POLL: TDD vs. SOAW

[lompavibl 125]

let‘s stop dragging both TDD and SOAW. we should be glad we got these mayhem outtakes released officially, that doesn‘t really happen with gaga‘s music. yes there are way better tracks on mayhem, thats why they weren‘t included on the standard version. i love both and i think they are better than dont call tonight or blade of grass (and i love those one too) 

[BELLYACHE 1,698]

TDD clears

[Head Empty 26,363]

1 hour ago, Ladle Ghoulash said:

Again, I still think that feels internally more internally consistent than a lot of SOAW’s verse lyrics. I get what you mean about “dreaming thoughts,” but that line coupled with the chess lyric to me just functions as, “you know me so well you can win before I even have a chance to fight back (before the thoughts are fully realized, running the chessboard before I can make any big moves).” The song has always read as puppet fighting back against puppet master to me, so maybe that’s why the phrasing and logic of the lyrics work for me (and the connection between the “dreaming” and the chess match in TAOPC don’t hurt in terms of giving it context, either). I don’t think it’s a perfect lyric, but I don’t think it’s nonsense either.
 

Also: musically, imo, it absolutely words better than the rhythmic and melodic shoehorning on that rollercoaster lyric into that groove. I feel like @****oDanceFighthit the nail on the head with “verbal stimming” because the verses on SOAW feel like they’re still in the concept demo stage to me: just riffing over and instrumental and trying to see what sticks.

I think you simply LIKE The Dead Dance more as an overall song, so you're more motivated to look into its meaning despite the flaws it might have. (Edit: I'm probably doing the same for SOAW).

BOTH songs use mixed metaphors to fill up the song and to sound cool for casual listeners. And those lines make just enough sense so that you can interpret them into the narrative - IF you care enough about the song to do so. I judge them equally on that front.

 

Edited Monday at 08:12 PM by Head Empty

[Ladle Ghoulash 42,831]

1 hour ago, Head Empty said:

I think you simply LIKE The Dead Dance more as an overall song, so you're more motivated to look into its meaning despite the flaws it might have. (Edit: I'm probably doing the same for SOAW).

BOTH songs use mixed metaphors to fill up the song and to sound cool for casual listeners. And those lines make just enough sense so that you can interpret them into the narrative - IF you care enough about the song to do so. I judge them equally on that front.

 

I mean, I don’t think it’s just that I like TDD more. I think it’s also genuinely more musically and thematically coherent. Even if you don’t prefer it, I think meaning and central metaphor feels pretty clear and the imagery is clear and legible.

 

With SOAW, I think the mixed metaphors and more circuitous lyrics make the meaning harder to pin down, at least for me.

 

And to be fair, I did respond to your issues with TDD and laid out specific critiques of SOAW. It just feels like those didn’t really get engaged with, and instead the focus shifted to me being more “biased” toward TDD. But I’m more than happy to disagree, I just don’t really get the switch up when you were the one who introduced the line-by-line analysis. No hard feelings tho and no need to drag out an argument when we just don’t see eye to eye.

Edited Monday at 09:17 PM by Ladle Ghoulash

[Head Empty 26,363]

11 minutes ago, Ladle Ghoulash said:

I mean, I don’t think it’s just that I like TDD more. I think it’s also genuinely more musically and thematically coherent. Even if you don’t prefer it, I think meaning and central metaphor feels pretty clear and the imagery is clear and legible.

 

With SOAW, I think the mixed metaphors and more circuitous lyrics make the meaning harder to pin down, at least for me.

 

And to be fair, I did respond to your issues with TDD and laid out specific critiques of SOAW. It just feels like those didn’t really get engaged with, and instead the focus shifted to me being more “biased” toward TDD. But I’m more than happy to disagree, I just don’t really get the switch up when you were the one who introduced the line-by-line analysis. No hard feelings tho and no need to drag out an argument when we just don’t see eye to eye.

I started writing specific SOAW analyses/defenses but then I realized I never said that those lines are good . Which is why I opted for my previous response: I find the flaws in writing very similar between these songs, so it's surprising to me how you experience them so differently. I didn't mean anything in an accusatory way.

As for the rest: I already gave my two-cents in terms of why TDD feels less consistent, moreso than SOAW. In my eyes the mixed-metaphor argument is just as valid for both songs. Your interpretation of the TDD lyrics give background and meaning the things that I find contradictory, but that doesn't change my gripes with the technicalities of it all. The central metaphor does not feel clear to me, based solely on what's on the page.

So I think we both made our points known but we just don't agree 

[Sepsami 20,322]

12 hours ago, Ladle Ghoulash said:

The delivery on “feedin’ on the TORTURE, rollahcoaster HELL” makes me laugh every time lmao. Some of her worst verses of all time, imo.

I sang this, issa bop I'm sorry

[Sepsami 20,322]

12 hours ago, RochesterJoannster said:

This thread is making me enjoy SOAW more than I did. 
 

Im gonna be that weirdo who loves that song more than the other DWP2 songs. None of the songs are the best thing she’s ever done anyway, but I can see the other two will be the favorites!

I'm already that weirdo