Cardi ends conservative commentator

[Emvee 8,442]

Belcalis the Destroyer 

[ZiggyZiggs 30,062]

Ugh I love her

[Florian 19,982]

Cardi 2-0 Bigots

[Morphine Prince 106,325]

 

[StrawberryBlond 14,900]

I feel like this is a very difficult situation. As a woman and feminist, I know how mixed views on the subject of sexuality is the most contentious issue within feminism. There doesn't always seem to be a right and wrong although I still struggle to understand why any feminist would support the sexualisation and commodification of women's bodies through the sex industry, knowing that a lot of those women got into this game because of trauma due to previous sexual abuse and are abused within the industry itself. But it's difficult to know where to draw the line when it comes to displays of sexuality that are fun for all involved and are done in safe environments, like this music video. It's in this middle ground that I exist and I can give a pass to some things but not to others. The only thing that makes me accept a video like this as opposed to other rap videos is that at least it's an all-female crew, there's no men overseeing them or slapping their asses or getting lapdances and grinding against them. Tip Drill, for example, is something I don't condone. But it is still problematic in the sense that these women are still putting their bodies out there for commercial consumption and male validation and that can be a sign of deep insecurity, which is rather sad. Plus, it encourages other women into believing that this is the way forward in life and that if you don't want to be like this, it isn't cool. Cardi may react with the classic "I should be able to dress and act however I want without being violated" but the fact is that plenty of men think that certain women who make certain choices don't deserve respect and that mindset looks unlikely to change as it is so ingrained into our psyche through experience. If you don't treat yourself with respect, don't be surprised when others disrespect you. I notice that she cleverly dodges the question by not explaining why what she's doing empowers women. She's caught up in the trap a lot of modern women do - confusing having fun with being empowered. Two totally different concepts. Sexuality may be fun but it won't empower you and you're in a bad place when you think it can. It's easy to confuse sexual pleasure with empowerment but don't fall for it. I sometimes think a bunch of sexist men dreamed up this linkage of sex and empowerment and sold it to women in the hopes that they'd have a lot of sexual women to drool over for years to come. And unfortunately, a lot of women fell for it.

5 hours ago, swakby said:

I liked her response. I'm sick and tired of uptight women calling themselves feminists and, at the same time, judging other women's choices. 

It works both ways. I have also seen sexual feminists be just as, if not more, judgemental than the uptight ones. They tend to think their way is the only right way, that every woman who thinks otherwise (even if it's for their best interests) is looking to oppress them, that they're just jealous. A lot of these women are terribly insecure, as befits these attitudes. Feminists should be looking out for each other, not bringing each other down and being disrespectful. It ironically shows how sexist society is when we think that a woman who doesn't want to be overtly, publicly sexual and points out issues with that life is automatically uptight. Society wants women to be sexual objects, so naturally, any deviation from this ideal is met with accusations of being uptight. That's why the more conservative feminists and the middle ground ones like me, always have a harder time.

5 hours ago, DiscoHeaven23 said:

Our “Chillin” boy came in to defend Cardi too with this ❤️

 

It's unfortunate that he felt the need to resort to the, ironically sexist, rebuttal of "you're just jealous that you're not like this." It is the ultimate shutdown for any feminist progression for years. Telling a woman that she's just jealous is one of the most sexist ways of shutting down her argument. And again, he's not actually engaging with the question she asked, but dodging it in an attempt to demonise her for being prudish. And the fact his response is seen as something positive is part of the problem. People like this are the first to say that feminism is all about choice and if a woman wants to be sexual that's her choice and she shouldn't be judged for it...but they aren't as protective around women who opt for a different choice. It's almost like...society favours women who are sexual because that's just the way things are.

[Bt1 5,213]

Who knew? Im stanning, but not for her music.

