How many of you really think ARTPOP is Gaga's weakest release?

[Hexxx 2,244]

I dislike it ,because it sounds like it's trying to fit in or something. When I listen, it doesn't sound like something would write or do. They weren't bold or game changers. Songs like ARTPOP, Aura, Applause, DWUW, Mary Jane Holland were the boldest from the album. Everything else was skippable

[Memo 176]

Grammys or no Grammys, ARTPOP is stronger than, or at least as good as, Born This Way. And I feel it easily surpasses the first two. There's more texture, more sonic depth, more esoteric lyrics, more melodic risks being taken.

But by reading what some fans here want from her music (catchy, simple, relatable), it doesn't surprise me that they find this to be lacking.

That said, each Gaga album is an epic example of spectacular dance-pop. They're very different from each other, but all cut from the same glittery, melodic cloth.

Damn slay 100% agreed :applause:

[jeffswiss 1]

Grammys or no Grammys, ARTPOP is stronger than, or at least as good as, Born This Way. And I feel it easily surpasses the first two. There's more texture, more sonic depth, more esoteric lyrics, more melodic risks being taken.

But by reading what some fans here want from her music (catchy, simple, relatable), it doesn't surprise me that they find this to be lacking.

That said, each Gaga album is an epic example of spectacular dance-pop. They're very different from each other, but all cut from the same glittery, melodic cloth.

You speak so much truth!!!

[giskardsb 12,565]

and DJWS didn't to the album well either... I mean he basically dictated it and made all the songs sound similar which makes them basic in a way... There are only 4 songs that are up to standards with her old stuff... Applause, Gypsy, Sexxx Dreams & DWUW

That makes no sense to me personally. By almost any measure ARTPOP is the most diverse set of productions she's ever done. People complain about that way more than complaining that it sounds the same. Then you list the four most standard productions on the album as being the exceptions. I don't get your point of view at all I guess. To each his own as they'd say.

[djBuffoon 12,120]

even the stronger songs are generally weaker rehashes of stuff she did on previous albums (Just Dance -> Applause, TEOG -> Gypsy, LoveGame -> G.U.Y.). 

It's so interesting that you make these comparisons. And they are astute comparisons, but they're also pretty succinct examples of how her songwriting has improved.

Damn slay 100% agreed

 

You speak so much truth!!!

This fanbase will come to appreciate this album in time. Mark my words

[Mills 446]

I find ARTPOP in totality (from its lyrics to its production) as much stronger than her debut and her 8-track EP, but fell short compared to BTW. So no, it's not her weakest. Debuts in general are oftentimes the least strongest purely because the artists were only just starting at that time, with less experience, less inspiration, less maturity, and even less motivation for improvement. Like all artistic endeavours (e.g. first film directed, first song written, first album released), the more time artists are exposed in their chosen industry, the more opportunities for them to hone their skills, and therefore passage of time makes them stronger. Gaga is among those who exemplified this. 

 

That makes no sense. By almost any measure ARTPOP is the most diverse set of productions she's ever done. People complain about that way more than complaining that it sounds the same.

 

Exactly. One may not find it to be her strongest, but it's clearly her most diverse album yet in terms of production. Those who argue otherwise might not have listened to her past albums. 

[pachinko 10,395]

In terms of music and quality, for me it's - Born This Way > The Fame Monster > The Fame > ARTPOP.

I still really like ARTPOP though, it's still an album I like its just not my favourite by Gaga.

MTE!!

[Psychedelic 1,098]

Her weakest yes, but still an amazing record beyond all time pop standards!!!

[XoXoJoanneGaga 629]

It's so interesting that you make these comparisons. And they are astute comparisons, but they're also pretty succinct examples of how her songwriting has improved.

I think lyrically the ARTPOP songs that I mentioned there are pretty clunky. Just Dance and LoveGame are far from lyrical masterpieces but the words are so catchy and they flow so well. The Just Dance verses are catchier than most pop songs' choruses tbh. I still have no idea what "half psychotic sick hypnotic got my blueprint it's symphonic" means yet I still find those lyrics genius and she had the whole world singing along to them. Same goes for the disco stick. Those lyrics are way more clever than "suddenly the Koons is me" or "I'm gonna wear the tie", which stumble clunkily off the tongue and aren't really saying anything profound, even if the intention behind them is more profound. I feel the same way for Gypsy which has plain awkward lyrics like "I said honey it's simple it's the way that you love and treat your mother". 

 

At the end of the day she's never been an amazing songwriter aside from a few songs like Bad Romance or Bloody Mary. I think with her brand of quirky dance-pop the lyrics should be strange but still catchy and they should roll off the tongue. Most of the songs on ARTPOP are lyrical mouthfuls and yet she's still not saying anything of substance. Add on to that the fact that they're not as melodically catchy as her earlier work and it just makes for weaker pop music in all regards.

