Madonna: "I have no need to defend myself"

[Psychedelic 1,098]

Well, Gaga's comments were misleading. She absolutely screwed up with her wording, but I can understand her frutration when everything that she puts out is compared to Madonna.

Same thing happened to Madge back in 2012, if you watch that "reductive" interview completely, all she does is praise Gaga but then gets bothered when the comparisons continued and that's when she screwed up with the infamous word.

Of course Madge took advange of it, and took it futher with her bitchy attitude on tour, but seems like she's regreted it and has tried to make it up. Some monsters here still believing Madonna is an evil witch make most out of it, you act the same way Madonna stans when they think everything Gaga does is inspired by M.

Gaga can be a lot more vocally talented than Madonna, but other than they're both great artist. Some of the greatest pop stars ever witnessed. Continuing witht his feud just because you prefer on more than the other is truly stupid. Respect to both!

 

[BlaqJezus 1,027]

The fact of the matter is, Madonna used to write most of her tracks, sometimes alone, and mostly with at least one to two other writers. She is noted as a producer on almost every track as well.

NOW, a few things:

1) It is Madonna, so there is a really good chance, that like Gaga, she probably helps decide on every part of the album, and for that, demands her name be on the "Producers" credits (Which is not something that Gaga has done until more recently, probably because she never felt right taking credit for someone else's job until she gave major feedback and had a grasp on all the parts of production in a major way)

2) When Madonna was making music (she wrote with herself and few other writers), and we call this **** shady now too, but music industry? Shady AF. So there is a chance there were more writers that were not credited during the earlier years of her career.

3) As mentioned, she now hardly writes by herself, which is sad, because the music she wrote before was so much better when she did it herself, rather than now when she has a team of people and irks out mediocre (comparatively) albums. (Also barring Confessions, because bitch that album is pure ****ing diamond studded platinum as far as late career albums go.)

4) She learned over time, how to play instruments, but started with the guitar which she was always at least proficient at. BUT, even at her best, and at Gaga's worse, she could never match Gaga vocally. PERIOD. Even during her Evita era, in which she had the best range and voice quality she has ever had.

[jojuun 4,159]

8 hours ago, Evan Peters said:

rebel heart had 36 writers  

Yeah cause she worked with 25 producers. Count in 4 guest features et voila, you have 29 out of 36 that were hired as producers. Madonna has always written the majority of her work. Ask anyone who ever worked with her. So many articles with her producers and collaborators have come out over the years and they all state the same thing, she's the main writer. And she's always in control.

There is never anything put out where she's not a writer, approved or re-worked by Madonna to put on a Madonna album. The proof is online to. Devil Wouldn't Recognize You for instance is a song she wrote by herself for a musical she was about to do in 2004. The demo got leaked a few years ago. It's just Madonna on the guitar and singing. The musical never happened in favor of the Confessions album in 2005. Yet in 2007, when she was recording Hard Candy (that came out in 2008), she revisited the song. Yet on the album, besides Madonna, Timbaland, Justin Timberlake, Floyd Nathaniel "Danja" Hills and Joe Henry are credited because Timbaland was the main producer and re-worked the original arrangement, Timberlake stylized small portions of the song, Danja co-produced next to Timbaland and Joe Henry provided the guitar arrangement. Yet, from the demo she recorded years prior, it's clear Madonna was the sole songwriter of that song. Justin Timberlake, Timbaland, Diplo, Stuart Price, Pat Leonard and all other major Madonna producers and co-writers have always stated that she keeps tons and tons of notebooks, diaries and lists endless ideas when they are in the studio. She has rarely taken on songs that she didn't write, but at least she isn't a hypocrite about it. She didn't write Holiday, however she wasn't happy with the original arrangement and brought in her then-boyfriend Jellybean to re-work the song. He's said so himself, Madonna never said that. So even when she isn't taking credit, she's still working on the song without taking credit for it. That's more than can be said about certain other artists who come in and take credit for changing two words or ad-lib and become the main writer of a song.

And stop being hypocrites, all of you in this thread. Gaga isn't a sole-songwriter either. She always has co-writers and has a lot of input from loads of others all the time. For ARTPOP, she's literally lifted multiple instrumentals from her then-collaborators and simply freestyled over them and then worked on them for so long they became complete structured songs. It wasn't written from scratch at all, most songs existed in the producers laptops.

