Would Iggy Azalea be taken more seriously if she was black?

[Yanko 9,860]

14 hours ago, StrawberryBlond said:

 

You laughed at the situation when Harry said all that negative stuff about me. Basically, you found it funny that someone else was bringing me down.

 

nope he just clocked you with arguments  

[Kayla 7,595]

Can you guys stop arguing about personal interactions during the argument?

[SlayedForTheGod 665]

On 11/23/2015, 2:59:49, StrawberryBlond said:

If I said the same thing to you, you'd probably accuse me of backing out because I don't have any good arguments to respond with. But I'm sure it's ok for you to say it to me. Frankly, I find the way you shut down other people's opinions when they don't measure up to your standards to be far more ignorant. Many of those accuse others of ignorance tend not to see it within themselves, I find. Just like those people who belittle anyone for judging when they're the biggest judges themselves and are judging by the very nature of what they're saying.

Thank you so much for that and I always find opposing views so much easier to take when they're put down in such a polite, respectful way. There's a lot of people on this forum who could learn a lot from you.

Thing is, I've never particularly understood what people mean by her lack of sensistivity or understanding of the genre. There are plenty of rappers who take a light-hearted, commercial side to rap and they're never accused of this. But again, it helps that a lot of those rappers are black. But when a white rapper does this, they're just doing rap for the money and fan loyalty, they don't have knowledge of rap history, they have no real connection to it. I just can't help thinking that it's just a switch that goes off in people's heads that says "White person = cultural appropriation and use of rap for commercial gain." Because blacks have never done either of those things, right?

I've actually been watching a lot of interviews with Iggy recently and I'm always blown away by how genuine she seems. She exudes friendliness and warmth. She's always so smiley and jokey. She's very honest about everything. Her theories are interesting. She has no bad blood towards anyone and just wants everyone to be friends. That's being real to me. I can't stand how a lot of rappers have this ego and are all confrontational because it's too overwhelming and off-putting. But in rap, this is considered "real." I consider it fake and putting on a front because you're insecure. With the exception of Eminem, all of my favourite rappers have a friendly aura, have a humble personality and have realist attitudes. Being down to earth is real to me. I've seen Iggy talk about how she found love for rap aged 12 when the boys from her street played Tupac's Baby Don't Cry on their computer playlist and how she looked up rap lyrics online and knew all these lyrics weren't always correct and working out what everything meant. I've seen her talk about how she grew up with depression, that her dad left her as a child (explaining it with a letter which her teacher gave to her) and how she worked a lot of dead end jobs in supermarkets and record shops for $6 an hour and then cleaned houses under her mum's real estate business. I've seen her talk about reality of the music business, what labels expect of you, touring with Nas and how she found a friend in him and was pleased he respected her take on rap when a lot of others didn't. There's a general consenus feeling that Iggy's dumb but really, in the interviews I saw of her, she is very intelligent and her views are very insightful. It's just the public don't see the side to her because she always presents such a happy form of rap that people don't think she can have experienced any hurt in her life or have any interesting opinions.

Right from the first time we ever argued, you were the one to start taking jibes at me. All I've done is defend myself from then on. I wouldn't have felt the need to fight back if you hadn't started attacking me personally. Treat others as you wish to be treated. I used to just take it but I've been bullied too much in life to just accept it and I will stand up for myself if I feel I'm being mistreated. I never set out to hurt anyone with my posts so I know when someone attacks me that it's always for no reason because I don't set out to be mean to people, ever. Which I why I don't understand it when people are mean to me, as I've done nothing to deserve it. I'm glad that you've acknowledged that you are hostile towards me anyway and yes, you definitely should leave personal comments out of the conversation. Just because someone has a different opinion to you gives you no right to pick apart their character.

You laughed at the situation when Harry said all that negative stuff about me. Basically, you found it funny that someone else was bringing me down.

She never had a massive hit like Iggy did or most black rappers have. None of her other stuff sold, which put her album on delay, the lack of interest in her meant her label obviously gave her no money and promo, so she faded out. Would have happened to anyone else in the same situation. And you're putting all the others into the same category as her just because they're new. And you think Brooke can get a hit, seriously? She's been trying for failing for several years now. Thinking that Iggy got it all because of her beauty is just typical of the pessimistic attitude we take towards artists - they only got to where they are based on superficiality that is completely unfounded. Iggy herself even brought this up. Here's the thing - women don't really get success based on looks anymore, its been a long time since that's happened. Women don't like other women that look like they could steal their boyfriend or sometimes "there's just something about them." So, it leads to a bias against pretty women and thinking that being pretty is some sort of crime. So, the sales aren't always there from women. And men, well, they don't buy music from women just because they're hot, they buy posters and drool over their videos, but they don't buy the music. Iggy hasn't even been high ranked in any FHM or Maxim Hot 100 lists. She got the success because she made a catchy, commercial rap song, simple.

u say that but then think of all the unconventionally beautiful artists out there. theres not many.

