Economy 52,842 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/canada-u-s-agree-to-nafta-replacement-that-includes-mexico-1.1145242 US, Canada & Mexico finally agree to a deal that prevents Tarrifs and trade wars between the 3 Nations The process will take up to 60 days to complete leaving the possibility for something to happen until then but unless someone pulls out the deal is set to happen Canada caused the delay of the deal by refusing to accept the removal of some neutral dispute systems like Chapter 19 and having long disputes over dairy. Both Canada and Mexico convinced the US out of the Sunset clause that could have constrained investment as a result of uncertainty Trump wanted to rename NAFTA because it has "bad connection to a bad deal" even tho most of the new deal remains the same. It is now called "USMCA Deal". More details of the new deal in link Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woolfsmck 2,763 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 Hoooorrraaaayyyyy. We don't hate Canada anymore, and they don't hate us that much,,,😎 like a cat in a sil, I observe life, moving and still. My words give a clue,look inside to see whats true Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,842 Posted October 1, 2018 Author Share Posted October 1, 2018 9 minutes ago, Woolfsmck said: Hoooorrraaaayyyyy. We don't hate Canada anymore, and they don't hate us that much,,,😎 At first Trump said Mexico was the big culprit not sure why he turned more on Canada afterwards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woolfsmck 2,763 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 6 minutes ago, Economy said: At first Trump said Mexico was the big culprit not sure why he turned more on Canada afterwards Showmanship... Trump's bs is purposeful... It's not always clear what it is tho...8-/ like a cat in a sil, I observe life, moving and still. My words give a clue,look inside to see whats true Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBEY 57,109 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 Apparently the new deal is bad for milk producers in canada? @Economy I need your facts on this Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,842 Posted October 1, 2018 Author Share Posted October 1, 2018 35 minutes ago, OBEY said: Apparently the new deal is bad for milk producers in canada? @Economy I need your facts on this We had to make concessions on that in return for keeping other stuff US wanted to change untouched like the Chapter 19 dispute system Canada's dairy is not part of the free market like most products are. We have a "supply management system" that gives quotas to different farmers to keep supply and demand balanced. The idea was so farmers could make money and not struggle like in many Nations but it's also why milk, yogurt and cheese costs more in Canada than in the US Because there's a quota, there's also a specific amount that's allowed to be imported, anything above that amount gets slapped with high taxes We didn't dismantle the supply management system but we agreed to increase imports from the US quota a little bit which reduces the domestic quota from our farmers that's what happened Tbh I don't get this system. We don't have a supply management system for other products so I don't get why milk and cheese gets a unique system. I understand Trump's frustration with this particular issue tbh Also Canada increased the quota from the EU for dairy as well as part of another trade deal... Canada's dairy will never learn to compete if it's being shielded with a quota that keeps prices artificially higher but also forces them to not expand and sometimes have to shrink when we allow more imports Yes the transition would be hard at first for the dairy farmers but I think this system is outdated. It might have worked 50 years ago but the economy is too globalized now for a system like this now I think Canada is also one of the few Nations that has banned raw milk despite evidence that it's healthier and despite food poisoning from it being rare. At least give people the choice if they wanna chance it I don't like our dairy system and laws for dairy at all they are extremely controlling tbh Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woolfsmck 2,763 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 21 minutes ago, Economy said: We had to make concessions on that in return for keeping other stuff US wanted to change untouched like the Chapter 19 dispute system Canada's dairy is not part of the free market like most products are. We have a "supply management system" that gives quotas to different farmers to keep supply and demand balanced. The idea was so farmers could make money and not struggle like in many Nations but it's also why milk, yogurt and cheese costs more in Canada than in the US Because there's a quota, there's also a specific amount that's allowed to be imported, anything above that amount gets slapped with high taxes We didn't dismantle the supply management system but we agreed to increase imports from the US quota a little bit which reduces the domestic quota from our farmers that's what happened Tbh I don't get this system. We don't have a supply management system for other products so I don't get why milk and cheese gets a unique system. I understand Trump's frustration with this particular issue tbh Supply and demand for dairy is a little more touchy than other foods and products because of shelf life... In periods of high supply (cheeper imports) shelf stock can site beyond expiration limits, causing a large amount stock to go to waste...not only the value of said products, but storage and transportation costs are lost. Gov. regulations and tariffs 'balance' the supply side so that Canadian producers don't get trampled by much larger and wealthier foreign competition.. like a cat in a sil, I observe life, moving and still. My words give a clue,look inside to see whats true Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,842 Posted October 1, 2018 Author Share Posted October 1, 