Red One, by the way, came up with the entire instrumental of Just Dance, Gaga wrote the words in "10 minutes" apparently, but Red One is the one who gave the original "tudumdumdumdumdum" which makes the song and gave Gaga headstart on the lyrics.

Gaga knows damn well there's about a thousand common things she shares with Madonna. They are both fake blond American women who fought for their careers, who both share an Italian background and who both set out to be the biggest popact at the start of their careers. Except for the fact Madonna has kept that up and has never let the pressure of fame crack her. Gaga kinda has. And that's what she meant with "I allow myself to fail". While she may see that as a strength in herself, I think it's her biggest weakness. She sat so cockily in her Anderson Cooper 360° Interview in the early Born This Way days and stated "I am the master of fame." Yet a year later, she cracked completely under the pressure of fame. A mess. 

Madonna is way more disciplined and stronger than Gaga. That's just the truth, it's not just my "biased opinion as a Madonna fan". Gaga said so herself in the Beats Radio interview: "Madonna rehearses over and over again". Because Madonna is a perfectionist. Gaga was a perfectionist too at the start. Now not so much. Like one of Gaga stylist's who quit said best, with ARTPOP, it all went out of the window. And he quit after her tragic X Factor performance with the sea shell bra (she allegedly changed ideas about the costumes an hour before the liveshow and the glue on her bra hadn't dried yet and her seashell fell off during the show. He was so furious, he couldn't take it and quit. Gaga was notoriously impossible to work with at the time). Her career has also "enjoyed" a steady decline ever since, let's be real here.

Gaga BETTER rehearse until her feet bleed for the Super Bowl because it could boost her career which is, let's face it, experiencing slow times.

Gaga always gets irked by the Madonna comparisons and she shouldn't be. She isn't annoyed when they compare her to Bowie or Prince. When Gaga put on that Jean Paul Gaultier bra, the outfit made SO famous by Madonna, she set herself up for this. It's like when Bebe Rexha or a Fifth Harmony girl wear meat dresses tomorrow, then flip out about Gaga comparisons. She set herself up for it. End of story.

[leecy 1,476]

The queen seems so insecure

[jajagaga1896 89]

Gaga did not mean to shade anyone but she had to set the record straight! We all know Madonna would and has done the same thing. Madonna has treated people poorly for years... god forbid someone says a thing about her.

And of course Madonna was going to have make some sort of statement...I mean Gaga definitely said a lot in that. She basically took down the queen of pop in the most earnest, truthful, respectful way possible... and people just don't do that! 

And that is that. Let it be that, people! They'll both be more than fine!

 

---Come to add, Madonna is right! She does not need to defend herself! She is heralded as the most successful pop act ever! She should have followed this route when Gaga first made waves and stayed classy and went about her music - not involving and dragging Gaga. Why be so insecure - and then let that insecurity turn into nastiness? Ah well, we're all human... Madge just ain't no different.

[GagzDonkeyD 1,293]

9 hours ago, komr said:

 ARTPOP had more than 20 and Joanne had 12 while Erotica had 5, Music had  7, American Life had 6 

You do know that gagz give out writing credits like candy right even in bad romance redone add that ohhhhhhhhhhhhh lyrics got a writing credit 

[BlaqJezus 1,027]

1 hour ago, jojuun said:

Yeah cause she worked with 25 producers. Count in 4 guest features et voila, you have 29 out of 36 that were hired as producers. Madonna has always written the majority of her work. Ask anyone who ever worked with her. So many articles with her producers and collaborators have come out over the years and they all state the same thing, she's the main writer. And she's always in control.

There is never anything put out where she's not a writer, approved or re-worked by Madonna to put on a Madonna album. The proof is online to. Devil Wouldn't Recognize You for instance is a song she wrote by herself for a musical she was about to do in 2004. The demo got leaked a few years ago. It's just Madonna on the guitar and singing. The musical never happened in favor of the Confessions album in 2005. Yet in 2007, when she was recording Hard Candy (that came out in 2008), she revisited the song. Yet on the album, besides Madonna, Timbaland, Justin Timberlake, Floyd Nathaniel "Danja" Hills and Joe Henry are credited because Timbaland was the main producer and re-worked the original arrangement, Timberlake stylized small portions of the song, Danja co-produced next to Timbaland and Joe Henry provided the guitar arrangement. Yet, from the demo she recorded years prior, it's clear Madonna was the sole songwriter of that song. Justin Timberlake, Timbaland, Diplo, Stuart Price, Pat Leonard and all other major Madonna producers and co-writers have always stated that she keeps tons and tons of notebooks, diaries and lists endless ideas when they are in the studio. She has rarely taken on songs that she didn't write, but at least she isn't a hypocrite about it. She didn't write Holiday, however she wasn't happy with the original arrangement and brought in her then-boyfriend Jellybean to re-work the song. He's said so himself, Madonna never said that. So even when she isn't taking credit, she's still working on the song without taking credit for it. That's more than can be said about certain other artists who come in and take credit for changing two words or ad-lib and become the main writer of a song.