[Ronk 14,762]

Musically I think it's her best album.

[luckythisway 2,610]

That makes no sense to me personally. By almost any measure ARTPOP is the most diverse set of productions she's ever done. People complain about that way more than complaining that it sounds the same. Then you list the four most standard productions on the album as being the exceptions. I don't get your point of view at all I guess. To each his own as they'd say.

What I mean is the production sounds very basic to me in a way because most of it is by one person... Now those songs are the most "GP friendly" if you will, but to me those tracks are where it actually stands out and makes it sound good... and you can't even call this album diverse compared to what it was before she broke her hip... they cut the best part out of the applause demo probably cause it wasn't radio friendly to them.

[djBuffoon 12,120]

I think lyrically the ARTPOP songs that I mentioned there are pretty clunky. Just Dance and LoveGame are far from lyrical masterpieces but the words are so catchy and they flow so well. The Just Dance verses are catchier than most pop songs' choruses tbh. I still have no idea what "half psychotic sick hypnotic got my blueprint it's symphonic" means yet I still find those lyrics genius and she had the whole world singing along to them. Same goes for the disco stick. Those lyrics are way more clever than "suddenly the Koons is me" or "I'm gonna wear the tie", which stumble clunkily off the tongue and aren't really saying anything profound, even if the intention behind them is more profound. I feel the same way for Gypsy which has plain awkward lyrics like "I said honey it's simple it's the way that you love and treat your mother". 

 

At the end of the day she's never been an amazing songwriter aside from a few songs like Bad Romance or Bloody Mary. I think with her brand of quirky dance-pop the lyrics should be strange but still catchy and they should roll off the tongue. Most of the songs on ARTPOP are lyrical mouthfuls and yet she's still not saying anything of substance. Add on to that the fact that they're not as melodically catchy as her earlier work and it just makes for weaker pop music in all regards.

The ARTPOP lyrics, especially the ones that you pointed out, are some of my favorites. I don't think they sound jumbled at all, I can't even address that. A mouthful, sometimes, but that's not necessarily a criticism for me, in this case.

 

I prefer Gaga when she goes big, and nothing from The Fame, in particular, was a stand out to me. Even the more acclaimed tracks have a simple, three or four-chord major/minor structure that is disappointing for someone who has trained in piano her whole life. Meanwhile, "GUY", "Mary Jane", "Gypsy", and plenty of others from this last album have a far more elaborate and playful scan, they have more depth (both the melodies and the production scope), and there are specific lyrical stanzas that are (imho) far more cleverly phrased and timed than the "half-psychotic" and the "disco stick" line. The pre-chorus in "GUY" trumps almost anything on The Fame, imo.

 

Overall, BTW and AP are more explosive and experimental, even at the risk of taking a bit longer for the choruses and melodies to stick. Which I'm 100% okay with, I think that's where the real "meat" is. Whereas the first two albums felt rather constricted to me, with a few exceptions. Almost as if, before the songs really went to that next level, she would just repeat the chorus two more times and end it.

[Logan 20,734]

Now that I've actually taken a step back and delved into other music and looked at it from an unbiased perspective, I actually think it's her worst album. 

Still had a good time at the artRave though. 

[giskardsb 12,565]

Overall, BTW and AP are more explosive and experimental, even at the risk of taking a bit longer for the choruses and melodies to stick. Which I'm 100% okay with, I think that's where the real "meat" is. Whereas the first two albums felt rather constricted to me, with a few exceptions. Almost as if, before the songs really went to that next level, she would just repeat the chorus two more times and end it.

The Fame in particular seems like every song was designed around hooks. That gets repetitive fast for me. That's also a trait in nearly every redone song. It's effective for grabbing attention but not very sophisticated or different. In fact you could say that the most important aspect of most pop songs is the hook as that is what the radio wants. They want "catchy" which to me is not often a positive term. I prefer more interesting song structure. Like ARTPOP the song itself.

[djBuffoon 12,120]

The Fame in particular seems like every song was designed around hooks. That gets repetitive fast for me. That's also a trait in nearly every redone song. It's effective for grabbing attention but not very sophisticated or different. In fact you could say that the most important aspect of most pop songs is the hook as that is what the radio wants. They want "catchy" which to me is not often a positive term. I prefer more interesting song structure. Like ARTPOP the song itself.

Precisely. So in that respect alone, I can understand why ARTPOP might fall short for some fans who want and expect more of the same.

 

But this one is different, the song structures have more in common with musical theater and rock, though drenched in electronic sounds. She clearly pushed herself to write differently this time out, and I think the effort, while not celebrated by many now, is one that fans and casual listeners will come to appreciate later.