[swakby 4,100]

43 minutes ago, StrawberryBlond said:

I feel like this is a very difficult situation. As a woman and feminist, I know how mixed views on the subject of sexuality is the most contentious issue within feminism. There doesn't always seem to be a right and wrong although I still struggle to understand why any feminist would support the sexualisation and commodification of women's bodies through the sex industry, knowing that a lot of those women got into this game because of trauma due to previous sexual abuse and are abused within the industry itself. But it's difficult to know where to draw the line when it comes to displays of sexuality that are fun for all involved and are done in safe environments, like this music video. It's in this middle ground that I exist and I can give a pass to some things but not to others. The only thing that makes me accept a video like this as opposed to other rap videos is that at least it's an all-female crew, there's no men overseeing them or slapping their asses or getting lapdances and grinding against them. Tip Drill, for example, is something I don't condone. But it is still problematic in the sense that these women are still putting their bodies out there for commercial consumption and male validation and that can be a sign of deep insecurity, which is rather sad. Plus, it encourages other women into believing that this is the way forward in life and that if you don't want to be like this, it isn't cool. Cardi may react with the classic "I should be able to dress and act however I want without being violated" but the fact is that plenty of men think that certain women who make certain choices don't deserve respect and that mindset looks unlikely to change as it is so ingrained into our psyche through experience. If you don't treat yourself with respect, don't be surprised when others disrespect you. I notice that she cleverly dodges the question by not explaining why what she's doing empowers women. She's caught up in the trap a lot of modern women do - confusing having fun with being empowered. Two totally different concepts. Sexuality may be fun but it won't empower you and you're in a bad place when you think it can. It's easy to confuse sexual pleasure with empowerment but don't fall for it. I sometimes think a bunch of sexist men dreamed up this linkage of sex and empowerment and sold it to women in the hopes that they'd have a lot of sexual women to drool over for years to come. And unfortunately, a lot of women fell for it.

It works both ways. I have also seen sexual feminists be just as, if not more, judgemental than the uptight ones. They tend to think their way is the only right way, that every woman who thinks otherwise (even if it's for their best interests) is looking to oppress them, that they're just jealous. A lot of these women are terribly insecure, as befits these attitudes. Feminists should be looking out for each other, not bringing each other down and being disrespectful. It ironically shows how sexist society is when we think that a woman who doesn't want to be overtly, publicly sexual and points out issues with that life is automatically uptight. Society wants women to be sexual objects, so naturally, any deviation from this ideal is met with accusations of being uptight. That's why the more conservative feminists and the middle ground ones like me, always have a harder time.

It's unfortunate that he felt the need to resort to the, ironically sexist, rebuttal of "you're just jealous that you're not like this." It is the ultimate shutdown for any feminist progression for years. Telling a woman that she's just jealous is one of the most sexist ways of shutting down her argument. And again, he's not actually engaging with the question she asked, but dodging it in an attempt to demonise her for being prudish. And the fact his response is seen as something positive is part of the problem. People like this are the first to say that feminism is all about choice and if a woman wants to be sexual that's her choice and she shouldn't be judged for it...but they aren't as protective around women who opt for a different choice. It's almost like...society favours women who are sexual because that's just the way things are.

 I used the word 'uptight' very loosely, what I meant (and people got it thankfully) was that conservative women can be quite unaccepting of women who are more in touch with their sexuality. I never thought about it the other way around so you do seem to have a great point. 

In all fairness, women already have enough on their plates with sexism so they really should be uniting instead of trying to take each other down by not accepting their differences. 

EDIT: Regarding your point about drawing the line, I think you will find this interview from 1990 pretty interesting. Give it a watch!

 

[derpmonster 22,412]

55 minutes ago, StrawberryBlond said:

I feel like this is a very difficult situation. As a woman and feminist, I know how mixed views on the subject of sexuality is the most contentious issue within feminism. There doesn't always seem to be a right and wrong although I still struggle to understand why any feminist would support the sexualisation and commodification of women's bodies through the sex industry, knowing that a lot of those women got into this game because of trauma due to previous sexual abuse and are abused within the industry itself. But it's difficult to know where to draw the line when it comes to displays of sexuality that are fun for all involved and are done in safe environments, like this music video. It's in this middle ground that I exist and I can give a pass to some things but not to others. The only thing that makes me accept a video like this as opposed to other rap videos is that at least it's an all-female crew, there's no men overseeing them or slapping their asses or getting lapdances and grinding against them. Tip Drill, for example, is something I don't condone. But it is still problematic in the sense that these women are still putting their bodies out there for commercial consumption and male validation and that can be a sign of deep insecurity, which is rather sad. Plus, it encourages other women into believing that this is the way forward in life and that if you don't want to be like this, it isn't cool. Cardi may react with the classic "I should be able to dress and act however I want without being violated" but the fact is that plenty of men think that certain women who make certain choices don't deserve respect and that mindset looks unlikely to change as it is so ingrained into our psyche through experience. If you don't treat yourself with respect, don't be surprised when others disrespect you. I notice that she cleverly dodges the question by not explaining why what she's doing empowers women. She's caught up in the trap a lot of modern women do - confusing having fun with being empowered. Two totally different concepts. Sexuality may be fun but it won't empower you and you're in a bad place when you think it can. It's easy to confuse sexual pleasure with empowerment but don't fall for it. I sometimes think a bunch of sexist men dreamed up this linkage of sex and empowerment and sold it to women in the hopes that they'd have a lot of sexual women to drool over for years to come. And unfortunately, a lot of women fell for it.

It works both ways. I have also seen sexual feminists be just as, if not more, judgemental than the uptight ones. They tend to think their way is the only right way, that every woman who thinks otherwise (even if it's for their best interests) is looking to oppress them, that they're just jealous. A lot of these women are terribly insecure, as befits these attitudes. Feminists should be looking out for each other, not bringing each other down and being disrespectful. It ironically shows how sexist society is when we think that a woman who doesn't want to be overtly, publicly sexual and points out issues with that life is automatically uptight. Society wants women to be sexual objects, so naturally, any deviation from this ideal is met with accusations of being uptight. That's why the more conservative feminists and the middle ground ones like me, always have a harder time.

It's unfortunate that he felt the need to resort to the, ironically sexist, rebuttal of "you're just jealous that you're not like this." It is the ultimate shutdown for any feminist progression for years. Telling a woman that she's just jealous is one of the most sexist ways of shutting down her argument. And again, he's not actually engaging with the question she asked, but dodging it in an attempt to demonise her for being prudish. And the fact his response is seen as something positive is part of the problem. People like this are the first to say that feminism is all about choice and if a woman wants to be sexual that's her choice and she shouldn't be judged for it...but they aren't as protective around women who opt for a different choice. It's almost like...society favours women who are sexual because that's just the way things are.

Sexuality is not just fun. It's absolutely empowering when women have been told it's not for them and it's never focused on them but they decide to take control and actually enjoy it. Britney sexuality may not be empowering but Gaga sexuality is. You can't say that no sexuality is and that's its just fun. 

I am all for the choice for women to be sexual or not. And that's why I also absolutely respect those who don't. Have you seen any feminist try to drag Glenn Close for example for being too modest? Or Alexandria Cortez? I don't know who you're thinking of but feminists I've seen don't drag women who choose to be modest. Only those who try to impose their own modesty on others. 

And no, it's not something men came up with and women just fell for. 

[StrawberryBlond 14,900]

On 1/22/2019 at 10:49 PM, swakby said:

 I used the word 'uptight' very loosely, what I meant (and people got it thankfully) was that conservative women can be quite unaccepting of women who are more in touch with their sexuality. I never thought about it the other way around so you do seem to have a great point. 

In all fairness, women already have enough on their plates with sexism so they really should be uniting instead of trying to take each other down by not accepting their differences. 

EDIT: Regarding your point about drawing the line, I think you will find this interview from 1990 pretty interesting. Give it a watch!

 

Oh, I know what you meant. But I'm merely pointing out the unfortunate word choice. There are certain words that really rile feminists up and the accusation of being "uptight" is definitely up there, along with "prudish" and "old-fashioned." These are words that just really shouldn't be uttered in discussions about women's rights. As long as we continue to label women with negative names, feminism will never achieve its aims. And it bugs the hell out of me that women go on about how awful it is to call women sluts and whores (which it is) but seem to think that calling them uptight prudes is perfectly fine.