[DrewStevens 5,249]

This thread has been active for 10 days

Iggy has more people who care about her in GGD than in the real world 

[Higher 2,406]

Y'all need to shut up and drop it. 

 

 

[Probglum 824]

I honestly don't think so...

[StrawberryBlond 14,102]

7 hours ago, SlayedForTheGod said:

u say that but then think of all the unconventionally beautiful artists out there. theres not many.

Well, there are. But you don't always see them. There are some exceptions. Susan Boyle made it and Adele isn't exactly drop dead gorgeous or slim but she's the most successful artist in the world right now. Artists are sometimes given makeovers when they start to gain success too. I think Iggy's pretty but she's not the prettiest, i'm willing to bet there's hotter white females out there who aren't getting this chance. I've seen pretty blonde white girl rappers either solo or part of a group on shows like X Factor and The Voice but they don't get far at all. It's such a simplistic way of looking at things - they only got to where they are on their looks. The only female artist I can think of for whom this is 100% the case is Cheryl Cole (even the judges complimented only her looks in her first audition). But other than her, it's never as simple as that. And she got famous in 2002, it was a different ball game back then. A lot of popstars back then had pretty faces but average voices and every member of a group was dressed the same and they sang canned music that they had no part in. But things are very different now. You are encouraged to have a good voice, individuality is encouraged and there's more involvement in songwriting. In a sense, the artists of today are more talented than the ones of the past as there's more natural talent and more applied talent.

It's a bit of a myth that labels don't want to sign black females as they won't be seen as attractive. Look at Beyonce, Nicki, Rihanna. Out of the only 3 successful winners of UK X Factor, 2 of them are black women and the other one is a girl group with a black girl in it. They're given s-xual images, men in the audience wolf whistle after they perform live, they get put on hot 100 lists. I think it's because there aren't necessarily a great deal of black female celebrities around that make you think that we don't see them as attractive.

[SlayedForTheGod 665]

6 hours ago, StrawberryBlond said:

Well, there are. But you don't always see them. There are some exceptions. Susan Boyle made it and Adele isn't exactly drop dead gorgeous or slim but she's the most successful artist in the world right now. Artists are sometimes given makeovers when they start to gain success too. I think Iggy's pretty but she's not the prettiest, i'm willing to bet there's hotter white females out there who aren't getting this chance. I've seen pretty blonde white girl rappers either solo or part of a group on shows like X Factor and The Voice but they don't get far at all. It's such a simplistic way of looking at things - they only got to where they are on their looks. The only female artist I can think of for whom this is 100% the case is Cheryl Cole (even the judges complimented only her looks in her first audition). But other than her, it's never as simple as that. And she got famous in 2002, it was a different ball game back then. A lot of popstars back then had pretty faces but average voices and every member of a group was dressed the same and they sang canned music that they had no part in. But things are very different now. You are encouraged to have a good voice, individuality is encouraged and there's more involvement in songwriting. In a sense, the artists of today are more talented than the ones of the past as there's more natural talent and more applied talent.

It's a bit of a myth that labels don't want to sign black females as they won't be seen as attractive. Look at Beyonce, Nicki, Rihanna. Out of the only 3 successful winners of UK X Factor, 2 of them are black women and the other one is a girl group with a black girl in it. They're given s-xual images, men in the audience wolf whistle after they perform live, they get put on hot 100 lists. I think it's because there aren't necessarily a great deal of black female celebrities around that make you think that we don't see them as attractive.

im glad u named three of the only BIG black women in music.and to be more specific, in the american market. theres no one besides them. then you look at all the white pop queens and the list is endless.and we're talking RELEVANT so dont try to bring in names like Janet and Mariah. 

and then u stated only two unconventional looking women. its not helping your case. 

yes every now and then someone comes around but for the most part the mainstream music industry is white and look focused.

