “simple” was Miley, but she came from a whole different place, being a teen pop artist who was rebelling from her roots. But Gaga tried to succeed with an old formula, releasing ARTPOP, and she failed. And then C2C and Joanne happened.

As it has been said for years now, looking back it seems that her best ideas were the result of an amazing team. You can’t justify her sudden fall from high-concept ideas simply for lack of money or support, since she has both. Her last “big” ideas came from ARTPOP’s scrapped plans, who went down after Troy left.

I do think that Gaga herself is a woman of simpler ideas. She’s not incredibly revolutionary herself (I mean, she is of course, but she’s not the creator of revolutionary ideas, she’s the vessel for those ideas).

The fact that she’s transformed into a totally different person makes it easy to believe that statement, but I do believe that she was behind the majority of those ideas. I truly feel she still has it inside of her, but she either lost interest or she feels pressure to abandon her old style in order to prove she has become more “mature” or whatever. Nevertheless, the support of a highly competent and imaginative team to back her up made those ideas a lot more possible. Her input has probably ranged from abstract statements to hands-on involvement over the years.

And you’re right about the “simple” thing; Gaga didn’t start any of that. The “simple” trend actually started in reaction to Gaga’s classic style. It’s the reason why Lana Del Rey actually got a chance at a musical career—because people who didn’t like Gaga were desperate for anyone who was totally antithetical to her.

On 5/5/2019 at 4:11 PM, Sam98 said:

This is possibly the interpretation I thought I'd never read on here tbh  by saying this, you're basically stripping her from her own creativity, but she has, in my opinion, a too complicated mind to not think of her as THE artist behind her products.

The fact that her creativity changed so much during the second half of her career is naturally due to her growing up and colliding with the reality surrounding her and the rest of the world. How could she still have the same mindset of ten years ago? You can't expect that. She was young and hopefully convinced she could change the world, and she arguably did, but then things happen and they change how you view yourself and your world. 

Her team was abviously a huge component of her success and artistic outcome, but I will always strongly believe she has always been the prime mover of it all

”Growing up” isn’t an excuse. Gaga was a FULL GROWN WOMAN when she debuted. She had a very strong sense of who she was as a person and more importantly as an artist. Then, when ARTPOP happened, she decided to give up on everything that made her who she is, and embrace a more unpretentious and stripped-down image and style. That is the last thing I ever expected Gaga would do back in the classic Gaga years. It truly shocked me when she released Joanne, even if I enjoyed the album. With Cheek to Cheek and more definitively Joanne, she transformed into someone who was no longer a conceptual artist on a mission and instead a singer and musician who does what she does because she just loves it. This is a dramatic shift in essence and approach. It’s like seeing Nina Hagen transform into Natalie Merchant. Just look at her interviews. Her thought patterns changed.

Look at Michael Jackson and Madonna at the beginning of their solo careers and look at them a decade later. They became older and wiser, but their essence remained. They were able to evolve as artists and as people while still remaining true to their signature styles. That easily could have been Gaga, but everyone expects her to move further away from what made her a great artist and revolutionary person in order for her to remain relevant, because the GP somehow thinks her old style is too “immature” to stick by.

On 5/6/2019 at 5:14 PM, Infinity Wave said:

Now lemme say

THE F*CK YES

That was awesome, but that’s not an example of a visionary/idea leader. That’s a woman expressing her passion for camp and fashion. And it was appropriate for the situation at hand.

[HotLikeMexico 5,196]

On 5/5/2019 at 1:23 PM, River said:

Joanne actually had more impact than you think, the "simple" idea was actually pretty shocking and controversial for a singer like Gaga and it had a great impact, many singers started to dress simple and to make less EDM music, suddenly we are getting more songs with 90's-early 00's kind of pop.

 

FINALLY! This!!!! 

 

Joanne is SHOCKING. People fail to realize that Joanne was unusual for Gaga. That sheer simplicity of it, the vulnerability she shows, her anger, her sadness, her happiness mixed into the songs. Everything about it showed the world who the woman behind the over the top outfits and theatrics were.

And that in itself is a shock. It was so atypical of her. You may argue that Cheek to Cheek was a preview but everyone at the time was expecting LG5 to be a return to the old Gaga.  

[HotLikeMexico 5,196]

11 minutes ago, AJRocketMan said:

Unfortunately, no, she isn’t. She hasn’t done something truly subversive or challenging towards the social norm in years. ARTPOP was the last time she was actually subversive. It may have been the only time. Born This Way was more transgressive than it was subversive. TF + M weren’t subversive or transgressive, just interesting and refreshing. I’m hoping she still has it in her. I’

The fact that she’s transformed into a totally different person makes it easy to believe that statement, but I do believe that she was behind the majority of those ideas. I truly feel she still has it inside of her, but she either lost interest or she feels pressure to abandon her old style in order to prove she has become more “mature” or whatever. Nevertheless, the support of a highly competent and imaginative team to back her up made those ideas a lot more possible. Her input has probably ranged from abstract statements to hands-on involvement over the years.

And you’re right about the “simple” thing; Gaga didn’t start any of that. The “simple” trend actually started in reaction to Gaga’s classic style. It’s the reason why Lana Del Rey actually got a chance at a musical career—because people who didn’t like Gaga were desperate for anyone who was totally antithetical to her.