2018 27 minutes ago, Woolfsmck said: Supply and demand for dairy is a little more touchy than other foods and products because of shelf life... In periods of high supply (cheeper imports) shelf stock can site beyond expiration limits, causing a large amount stock to go to waste...not only the value of said products, but storage and transportation costs are lost. Gov. regulations and tariffs 'balance' the supply side so that Canadian producers don't get trampled by much larger and wealthier foreign competition.. I get that there's pros to this as well But there's other stuff with limited shelf life like meats, fruits and vegetables etc and we don't have a supply management system for that I just think we're hurting ourselves long term. Our dairy farmers cannot grow much because they are given a quota, sometimes they shrink because we increase import quotas from a nation because in trade deals our supply management system is always an issue and because they are used to higher prices they cannot compete globally because they haven't innovated or been forced to become efficient enough compared to farmers from other nations I think 50 years ago the pros may have outwayed the cons but in today's world I think it does more harm than good Also dairy farmers who have that as their main business are like less than 1% to 2% of population. Theres the other 98% to 99% of Canadian consumers to consider that pay higher prices as a result of this system Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woolfsmck 2,763 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 6 minutes ago, Economy said: I get that there's pros to this as well But there's other stuff with limited shelf life like meats, fruits and vegetables etc and we don't have a supply management system for that I just think we're hurting ourselves long term. Our dairy farmers cannot grow much because they are given a quota, sometimes they shrink because we increase import quotas from a nation because in trade deals our supply management system is always an issue and because they are used to higher prices they cannot compete globally because they haven't innovated or been forced to become efficient enough compared to farmers from other nations I think 50 years ago the pros may have outwayed the cons but in today's world I think it does more harm than good Also dairy farmers who have that as their main business are like less than 1% to 2% of population. Theres the other 98% to 99% of Canadian consumers to consider that pay higher prices as a result of this system Meat may not have the same problem of foreign competition causing oversupply problems .., fruits and vegetables however aren't products that Canada has a large production chain to protect. Grains can be stored much longer so supply issues aren't as crippling. Without import constraints the Canadian dairy production chain would likely collapse, leaving it 'dependent' of foreign suppliers.. like a cat in a sil, I observe life, moving and still. My words give a clue,look inside to see whats true Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woolfsmck 2,763 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 1 hour ago, Economy said: Also dairy farmers who have that as their main business are like less than 1% to 2% of population. Theres the other 98% to 99% of Canadian consumers to consider that pay higher prices as a result of this system Dairy Production chain .. Moo cows... Need to be fed and cared for ... $$$$$ Property to hold said moo cows ..,$$$$ Collection and transportation of said moo cow milk ... $$$$$ Processing/packaging/storing(refrigeration) ....$$$$ Transportation/marketing(advertising)/retailing....$$$$ So dairy has much longer chain than most perishable products ******* Size matters...... Big moo cow co. makes 100 $ Loses 10 $ to competition. = 90% .Med moo cow co makes 50 $ Loses 10 $ .... = %80 Mini moo cow co. makes 25 $ Loses 10 $ .... = %40 ..... Mini moo cow co. is hit much harder by competition. like a cat in a sil, I observe life, moving and still. My words give a clue,look inside to see whats true Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,842 Posted October 1, 2018 Author Share Posted October 1, 2018 10 minutes ago, Woolfsmck said: Dairy Production chain .. Moo cows... Need to be fed and cared for ... $$$$$ Property to hold said moo cows ..,$$$$ Collection and transportation of said moo cow milk ... $$$$$ Processing/packaging/storing(refrigeration) ....$$$$ Transportation/marketing(advertising)/retailing....$$$$ So dairy has much longer chain than most perishable products ******* Size matters...... Big moo cow co. makes 100 $ Loses 10 $ to competition. = 90% .Med moo cow co makes 50 $ Loses 10 $ .... = %80 Mini moo cow co. makes 25 $ Loses 10 $ .... = %40 ..... Mini moo cow co. is hit much harder by competition. I love ur style of explaining things lmao Ur right. It's a bigger impact than the number of dairy farmers would suggest I still question the system tho. Other countries dont use it and their Industries adapt and become more efficient and consumers benefit In Canada now it's complicated. Our dairy farmers can't compete because of being sheltered for too long Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woolfsmck 2,763 Posted October 1, 2018 Share Posted October 1, 2018 26 minutes ago, Economy said: I love ur style of explaining things lmao Ur right. It's a bigger impact than the number of dairy farmers would suggest I still question the system tho. Other countries dont use it and their Industries adapt and become more efficient and consumers benefit In Canada now it's complicated. Our dairy farmers can't compete because of being sheltered for too long Most protectionist policies have to do with this formula. .US has similar policies against Mexico because they have much cheaper labor and fewer regulations. like a cat in a sil, I observe life, moving and still. My words give a clue,look inside to see whats true Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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