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'Crunch time' for Cameron's EU reforms deal

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Luc
3 hours ago, deeman said:

Sweet you made a silly statement about leaving Europe which would require a techtonic shift. It just is beyond the capabilities of even modern rocket science to move the British isles outside of Europe.

'The UK won the football match from Ukraine'

How can a country, an abstract and idea that is not human, win a sport? 

That's not a question you should answer. My point is that sometimes you leave a part of a combination of words to shorten it, as long as the context still makes it obvious what they mean. Talking about 'leaving Europe' is justified in this context because it is obvious that the EU is meant. It's like being mad at someone who says 'Macedonia' rather than 'Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia', because perhaps you'd be talking about the Greek province - even though it's obvious the country FYR Macedonia is meant (in most contexts), because the Greek province isn't a country.

 

Getting more benefit for the UK isn't a good thing. Cameron would want to turn the currnet mutualist symbiosm of the EU into parasitism, with the UK sucking the money out of the system and getting all benefits without having any disbenefits. That's what Cameron wants and that's not how pan-European solidarity works. The poor countries should be given a chance to develop faster to reach the level of the wealthy west. A benefits ban is justified, but all other things (especially passing veto rights to the national parliaments) discredit the European Parliament, a democratically chosen organ. 

The main goal for Cameron in the end is to be able to block regulation and to make the EU as a whole more right-winged, which will hurt all aspects of life for the bottom 95%, to the benefit of a single aspect of life for the top 5% (bigger inequality).

The best to achieve Cameron's long-term goal of a right-winged European Union would be to blackmail the EU into becoming more right-winged, without leaving the EU. I think it could very well backfire however, with the UK leaving the EU (basically by accident), eventually hurting ALL of the global economy and hurting the power position of the West as a whole, benefiting mostly Russia.

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deeman
1 hour ago, Luc said:

'The UK won the football match from Ukraine'

How can a country, an abstract and idea that is not human, win a sport? 

That's not a question you should answer. My point is that sometimes you leave a part of a combination of words to shorten it, as long as the context still makes it obvious what they mean. Talking about 'leaving Europe' is justified in this context because it is obvious that the EU is meant. It's like being mad at someone who says 'Macedonia' rather than 'Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia', because perhaps you'd be talking about the Greek province - even though it's obvious the country FYR Macedonia is meant (in most contexts), because the Greek province isn't a country.

 

Getting more benefit for the UK isn't a good thing. Cameron would want to turn the currnet mutualist symbiosm of the EU into parasitism, with the UK sucking the money out of the system and getting all benefits without having any disbenefits. That's what Cameron wants and that's not how pan-European solidarity works. The poor countries should be given a chance to develop faster to reach the level of the wealthy west. A benefits ban is justified, but all other things (especially passing veto rights to the national parliaments) discredit the European Parliament, a democratically chosen organ. 

The main goal for Cameron in the end is to be able to block regulation and to make the EU as a whole more right-winged, which will hurt all aspects of life for the bottom 95%, to the benefit of a single aspect of life for the top 5% (bigger inequality).

The best to achieve Cameron's long-term goal of a right-winged European Union would be to blackmail the EU into becoming more right-winged, without leaving the EU. I think it could very well backfire however, with the UK leaving the EU (basically by accident), eventually hurting ALL of the global economy and hurting the power position of the West as a whole, benefiting mostly Russia.

There is no UK or British football team. There is an English team and a Scottish team and a Welsh team and possibly a Northern Irish team I am not sure really. It is true that sometimes there are abstractions made but I do not believe this is the case with Europe. It is a deliberate attempt at creating a notion of European nationality with the EU in charge. You can look at grow food. This is a common error but people don't grow food the can plant food but food grows itself or the sun grows it etc. Or you might have someone says they were a farmer and practiced self sufficiency saying how hard it is. The clue is the word farmer and when I dug it turned out a lot of money went on his wifes horses and they were trying to make money out of tomatoes in a cold climate. So they were farmers and he was arguing against self sufficiency from experience when he had only experience of farming under CAP which is totally different to gardening.

(digging deep to find the core meaning of words is very enlightening. English is a mine field of peculiar words but sometimes you can feel something is wrong and learn so much from checking the etymology)

Another good example you use is global economy to refer to an anti-economy. An economy by definition is about being economic using resources wisely and so on where as there is an anti-economic system of consumption where products are even designed intentionally to degrade. See the lightbulb conspiracy and Mark Boyle has some good stuff http://www.moneylessmanifesto.org/.

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ShockPop
3 hours ago, deeman said:

I had a friend who was also involved in the solar industry. I don't know how viable it is in the Uk as compared to wind or hydro but my point is that UK houses are a liability. They are like a leaking bucket more like a sieve designed very badly many of them in the shade of other buildings and the best solar gain is for heating with south facing windows plus they don't have space for proper food gardens you know really it is much better to start over otherwise your just stuck with these cities that are such a big harm. Check out garbage warrior for example for a good look at how solar can be implemented.