[StrawberryBlond 14,102]

23 hours ago, SlayedForTheGod said:

im glad u named three of the only BIG black women in music.and to be more specific, in the american market. theres no one besides them. then you look at all the white pop queens and the list is endless.and we're talking RELEVANT so dont try to bring in names like Janet and Mariah. 

and then u stated only two unconventional looking women. its not helping your case. 

yes every now and then someone comes around but for the most part the mainstream music industry is white and look focused.

I was naming the ones that people deem attractive, nothing to do with their musical output. The reason why there's so many white women ruling pop is because it's still seen as a white person's genre. Blacks are conditioned to go into rap and RnB. Even Beyonce and Rihanna have always dabbled in creating a mixture of pop and urban, so they're difficult to categorise. We seem to think that blacks just don't make pop music. And aside from MJ, well, how many can you name? It's not that we shut them out, it's just that so many don't pursue pop in the first place. It's rare to see a black person go on a reality singing show and audition with a song that's not an urban song sang by a black artist.

Beauty is subjective anyway. A lot of people think Gaga's ugly but most of her fans don't.

Just like everyone else, blacks will have certain discriminations against them in the music industry that isn't connected to race. Being too old, being too experimental, being a complete unknown, even being female, all pose problems towards getting a record deal these days. Race is actually pretty low on the rungs as to why you can't catch a break in the industry. Even if it is a problem, trust me, there'll be multiple other factors too. It's never as simple as one reason.

[SlayedForTheGod 665]

3 hours ago, StrawberryBlond said:

I was naming the ones that people deem attractive, nothing to do with their musical output. The reason why there's so many white women ruling pop is because it's still seen as a white person's genre. Blacks are conditioned to go into rap and RnB. Even Beyonce and Rihanna have always dabbled in creating a mixture of pop and urban, so they're difficult to categorise. We seem to think that blacks just don't make pop music. And aside from MJ, well, how many can you name? It's not that we shut them out, it's just that so many don't pursue pop in the first place. It's rare to see a black person go on a reality singing show and audition with a song that's not an urban song sang by a black artist.

Beauty is subjective anyway. A lot of people think Gaga's ugly but most of her fans don't.

Just like everyone else, blacks will have certain discriminations against them in the music industry that isn't connected to race. Being too old, being too experimental, being a complete unknown, even being female, all pose problems towards getting a record deal these days. Race is actually pretty low on the rungs as to why you can't catch a break in the industry. Even if it is a problem, trust me, there'll be multiple other factors too. It's never as simple as one reason.

i dont understand why you cant understand that the industry forces these black girls to sing a type of music. there have been plenty of black or latinas that have tried to be pop stars that dont get the same push by the industry. and beauty is subjective but there is an evident blueprint of what the industry sees as beautiful. 

[inuborg 4,135]

On November 21, 2015 at 5:12:00 PM, StrawberryBlond said:

You haven't exactly made it clear that there's nothing wrong with liking her. You've been calling me uneducated and top 40 focused every time I've tried to explain anything about her skills and basically saying that I don't have a clue if I find her talented. Sure sounds like you're saying that there's something wrong with liking her. I'm not pretending that she's something she isn't - I know she isn't the best rapper or lyricist or freestyler. I've never said she was. Her raps may be mainstream focused but that doesn't make them not rap.

Vapid and uneduated - the list of accusations you make of me get more absurd every day. It's amusing how I've been called something different and ludicrous every day by you, something no one has ever called me in reality or online. Are heading for some sort of record? And yet you insist you're not a bully and I'm just insistent on making you look bad? You're doing a fine job of that yourself. You're bullying someone for not having the same musical taste as you. And I'm the one who's supposed to grow up?

Lauryn Hill was never just rap, her album was a mixture of other styles too so she's allowed to sing. I've listened to all of Missy's albums and can't recall her singing, unless you're maybe talking about any features she's done, in which case, that's a bit more acceptable. How am I uneducated about rap because I think rappers should rap, as their profession entails? And Nicki has labelled all her music as rap, even when it wasn't. I wouldn't even call any of her pop stuff rap, even though she raps in it, it's just too far removed. Yet the 50/50 rap/pop RR album got nominated in rap categories left and right. Iggy has never been as pop as that. Even her beats aren't all that pop. Trouble is a soul-based beat, Fancy just has a "girly" rap beat and Black Widow has a dark trap beat.

Yes, Iggy tried to do pop once. It wasn't a success and she found a love for rap. What a crime! Civilians change their professions all the time - are they fake? You can find love for any kind of music later on in life and change your sound. If she abandons rap completely real soon and goes back to pure pop, then I'll call her fake but she's stayed with rap for now, so I don't see what the issue is.