”Growing up” isn’t an excuse. Gaga was a FULL GROWN WOMAN when she debuted. She had a very strong sense of who she was as a person and more importantly as an artist. Then, when ARTPOP happened, she decided to give up on everything that made her who she is, and embrace a more unpretentious and stripped-down image and style. That is the last thing I ever expected Gaga would do back in the classic Gaga years. It truly shocked me when she released Joanne, even if I enjoyed the album. With Cheek to Cheek and more definitively Joanne, she transformed into someone who was no longer a conceptual artist on a mission and instead a singer and musician who does what she does because she just loves it. This is a dramatic shift in essence and approach. It’s like seeing Nina Hagen transform into Natalie Merchant. Just look at her interviews. Her thought patterns changed.

Look at Michael Jackson and Madonna at the beginning of their solo careers and look at them a decade later. They became older and wiser, but their essence remained. They were able to evolve as artists and as people while still remaining true to their signature styles. That easily could have been Gaga, but everyone expects her to move further away from what made her a great artist and revolutionary person in order for her to remain relevant, because the GP somehow thinks her old style is too “immature” to stick by.

That was awesome, but that’s not an example of a visionary/idea leader. That’s a woman expressing her passion for camp and fashion. And it was appropriate for the situation at hand.

I disagree when people say age doesn’t play a factor in Gaga’s music. Sure she was a grown woman when she debuted. But someone in their early 20’s compared to someone in their early 30’s are two very different people. You could say the same about yourself as you age. You’re not gonna feel the same way you did then, then you do now. People evolve or change and sometimes you don’t feel the way you felt from start to present. And that’s completely okay. That in itself shows a person/artist’s growth for better or worse.

 

In my opinion, I think it’s for the better. She’s literally one of the most versatile artists out there among others. 

[JR Gg 12,985]

Anyone could have done a jazz album and did well?  Like god please, CTC is like the first full jazz album to debut at no.1 in YEARS

If other popstars did a jazz album, it would've flopped hard lol. 

[brucee 1,690]

delete

[brucee 1,690]

sorry cause i said things in an angry way. 

lemme fix dat :

She is there for one reason : her abilities as a musician. She managed to get to Fame because of that, because she was writing for people, and then managed to make it as a solo artist, and then met Dada that helped her shape something some of you may regret, but what is Gaga, and her love for art and performance, it's still there and will never leave her, and she always hs a point of view on things she puts out in the world. So YES gaga is still an idea leader. 

Look at all the girls now she raised standards in pop music, because she has a rebel heart. That cannot change. 

 

 

 

[FfFfFfFF 56,089]

I don't understand how some you can still call yourselves fans. 

[bloody g 31,746]

Joanne became a HUGE trend. And after seeing how crazy enigma is, I do think Gaga is an innovator. Just look at her met gala concept. Every time she turns it out. 

Everything she does she does it with so much passion and with her Gaga twist, with her art. No matter what.

[Sid 6,755]

6 hours ago, brucee said:

sorry cause i said things in an angry way. 

lemme fix dat :

She is there for one reason : her abilities as a musician. She managed to get to Fame because of that, because she was writing for people, and then managed to make it as a solo artist, and then met Dada that helped her shape something some of you may regret, but what is Gaga, and her love for art and performance, it's still there and will never leave her, and she always hs a point of view on things she puts out in the world. So YES gaga is still an idea leader. 

Look at all the girls now she raised standards in pop music, because she has a rebel heart. That cannot change. 

 

 

 

We were talking more about pushing boundaries and the cultural narrative, we all know she loves art n performance 😁 

5 hours ago, FfFfFfFF said:

I don't understand how some you can still call yourselves fans. 

Sorry some of us like to have intelligent discussions about pop stars' careers. I'm not going to sit here and make a thousand threads about which Gaga song makes me feel like sunshine and rainbows  

 

Some of you have raised excellent points, thanks so much for your input. 

I think the general vibe coming from this thread is that while Gaga fell off a bit during AP and Joanne, we're hoping she finds her creative groove with LG6 

 

[FfFfFfFF 56,089]

3 hours ago, Sid said:

We were talking more about pushing boundaries and the cultural narrative, we all know she loves art n performance 😁 

Sorry some of us like to have intelligent discussions about pop stars' careers. I'm not going to sit here and make a thousand threads about which Gaga song makes me feel like sunshine and rainbows  

 

Some of you have raised excellent points, thanks so much for your input. 

I think the general vibe coming from this thread is that while Gaga fell off a bit during AP and Joanne, we're hoping she finds her creative groove with LG6 

 

Pop stars careers (Gaga included?) are discussed on atrl. On this Lady Gaga fansite the discussion should take place in a different manner. 

[Sid 6,755]

1 minute ago, FfFfFfFF said:

Pop stars careers (Gaga included?) are discussed on atrl. On this Lady Gaga fansite the discussion should take place in a different manner. 

Okay, next time I see a post about Ava Max or Billie Eilish I will redirect them to atrl. 

I didn't post anything disrespectful or inflammatory. You could always add your own opinion on the matter instead of complaining about my thread 

[FfFfFfFF 56,089]

7 minutes ago, Sid said:

Okay, next time I see a post about Ava Max or Billie Eilish I will redirect them to atrl. 

I didn't post anything disrespectful or inflammatory. You could always add your own opinion on the matter instead of complaining about my thread 

So you feel like my comment was directed at you, but you also say that everything you said was normal so why so? 

[Mirages 20,259]

On 5/5/2019 at 10:30 PM, Sid said:

I get what you mean, Miley definitely ripped a page out of her book, but I honestly can't think of any other radio songs that are similar. The trap and 90s vibe right now was definitely not present on Joanne.

 Say Something  by the Man of the Woods 

 

[Sid 6,755]

37 minutes ago, FfFfFfFF said:

So you feel like my comment was directed at you, but you also say that everything you said was normal so why so? 

Because you came into my thread and told me that we shouldn't discuss pop star's careers?