 

Firstly, they work on light, not direct sun beams. This is why calculators work indoors.

Shaded roof tops were reduced payback as subsidies were based on monitored generation.

Basically it was all paid for, the money was coming from itself - they generate more than will ever be used.

Brussels just didn't like it because Siemens is a German company.

Wind and hydro are awful in comparison. Wind especially is basically useless... And an eyesore that takes up huge amounts of space.

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deeman
1 hour ago, ShockPop said:

Firstly, they work on light, not direct sun beams. This is why calculators work indoors.

Shaded roof tops were reduced payback as subsidies were based on monitored generation.

Basically it was all paid for, the money was coming from itself - they generate more than will ever be used.

Brussels just didn't like it because Siemens is a German company.

Wind and hydro are awful in comparison. Wind especially is basically useless... And an eyesore that takes up huge amounts of space.

Putting solar pannels on 'farmland' is a bit of crazy idea. Rooftops is the way to go coz it is not used for anything. Producing energy from solar to then power inefficient homes though it just not going to work the first prority is to reduce the wastage then you can make enough from renewables. So you got houses that are not insulated designed for burning coal that was cheap and basically people to work in factories and stuff. The greeks already knew about putting south facing houses right but you can have a house in the UK that is facing north with another building overshadowing it. The garden then is cold you can't get decent food. Energy right primary energy is food electricity is low very low priority compared with food and people are not getting quality the hospitals are even fobbing them off pretending like they don't know that they are feeding people junk intentionally. It is all a pyramid scam. With solar there is power where I am I hang black cloth coz it only gets morning sun and I will see 2 degree gain or even 3 or 4 in a couple of hours where as with the fireplace it really struggles to get 2 degrees after hours coz there is a pile of cold air coming in to feed the fire. See when the sun comes up it goes up the first degree in 20 minutes or so it is a lot of energy and what happens is the stone sucks on it so it is like a battery and I keep some over from previous days and am well above last year only problem is it is not so good for the eyes it is just coz the house is designed wrong it could easily be warm here with no heating Uk slightly more difficult but still very possible they can do it in scandanavia. It makes you realise coz people  think a degree celcius is not much but it is you know quite a lot and if you think in Uk outside in winter it could be -2 at dawn and up to 7 or something in the afternoon that is a lot of energy (just think if you tried to acheive that with bonfires how much you would need to heat the whole air mass that much) all you need is to insulate the cold and store it in thermal mass. There is also types of greenhouse that have this sort of concept so you could actually havefood grow in winter just with a sort of sunken greenhouse

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Luc
1 hour ago, ShockPop said:

Firstly, they work on light, not direct sun beams. This is why calculators work indoors.

Shaded roof tops were reduced payback as subsidies were based on monitored generation.

Basically it was all paid for, the money was coming from itself - they generate more than will ever be used.

Brussels just didn't like it because Siemens is a German company.

Wind and hydro are awful in comparison. Wind especially is basically useless... And an eyesore that takes up huge amounts of space.

Hydro is one of the most cost-effective way of producing energy. Thats why even third world countries like North Korea and Ethiopia try to build hydro power plants. Wind is not so cost-effective, compared to fossil fuels, yet way more cost effective than solar energy. Solar energy might be the least cost effective, perhaps with only blue energy below it.

In a country like the UK with a big coast near the Atlantic Ocean and Northern Sea, with average sun hours and sun strength, wind energy is the most obvious way to produce energy keeping an eye on reducing carbon emission. Wind energy can be produced from a place where you can't see it, like on the coast (10+ miles from the coast even) or on the not so densily populated mainland of Scotland and mid-England. In Scotland especially there's a good political climate for it, with a huge majority voting left.

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deeman
1 hour ago, Luc said:

Wind energy can be produced from a place where you can't see it, like on the coast (10+ miles from the coast even) or on the not so densily populated mainland of Scotland and mid-England. In Scotland especially there's a good political climate for it, with a huge majority voting left.

This is wrong though coz if you produce it away from where it is needed you increase the cost. Then you need too build piles of transmission lines and you have resitance all the way along so your losing energy all the while. Then your seperating the people using the energy from the source so they don't have any idea where it is coming from and are completely dependent on artificial system right. Say you want to leave the city coz you are depressed or something then you find bloody great windmills all over the hills in th few placs that are not built up it is just plane abuse to put your **** on some more natural spot and sit there in the city continue to use energy wastefully like highly wastefully and force people to subsidise thru taxation. You know it is beyond any sort of words people complaining about the price of electricity when youve got people who are against nuclear and they have been paying for it all along just to buy anything like you buy a book on green energy you just been paying tax that goes to nuclear energy same like you have a cyclist pays tax that goes to the army to put cheap fuel in the car of the guy who almost run you over or the dude that nicked your girlfriend and then got her pregnant and left her your paying for his kids. It is massive abuse to force people to participate in any of this. If you want electricity produce it yourself on your own land and be sure it is not causing any harm to your neighbours not go and put some massive industrial windmill on the land where some one was trying to escape from all of this.