And stop being hypocrites, all of you in this thread. Gaga isn't a sole-songwriter either. She always has co-writers and has a lot of input from loads of others all the time. For ARTPOP, she's literally lifted multiple instrumentals from her then-collaborators and simply freestyled over them and then worked on them for so long they became complete structured songs. It wasn't written from scratch at all, most songs existed in the producers laptops.

Red One, by the way, came up with the entire instrumental of Just Dance, Gaga wrote the words in "10 minutes" apparently, but Red One is the one who gave the original "tudumdumdumdumdum" which makes the song and gave Gaga headstart on the lyrics.

Gaga knows damn well there's about a thousand common things she shares with Madonna. They are both fake blond American women who fought for their careers, who both share an Italian background and who both set out to be the biggest popact at the start of their careers. Except for the fact Madonna has kept that up and has never let the pressure of fame crack her. Gaga kinda has. And that's what she meant with "I allow myself to fail". While she may see that as a strength in herself, I think it's her biggest weakness. She sat so cockily in her Anderson Cooper 360° Interview in the early Born This Way days and stated "I am the master of fame." Yet a year later, she cracked completely under the pressure of fame. A mess. 

Madonna is way more disciplined and stronger than Gaga. That's just the truth, it's not just my "biased opinion as a Madonna fan". Gaga said so herself in the Beats Radio interview: "Madonna rehearses over and over again". Because Madonna is a perfectionist. Gaga was a perfectionist too at the start. Now not so much. Like one of Gaga stylist's who quit said best, with ARTPOP, it all went out of the window. And he quit after her tragic X Factor performance with the sea shell bra (she allegedly changed ideas about the costumes an hour before the liveshow and the glue on her bra hadn't dried yet and her seashell fell off during the show. He was so furious, he couldn't take it and quit. Gaga was notoriously impossible to work with at the time). Her career has also "enjoyed" a steady decline ever since, let's be real here.

Gaga BETTER rehearse until her feet bleed for the Super Bowl because it could boost her career which is, let's face it, experiencing slow times.

Gaga always gets irked by the Madonna comparisons and she shouldn't be. She isn't annoyed when they compare her to Bowie or Prince. When Gaga put on that Jean Paul Gaultier bra, the outfit made SO famous by Madonna, she set herself up for this. It's like when Bebe Rexha or a Fifth Harmony girl wear meat dresses tomorrow, then flip out about Gaga comparisons. She set herself up for it. End of story.

Part of this is the truth, and some of this is the opinion of a biased Madonna fan. I am a big Madge fan, have been since I was a kid during the actual 80's. Either way, the one thing Gaga will always have over Madonna, and the one thing she can always take home after all her other artistry: She is hands-down a better vocalist than Madonna ever was. It isn't hard to love both of them at the same time, and not be completely biased about things, not to mention most of this thread has been positive. Stay calm.

[Sister 9,907]

I am entirely over this argument. I won't give it any more of my energy. I love both artists and it's a shame that they keep throwing stones at one another or even exchanging catty remarks or slights at each other. AND both are clearly at fault here, from the beginning. It brings both women down a few steps in my regards.

[KleinGa 18,177]

10 hours ago, Logan said:

Seriously though what is the deal with them? One second they're feuding and another they're taking pictures together. 

 

 

they're "two people that should be together but they playin"

[jajagaga1896 89]

12 minutes ago, Sister said:

I am entirely over this argument. I won't give it any more of my energy. I love both artists and it's a shame that they keep throwing stones at one another or even exchanging catty remarks or slights at each other. AND both are clearly at fault here, from the beginning. It brings both women down a few steps in my regards.