Once again, you skim over the obvious issue - she said "n***a monkey" - she's saying blacks are monkeys! Oh, yeah, and let's not forget her Anaconda video, with a jungle setting, bananas and black women in their most stereotypical roles! Doesn't matter what race is doing it, this is racism! This is one of the worst beliefs to have - that oppressed races are allowed to insult other oppressed races or even their own race. I can't believe you'd subscribe to that theory. This is what lets the wheel of hate never stop spinning. You're condoning racism. Once again, you expose what a terrible anti-racism crusader you are.

And look how you so masterfully skipped over the most obvious exmaple of racism from Nicki when she said "I'm a racist, I'm a bigot." Because there's really no defending that one, is there, when it's that brash and proud? Just like you skimmed over all those racist things I posted that Azealia Banks said. I just read about the attack she made on a random black girl on Instagram, calling her a "tar baby," that she needed to bleach her skin and go out and "pick my cotton before I give her 80 lashings." Yeah, keep denying racism when it's right under your nose, and from your fave, no less.

Don't bring Azealia into this **** show. Because no matter what she says on twitter, Azealia is a talented musician and she gets respect for that. Bringing up Azealia's outbursts isn't going to make Iggy's music less s--tty.

Because the moral of the story is, Iggy isn't taken seriously because there is nothing to take. Her lyrics (whether she writes them or not is still very questionable) are decent at best, her sound and beats are mediocre, and she doesn't perform well live (as the countless memes prove). Its not a race issue and its not a s-x issue. Yes, Rap is a straight, black, male dominated genre of music, and lot of , hell, the majority of the outliers aren't given their credit, but Iggy is not apart of that group. She doesn't add anything new to the genre, she doesn't have anything to give to it either. She's essentially a parasite of the genre. A genre created by and sustained by people much much more talented than her.  Sucking away at its essence and being and poisoning it's blood and organs with mediocrity. 

[Benji 20,113]

11 minutes ago, inuborg said:

Don't bring Azealia into this **** show. Because no matter what she says on twitter, Azealia is a talented musician and she gets respect for that. Bringing up Azealia's outbursts isn't going to make Iggy's music less s--tty.

Because the moral of the story is, Iggy isn't taken seriously because there is nothing to take. Her lyrics (whether she writes them or not is still very questionable) are decent at best, her sound and beats are mediocre, and she doesn't perform well live (as the countless memes prove). Its not a race issue and its not a s-x issue. Yes, Rap is a straight, black, male dominated genre of music, and lot of , hell, the majority of the outliers aren't given their credit, but Iggy is not apart of that group. She doesn't add anything new to the genre, she doesn't have anything to give to it either. She's essentially a parasite of the genre. A genre created by and sustained by people much much more talented than her.  Sucking away at its essence and being and poisoning it's blood and organs with mediocrity. 

 

[StrawberryBlond 14,102]

Just now, inuborg said:

Don't bring Azealia into this **** show. Because no matter what she says on twitter, Azealia is a talented musician and she gets respect for that. Bringing up Azealia's outbursts isn't going to make Iggy's music less s--tty.

Because the moral of the story is, Iggy isn't taken seriously because there is nothing to take. Her lyrics (whether she writes them or not is still very questionable) are decent at best, her sound and beats are mediocre, and she doesn't perform well live (as the countless memes prove). Its not a race issue and its not a s-x issue. Yes, Rap is a straight, black, male dominated genre of music, and lot of , hell, the majority of the outliers aren't given their credit, but Iggy is not apart of that group. She doesn't add anything new to the genre, she doesn't have anything to give to it either. She's essentially a parasite of the genre. A genre created by and sustained by people much much more talented than her.  Sucking away at its essence and being and poisoning it's blood and organs with mediocrity. 

Yes, Azealia may be talented but her personality lets her down immensly (and I'm not keen on her music either, though that's obviously a matter of opinion). I felt it was relevant because it pointed out that black artists get away with saying racist comments a lot more than white artists can. You can't deny that if someone white said all the stuff Azealia's said, they would be metaphorically masscared by the public, maybe even arrested seeing as racism seems to only be a crime when it's a white downtalking a non-white, never the other way around.