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TiphEret
5 hours ago, Luc said:

'The UK won the football match from Ukraine'

How can a country, an abstract and idea that is not human, win a sport? 

That's not a question you should answer. My point is that sometimes you leave a part of a combination of words to shorten it, as long as the context still makes it obvious what they mean. Talking about 'leaving Europe' is justified in this context because it is obvious that the EU is meant. It's like being mad at someone who says 'Macedonia' rather than 'Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia', because perhaps you'd be talking about the Greek province - even though it's obvious the country FYR Macedonia is meant (in most contexts), because the Greek province isn't a country.

 

Getting more benefit for the UK isn't a good thing. Cameron would want to turn the currnet mutualist symbiosm of the EU into parasitism, with the UK sucking the money out of the system and getting all benefits without having any disbenefits. That's what Cameron wants and that's not how pan-European solidarity works. The poor countries should be given a chance to develop faster to reach the level of the wealthy west. A benefits ban is justified, but all other things (especially passing veto rights to the national parliaments) discredit the European Parliament, a democratically chosen organ. 

The main goal for Cameron in the end is to be able to block regulation and to make the EU as a whole more right-winged, which will hurt all aspects of life for the bottom 95%, to the benefit of a single aspect of life for the top 5% (bigger inequality).

The best to achieve Cameron's long-term goal of a right-winged European Union would be to blackmail the EU into becoming more right-winged, without leaving the EU. I think it could very well backfire however, with the UK leaving the EU (basically by accident), eventually hurting ALL of the global economy and hurting the power position of the West as a whole, benefiting mostly Russia.

I didn't see it that way good input!

Sur le sable sur la neige, Sur les images dorées,Sur le front de mes amis, J’écris ton nom

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bionic

@MissRebelDolly You should create a EU referendum thread and have it pinned like the US election one.

I know I used to tease you before about Scottish independence but I now see that Scotland deserves to thrive in the EU, England deserves to try their luck on their own. Hope you get the result you want this time

Love from Russia

Flag-Pins-Scotland-Russia.jpg

buy bionic

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MissRebelDolly
12 minutes ago, bionic said:

@MissRebelDolly You should create a EU referendum thread and have it pinned like the US election one.

I know I used to tease you before about Scottish independence but I now see that Scotland deserves to thrive in the EU, England deserves to try their luck on their own. Hope you get the result you want this time

Love from Russia

 

12 minutes ago, bionic said:

@MissRebelDolly You should create a EU referendum thread and have it pinned like the US election one.

I know I used to tease you before about Scottish independence but I now see that Scotland deserves to thrive in the EU, England deserves to try their luck on their own. Hope you get the result you want this time

Love from Russia

The thread is created. My stance is stated within the OP. 

 

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TiphEret
2 hours ago, MissRebelDolly said:

 

The thread is created. My stance is stated within the OP. 

 

That time when you wish Scotland was independent... 

Sur le sable sur la neige, Sur les images dorées,Sur le front de mes amis, J’écris ton nom

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MissRebelDolly
7 hours ago, TiphEret said:

That time when you wish Scotland was independent... 

That is a different issue

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TiphEret
7 hours ago, MissRebelDolly said:

That is a different issue

I meant "you" as a general statement not you specifically. Having lost of Scottish friends currently residing in France yes it does matter because Scotland being independent would mean they could make their own choice and not depend on the English. So far they seem more pro EU than not.

Sur le sable sur la neige, Sur les images dorées,Sur le front de mes amis, J’écris ton nom

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bionic
50 minutes ago, TiphEret said:

I meant "you" as a general statement not you specifically. Having lost of Scottish friends currently residing in France yes it does matter because Scotland being independent would mean they could make their own choice and not depend on the English. So far they seem more pro EU than not.

An independent Scotland joining the EU with the rest of the UK (England/Wales/NI) would open up a whole new load of problems :toofunny: 

buy bionic

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TiphEret
8 hours ago, bionic said:

An independent Scotland joining the EU with the rest of the UK (England/Wales/NI) would open up a whole new load of problems :toofunny: 

For sure! Yet, some says an eventual exit of the UK could lead to Scotland doing a new referendum for independence not sure how realistic this is...

Sur le sable sur la neige, Sur les images dorées,Sur le front de mes amis, J’écris ton nom

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MonsterOfSpain
1 minute ago, TiphEret said:

For sure! Yet, some says an eventual exit of the UK could lead to Scotland doing a new referendum for independence not sure how realistic this is...

It would be cool for them to vote "exit" and that Scotland became independent and stayed in the EU.

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