I agree with you, but I do not believe they are both at fault! And I think that is an unfair assertion to make. And while I am a way bigger fan of Gaga, I do like some Madonna songs and respect her influence in the pop arena - so I am not bias against Madonna. It saddens me to see Madonna in this light - but she alone put herself there!

In the beginning, Gaga praised Madonna to heaven and back, talked about what an inspiration she was, and the like. If there was a comparison, Gaga expressed admiration. Gaga was so open about her love for Madonna, and so genuine about it, that you could not miss it.

Cut to a year after the Born This Way single controversy. The queen of pop is releasing MDNA. She has a 30 year legacy behind her. I wonder if she ever considered this before she spoke. A question about Gaga comes up. Madonna decides to start a firestorm at Gaga, a year after the incident, while promoting her new album, MDNA. Mind you, she makes known her negative opinion of a woman who has shown nothing but admiration since her big break - but that is not enough. She goes as far as to sing, "she's not me," at her show and mix Gaga's song into it and all this nasty stuff! All the while Gaga remains dignified and pretty silent. She makes a few statements but never calls Madonna on anything. 

Madonna started this war, for what reasons I can only speculate. While I like to think, "nasty," I will have more empathy and call her, "insecure." With a 30 plus year legacy, being heralded by everyone who breathes as queen of pop, you have got to have some deep insecurity issues to respond to Gaga's presence in music this way. For god's sake woman, why, if you are Madonna, at a Madonna tour, with Madonna fans, would you spend so much time incorporating Gaga's presence into your set. We would hope you know who you are Madonna! But... on some level, she must not! It's insecurity at its roots, and Madonna deals with this weakness through nastiness and cattiness. We're all human so we can't fault her too much, but it is near depressing to see a woman with so much influence, power, and respect act like an immature bully. What a way to tarnish your legacy.

MDNA is not such a great album, and Madonna returns with Rebel Heart. Yes, there's some good songs, but again, it feels like Madonna is doing more pandering than trail-blazing. Now, suddenly, Madonna is taking pictures with Gaga and saying she has a plan to end the feud... oh, only when you see that you're not doing so well in modernity and you're strategy on how to handle a fellow female artist who actually has enough talent and presence to rattle you hasn't worked. How fake.

Now, Gaga is stronger than ever. She is in touch with what she wants - to explore her artistry. She'll let Madonna handle being pop queen - who wants that role, anyway?

Madonna is a classic example of someone using their powers for negativity, instead of positivity... and the results show less than satisfactory results.

To add, while I am on a roll, I do not believe it is ageist of me to presume Madonna, with her vast life experience and industry insight, would want to reveal something a little deeper in herself than skin and sex-appeal. I mean, she can do what she likes - but the criticism of Madonna's outfits and mannerism is less ageist and more a question of what happened to the once forward-thinking, innovative queen? You cannot tell me at this point in her life, after divorce, children, adopting kids, and so on, she is inspired to sing about going wild at a club or mixing and matching different illicit drugs? [both taken from recent lyrical content] Perhaps she is, no judgement, but something tells me that she has more to offer, if not just a wiser perspective on sex and drugs. 

That being said, I think Gaga hit Madonna on the head, at least with her place in modern music, and that ticks people off! Gaga wants to mature and change. She's had her Madonna moment, and she's moving on. Madonna opened doors early on in her career, yes, but then became obsessed with the fame and attention of being a sex symbol with number one hits. It shows in her last two records. 

Let Gaga take a note on how to not end up like in music. 

In a way, I feel bad for Madonna. I think, in metaphorical terms, she did sell her soul to the devil a long time ago, and she is struggling to get it back. She's had success, but her treatment of Gaga and others shows she lacks qualities that will deliver her happiness, too. A Rebel Heart doesn't cat-stratch  fellow female artists and walk around in near laughable black leather get-ups crying ageist! Not after what I've seen Madonna do in her heyday. 

A rebel heart makes the music she believes in, and is in control of her image with a respect for her body and mind. A rebel heart follows her artistic instinct, even if it does not appeal to the masses, and even if it will be shot down and dismissed. If you ask me, Gaga's got the rebel heart, and Madonna needs to take a break from the industry and spend some time figuring out who she really is at this point, and what she really wants to contribute at this point.

The performance is old, and age has nothing to do with it. Madonna has become a stereotype of her own boundary pushing persona, and a not-so-pleasant one at that.