Well, even if Iggy is all these things, there's a ton of black rappers who are all these things too. I can't help thinking that people view the issue as worse when it's a white rapper being all these things. Very few rappers have brought anything new to the table for years, but Iggy's the only one who gets accused of not being the most original? When I think of rappers who are ruining the genre, she's the last name I think of, honestly. I feel the rap game could do with a dose of her niceness and humbleness. It's so refreshing to see a rapper who isn't all about ego and acting like they're so cool.

 

[inuborg 4,135]

13 minutes ago, StrawberryBlond said:

Yes, Azealia may be talented but her personality lets her down immensly (and I'm not keen on her music either, though that's obviously a matter of opinion). I felt it was relevant because it pointed out that black artists get away with saying racist comments a lot more than white artists can. You can't deny that if someone white said all the stuff Azealia's said, they would be metaphorically masscared by the public, maybe even arrested seeing as racism seems to only be a crime when it's a white downtalking a non-white, never the other way around.

Well, even if Iggy is all these things, there's a ton of black rappers who are all these things too. I can't help thinking that people view the issue as worse when it's a white rapper being all these things. Very few rappers have brought anything new to the table for years, but Iggy's the only one who gets accused of not being the most original? When I think of rappers who are ruining the genre, she's the last name I think of, honestly. I feel the rap game could do with a dose of her niceness and humbleness. It's so refreshing to see a rapper who isn't all about ego and acting like they're so cool.

 

People take Azealia seriously because at the end of the day, her music is still good. And the whole black vs white racism thing, is as simple as: black people can "get away with it" because they are on the oppressed side of the social equation. I'm not going to get into a whole race thing today, because I'm tired (lol) but just know that, even though Azealia can be snarky a lot of the time, she still has great music to fall back to.

Now I will agree with you, there are PLENTY of black rappers who give rap a bad name. But guess what, they aren't taken seriously either. You think the "Hit The Quan" rapper is gonna be respected or even talked about next year? No. Hell, no. But to get credit you have to do something credible, and I'm sorry, but Iggy isn't serving credibility. And really this whole "niceness and humbleness" angle is really an act. Iggy and her team knows that "niceness" (paired with whiteness) equals marketability. She knows if she plays the harmless female serving bops to the general public, she will always have a market. And really, good for her, but she's not a great rapper, she's hardly a good rapper. 

[StrawberryBlond 14,102]

Just now, inuborg said:

People take Azealia seriously because at the end of the day, her music is still good. And the whole black vs white racism thing, is as simple as: black people can "get away with it" because they are on the oppressed side of the social equation. I'm not going to get into a whole race thing today, because I'm tired (lol) but just know that, even though Azealia can be snarky a lot of the time, she still has great music to fall back to.

Now I will agree with you, there are PLENTY of black rappers who give rap a bad name. But guess what, they aren't taken seriously either. You think the "Hit The Quan" rapper is gonna be respected or even talked about next year? No. Hell, no. But to get credit you have to do something credible, and I'm sorry, but Iggy isn't serving credibility. And really this whole "niceness and humbleness" angle is really an act. Iggy and her team knows that "niceness" (paired with whiteness) equals marketability. She knows if she plays the harmless female serving bops to the general public, she will always have a market. And really, good for her, but she's not a great rapper, she's hardly a good rapper. 

Well, the public have ended careers over a lot less, that's all I'll say. I'm not a supporter of this theory of "oppressed people can say whatever they want because they're oppressed." There is no excuse for condoning hate. I'm a woman but I don't feel the need to hate on men because I can get away with it because I'm the disadvantaged gender. Hate is hate and it's unacceptable. If you give some people the right to dish it out without consequences, you're going to fuel overblown egos and keep the cycle of hate turning.

Again, plenty of black rappers have credibility despite not being any good. Judging by what's been popular and praised recently, I'd say the bar is set extremely low. So, I find it rather frustrating when I see a rapper who's no worse (and makes raps that make sense into the bargain) being treated like s**t. I really don't like to see nasty people getting success, so I think it's sad when someone as nice as Iggy gets unneccesarily hated on while someone unlikeable like Nicki gets overblown praise. Please, you're just coming up with excuses now. How can you prove her niceness is an act? I can see through people very well and this girl is real, I can feel it. You're essentially saying that every white artist will be successful if they're nice. As a music reviewer, I can confirm this is nonsense. If anything, it's people with attitude problems who are selling the best right now and not all of them are white. You've just got to look at how super nice Gaga got outsold by the likes of nasty Rihanna to see that sometimes, being bad is a plus in the industry and the nice people suffer.