Agreed, women need to unite in what they agree with, instead of separating themselves on their differences. But when they do want to speak on their differences, they shouldn't be shut down and disrespected as it goes against the entire ethos of feminism to do that.

I've seen that Madonna interview before and honestly, she's not making as much sense as she seems to think she is. She asks "where do we draw the line?" despite the fact that the MTV regulation states that nudity is forbidden, so her question is already answered (it's clear she thinks rules are there to be broken or the ones she agrees with are the only ones worth following), she reverts to talking about violence and how bad that is despite the fact that there's no violence in her video so it has nothing to do with the discussion at hand, she says that no one's concerned if a child is watching someone being ripped apart (even though violence on tv has been one of parents biggest concerns for years), she seems to think that asking your parents about something sexual you've seen on tv is commonplace (when every child, no matter how they were raised, would ever dream of confessing to their parent that they saw something sexual on tv which they shouldn't have been doing) and when asked if she thinks it's ok for kids to see this stuff on tv, she falters a bit because she realises that she never watched tv as a child and therefore, her parents never had this concern, so she's perhaps not the best to judge this situation. It's worth noting that she had no children at this point but when she did, she never let them watch tv. I think that tells you a lot about how hypocritical she's been - let's put controversial stuff on tv to open up important discussion...but I won't let my own kids watch tv because it's garbage. Madonna's never liked being challenged and I think this interview really shows that she's not used to being challenged or been called out on her beliefs often enough.

On 1/22/2019 at 11:05 PM, derpmonster said:

Sexuality is not just fun. It's absolutely empowering when women have been told it's not for them and it's never focused on them but they decide to take control and actually enjoy it. Britney sexuality may not be empowering but Gaga sexuality is. You can't say that no sexuality is and that's its just fun. 

I am all for the choice for women to be sexual or not. And that's why I also absolutely respect those who don't. Have you seen any feminist try to drag Glenn Close for example for being too modest? Or Alexandria Cortez? I don't know who you're thinking of but feminists I've seen don't drag women who choose to be modest. Only those who try to impose their own modesty on others. 

And no, it's not something men came up with and women just fell for. 

Are you a woman, though? Because I've always been told by men how this stuff works but when you're actually a woman, it's a very different matter. Taking control of the sexuality can be empowering but actually being sexual cannot. Empowerment is about using your brainpower, achieving things, making change. Basically, when you do something that not many people can do. Anyone can have the ability to have sex and be sexual, so why should something that anyone can do be empowering when anyone can do it? Why should a normal bodily function empower you? If having sex is empowering, why aren't other bodily functions like urinating, defecating and breathing viewed as empowering? Perhaps because these things are considered gross and/or aren't profitable to anyone? But sex is profitable, so we can sell it, market it, encourage it. And that's why we have the multi-trillion sex industry. And in order to keep this very profitable industry, we must keep women believing that to be publicly sexual is normal, cool and a great career to have, hence, we have to sell this idea to them from every possible angle and make the opposite seem unusual, uncool and boring. Sexual = good, non-sexual = bad, therefore, sexual people = good people, non-sexual = bad people. Don't you see the problematic nature here? So, I think you'll find that men certainly are feeding into this idea of linking sex and empowerment and it's a very clever marketing move that guarantees women will be sexual in a way they like for years to come.