[jajagaga1896 89]

2 hours ago, jojuun said:

Gaga knows damn well there's about a thousand common things she shares with Madonna. They are both fake blond American women who fought for their careers, who both share an Italian background and who both set out to be the biggest popact at the start of their careers. Except for the fact Madonna has kept that up and has never let the pressure of fame crack her. Gaga kinda has. And that's what she meant with "I allow myself to fail". While she may see that as a strength in herself, I think it's her biggest weakness. She sat so cockily in her Anderson Cooper 360° Interview in the early Born This Way days and stated "I am the master of fame." Yet a year later, she cracked completely under the pressure of fame. A mess. 

Madonna is way more disciplined and stronger than Gaga. That's just the truth, it's not just my "biased opinion as a Madonna fan". Gaga said so herself in the Beats Radio interview: "Madonna rehearses over and over again". Because Madonna is a perfectionist. Gaga was a perfectionist too at the start. Now not so much. Like one of Gaga stylist's who quit said best, with ARTPOP, it all went out of the window. And he quit after her tragic X Factor performance with the sea shell bra (she allegedly changed ideas about the costumes an hour before the liveshow and the glue on her bra hadn't dried yet and her seashell fell off during the show. He was so furious, he couldn't take it and quit. Gaga was notoriously impossible to work with at the time). Her career has also "enjoyed" a steady decline ever since, let's be real here.

Gaga BETTER rehearse until her feet bleed for the Super Bowl because it could boost her career which is, let's face it, experiencing slow times.

Gaga always gets irked by the Madonna comparisons and she shouldn't be. She isn't annoyed when they compare her to Bowie or Prince. 

Yes, but this is the point Gaga is trying to make, and to me it is clear as day. I believe if she had waited another record or two to say this, it would be better understood. Gaga has done a lot of soul-searching to find she has no interest in driving herself nuts and competing to be the queen of pop, especially in this industry. 

She wants to expand as an artist - that doesn't mean find as many different ways to get a number one hit as possible. It means do her thing, experiment with different sounds, and follow her artistic integrity. Gaga has made her millions and had her Madonna moment- she's over it. Madonna did stick to her plan of taking over the world, you're right, and considering her last two albums, I don't know how well it has served her in the long-run. She's walking around in uncomfortable looking BDSM outfits while singing about mixing and matching various illicit substances and proclaiming, "bitch, I'm Madonna." Between that and her, "she's not me," routine during her MDNA tour, I fear Madge is suffering a serious identity crisis brought on by the likes of a talented, influential new girl who actually only ever loved and respected her!

Gaga does not want to become this! It's been done and Madonna has made it obvious no one else is allowed to touch it while she's still breathing. So, thankfully, Gaga has embraced her artistic side and her growth as a woman. Had she not, we would be seeing Gaga at age 53 shoving crosses down her throat and senselessly dry-humping gay hotties well-below her age... thankfully that does not appear to be the course she is taking.

Let Madonna handle the antics!

And as for Gaga not enjoying being compared to Madonna, this only happened after Madonna made it crystal clear that, SHE IS NOT HER and Gaga's REDUCTIVE and it is a terrible comparison. Now, Gaga agrees... so luckily the two can be separated and Madonna's insecurity-induced frenzy can be put to bed. 

Long live the queen of pop, and what an irritable position it appears to be.

[gagaofvengeance 267]

But Madonna does produce and write her own music right? I mean on Rebel Heart she produce and write each song

[BULATIO 1,336]

YAS!!! More provocation!

[KleinGa 18,177]

She has no need to defend herself yet she made a post defending herself? 

[jajagaga1896 89]

6 minutes ago, feezdeengaga said:

But Madonna does produce and write her own music right? I mean on Rebel Heart she produce and write each song

Along with a team of what amounted to 36 writers. This is vastly different than Gaga. 

This is what it takes to remain pop queen in the industry, and as we can see from the results, sometimes, even with 36 top writers, it does not work out.

Gaga is not her for that. She would be miserable. Madonna is a great artist/performer who is in fact here for that - to be at the top, always, in control, no matter what. But what happens is you enter your 50s trying to match up to artists who are years younger than you in experience and ability, and so your craft suffers for the sake of remaining relevant. 

For Madonna, up until now, it has been worth it. Gaga already sees this just won't do.