Yeah, I've seen feminists drag non-sexual feminists all the time. Granted, most of them are the non-famous ones, so I can't give you any examples. But your everyday women being criticised should concern you far more anyway since they haven't put themselves out there to be judged. Your examples are rather odd because I don't think either of the women you mentioned have ever spoken out about modest sexual beliefs so there's nothing to criticise on that front. I can't say much for Alexandria but Glenn? She was almost completely naked in Fatal Attraction and just the other day, she explained in an interview about how it's a myth that a person's sex drive diminishes as they get older, so I don't know why you think she's being modest other than the fact that she's elderly now and is just being more conservative as a natural byproduct of that. As for feminists in the media being criticised, the likes of Germaine Greer are considered fair game because of how she looks and acts and the media is basically very anti-feminist whenever it's a non-sexual woman doing the speech. As I said before, society wants women to be sexual so like to put down any woman who isn't, as we can't be giving other women ideas and soon no woman wants to be sexual. When I'm talking about feminists who bring others down for a different opinion, I'm talking very much from personal experience. I once went through a terrible time on another forum because I was anti-sex industry. Despite saying that the reasons why I was against it was nothing to do with being against sex or being jealous of these women, but was all to do with the physical and emotional pain these women go through and the fact feeds into the worst side of men...it didn't stop people from accusing me of being prudish and anti-sexual and as long as these women are enjoying it, what's the problem? That doesn't even touch on all the other awful things they said. And it was literally the entire thread against me, not one person was of my viewpoint. I've never experienced online abuse like it and it left me crying myself to sleep every night. When the whole thing was eventually put to an end, none of the people got warned, and I only ever got one apology. Everyone else moved on as if it was no big deal and even later bullied me into making me agree with their opinion...and even when I did relent, they still didn't stop. I've discovered that this is the reality of this apparent "open minded," "accepting" sex positive feminist movement. Adapt or die. And understand that agreeing with them in many ways (which I do) isn't enough. You have to agree on everything. So, this is why I have big issues with the self-important types within this side. You may say that it's only a problem when modesty is forced on others, but aren't we allowed to complain when they want to force their sexuality on us?

[FGGrayson 9,670]

damn!! what's the name of the song, loved it!

[LordEnigma 11,313]

8 hours ago, StrawberryBlond said:

Oh, I know what you meant. But I'm merely pointing out the unfortunate word choice. There are certain words that really rile feminists up and the accusation of being "uptight" is definitely up there, along with "prudish" and "old-fashioned." These are words that just really shouldn't be uttered in discussions about women's rights. As long as we continue to label women with negative names, feminism will never achieve its aims. And it bugs the hell out of me that women go on about how awful it is to call women sluts and whores (which it is) but seem to think that calling them uptight prudes is perfectly fine.

Agreed, women need to unite in what they agree with, instead of separating themselves on their differences. But when they do want to speak on their differences, they shouldn't be shut down and disrespected as it goes against the entire ethos of feminism to do that.

I've seen that Madonna interview before and honestly, she's not making as much sense as she seems to think she is. She asks "where do we draw the line?" despite the fact that the MTV regulation states that nudity is forbidden, so her question is already answered (it's clear she thinks rules are there to be broken or the ones she agrees with are the only ones worth following), she reverts to talking about violence and how bad that is despite the fact that there's no violence in her video so it has nothing to do with the discussion at hand, she says that no one's concerned if a child is watching someone being ripped apart (even though violence on tv has been one of parents biggest concerns for years), she seems to think that asking your parents about something sexual you've seen on tv is commonplace (when every child, no matter how they were raised, would ever dream of confessing to their parent that they saw something sexual on tv which they shouldn't have been doing) and when asked if she thinks it's ok for kids to see this stuff on tv, she falters a bit because she realises that she never watched tv as a child and therefore, her parents never had this concern, so she's perhaps not the best to judge this situation. It's worth noting that she had no children at this point but when she did, she never let them watch tv. I think that tells you a lot about how hypocritical she's been - let's put controversial stuff on tv to open up important discussion...but I won't let my own kids watch tv because it's garbage. Madonna's never liked being challenged and I think this interview really shows that she's not used to being challenged or been called out on her beliefs often enough.

Are you a woman, though? Because I've always been told by men how this stuff works but when you're actually a woman, it's a very different matter. Taking control of the sexuality can be empowering but actually being sexual cannot. Empowerment is about using your brainpower, achieving things, making change. Basically, when you do something that not many people can do. Anyone can have the ability to have sex and be sexual, so why should something that anyone can do be empowering when anyone can do it? Why should a normal bodily function empower you? If having sex is empowering, why aren't other bodily functions like urinating, defecating and breathing viewed as empowering? Perhaps because these things are considered gross and/or aren't profitable to anyone? But sex is profitable, so we can sell it, market it, encourage it. And that's why we have the multi-trillion sex industry. And in order to keep this very profitable industry, we must keep women believing that to be publicly sexual is normal, cool and a great career to have, hence, we have to sell this idea to them from every possible angle and make the opposite seem unusual, uncool and boring. Sexual = good, non-sexual = bad, therefore, sexual people = good people, non-sexual = bad people. Don't you see the problematic nature here? So, I think you'll find that men certainly are feeding into this idea of linking sex and empowerment and it's a very clever marketing move that guarantees women will be sexual in a way they like for years to come.

Yeah, I've seen feminists drag non-sexual feminists all the time. Granted, most of them are the non-famous ones, so I can't give you any examples. But your everyday women being criticised should concern you far more anyway since they haven't put themselves out there to be judged. Your examples are rather odd because I don't think either of the women you mentioned have ever spoken out about modest sexual beliefs so there's nothing to criticise on that front. I can't say much for Alexandria but Glenn? She was almost completely naked in Fatal Attraction and just the other day, she explained in an interview about how it's a myth that a person's sex drive diminishes as they get older, so I don't know why you think she's being modest other than the fact that she's elderly now and is just being more conservative as a natural byproduct of that. As for feminists in the media being criticised, the likes of Germaine Greer are considered fair game because of how she looks and acts and the media is basically very anti-feminist whenever it's a non-sexual woman doing the speech. As I said before, society wants women to be sexual so like to put down any woman who isn't, as we can't be giving other women ideas and soon no woman wants to be sexual. When I'm talking about feminists who bring others down for a different opinion, I'm talking very much from personal experience. I once went through a terrible time on another forum because I was anti-sex industry. Despite saying that the reasons why I was against it was nothing to do with being against sex or being jealous of these women, but was all to do with the physical and emotional pain these women go through and the fact feeds into the worst side of men...it didn't stop people from accusing me of being prudish and anti-sexual and as long as these women are enjoying it, what's the problem? That doesn't even touch on all the other awful things they said. And it was literally the entire thread against me, not one person was of my viewpoint. I've never experienced online abuse like it and it left me crying myself to sleep every night. When the whole thing was eventually put to an end, none of the people got warned, and I only ever got one apology. Everyone else moved on as if it was no big deal and even later bullied me into making me agree with their opinion...and even when I did relent, they still didn't stop. I've discovered that this is the reality of this apparent "open minded," "accepting" sex positive feminist movement. Adapt or die. And understand that agreeing with them in many ways (which I do) isn't enough. You have to agree on everything. So, this is why I have big issues with the self-important types within this side. You may say that it's only a problem when modesty is forced on others, but aren't we allowed to complain when they want to force their sexuality on us?

What was said that was online abuse?

[PartySick 161,228]

On 1/22/2019 at 11:20 AM, Borislshere said:

Okay, I might have to stan Cardi now. I love how she isn't afraid to clock these bigots. 

Ngl, not a fan of her music but she is such a queen when it comes to who she actually is

[Runway 27,876]

Kinda amazing she’s going political

 

Honestly her intelligence is way underrated, she’s street smart, that counts more for me. love her

[bloody g 31,746]

She metaphorically dog walked Stephanie's ass

[StrawberryBlond 14,900]

11 hours ago, Alexander Levi said:

What was said that was online abuse?

They called me a misandrist, a bitch, said that something really bad must have happened to me in the past that had made me so bitter and twisted and that it was just as well I didn't have kids as I'd make a terrible mother. All for saying that I didn't want to let an industry that routinely degrades women to continue. This is why I went a whole lot quieter on this issue that I had always felt so passionately about afterwards. I just didn't want to risk the hurt again and have that horrible feeling of everyone hating me. I daresay that was the desired effect some wanted: actively working to traumatise someone into silence.