The double standard of Terry Richardson

[gagzus 18,001]

1 minute ago, TheFrenchGuy said:

« My intention was to create something extremely defiant and provocative because I was angry and still hadn't processed the trauma that had occurred in my own life. The song is called Do What U Want (With My Body), I think it's clear how explicitly twisted my thinking was at the time. »

I think it’s clear she was in a very dark place, and that both DWUW and working with Terry were attempts to reclaim her sense of agency as a traumatized woman. She knew these men were perverted, and she chose to work with them in an aggressively defiant way where she was (on the surface) in control. It was like putting herself in the mouth of the wolf in front of the world as a provocative attempt to take her power back.

Because her relationship with Terry lasted several years, I think she may have come to like him, or at least feel validated by him, since that defiance probably earned her a form of respect in his eyes. The SXSW vomit performance also fits into this pattern (obviously not calling the artist involved perverted).  She was publicly degrading herself as a way to externalize her pain.

She even acknowledges this tendency in songs like Replay and John Wayne. It was unhealthy and damaging, but I’m not going to blame a victim of abuse for the way she tried to survive and make sense of her pain. 

I think she’s covering her back if we’re honest, I love her but she clearly said back then she didn’t believe he was a pedophile, she kept working with Terry as well after the allegations against him came out well in 2014 as well. She also collaborated with R Kelly because her and Tara were DEEP into Hip-Hop/R&B at the time she made the early version of the album, and she recently bought a place to live in Chicago with Taylor at the time, and DJWS had the connections to get him on a song, AND Tara was a massive fan of his so much so Gaga put her in the video. 
 

I think her team was pushing for controversy since that’s what she was “known for” ala Madonna. I mean all the scrapped ideas for the early ARTPOP sessions and creative decisions were clearly made to make controversy (going out in revealing qnd sacrilegious versions of burqas, making a song called burqa, making songs about drugs and sex so explicitly, wanting the MANiCURE orgy murder video, wanting Sex Dreams and Burqa as singles, wanting to use twisted Disney imagery and references in the early concepts of stuff) plus the fact 2012 was the rise of the rap feature in pop songs and they pushed so hard for Gaga to have a rapper on her album so much so she worked with loads of them over the album creative period.

i think ARTPOP in general is a cluster f*ck of an album that Gaga wanted to make deep but just couldn’t because of everyone around getting a say in it.

 

[Ladle Ghoulash 36,543]

7 hours ago, Bonkers said:

maybe one of the differences was that the DWUW video appeared to glorify abuse, and the wrecking ball video wasn't about SA at all?

I mean, in no world does what we’ve seen about the video suggest that it glorifies abuse lmao 

[TheFrenchGuy 3,485]

3 minutes ago, gagzus said:

I think she’s covering her back if we’re honest, I love her but she clearly said back then she didn’t believe he was a pedophile, she kept working with Terry as well after the allegations against him came out well in 2014 as well. She also collaborated with R Kelly because her and Tara were DEEP into Hip-Hop/R&B at the time she made the early version of the album, and she recently bought a place to live in Chicago with Taylor at the time, and DJWS had the connections to get him on a song, AND Tara was a massive fan of his so much so Gaga put her in the video. 
 

I think her team was pushing for controversy since that’s what she was “known for” ala Madonna. I mean all the scrapped ideas for the early ARTPOP sessions and creative decisions were clearly made to make controversy (going out in revealing qnd sacrilegious versions of burqas, making a song called burqa, making songs about drugs and sex so explicitly, wanting the MANiCURE orgy murder video, wanting Sex Dreams and Burqa as singles, wanting to use twisted Disney imagery and references in the early concepts of stuff) plus the fact 2012 was the rise of the rap feature in pop songs and they pushed so hard for Gaga to have a rapper on her album so much so she worked with loads of them over the album creative period.

i think ARTPOP in general is a cluster f*ck of an album that Gaga wanted to make deep but just couldn’t because of everyone around getting a say in it.

 

Oh for sure, I agree with all of that. What I’m saying is that her need to be controversial was, at its core, a defiant way of dealing with her own trauma. A lot of it was obviously problematic, but I think it makes more sense when you put it in context.

[Ladle Ghoulash 36,543]

15 minutes ago, TheFrenchGuy said:

« My intention was to create something extremely defiant and provocative because I was angry and still hadn't processed the trauma that had occurred in my own life. The song is called Do What U Want (With My Body), I think it's clear how explicitly twisted my thinking was at the time. »

I think it’s clear she was in a very dark place, and that both DWUW and working with Terry were attempts to reclaim her sense of agency as a traumatized woman. She knew these men were perverted, and she chose to work with them in an aggressively defiant way where she was (on the surface) in control. It was like putting herself in the mouth of the wolf in front of the world as a provocative attempt to take her power back.

Because her relationship with Terry lasted several years, I think she may have come to like him, or at least feel validated by him, since that defiance probably earned her a form of respect in his eyes. The SXSW vomit performance also fits into this pattern (obviously not calling the artist involved perverted).  She was publicly degrading herself as a way to externalize her pain.

She even acknowledges this tendency in songs like Replay and John Wayne. It was unhealthy and damaging, but I’m not going to blame a victim of abuse for the way she tried to survive and make sense of her pain. 

I still stand by that, on a meta reality TV meets performance art level, including a known abuser on a track about the way the media normalizes sexual abuse towards women using R. Kelly as a symbol for that is implicitly dunking on him. I genuinely think turning the reality of women being abused in the industry inside out through that song is brilliant, but the reality of doing it with him resulted in her feeling the need to be on good terms with him as a collaborator, which dilutes the power of the message.

[gagzus 18,001]

7 hours ago, Bonkers said:

maybe one of the differences was that the DWUW video appeared to glorify abuse, and the wrecking ball video wasn't about SA at all?

Nah the video definitely doesn’t glorify abuse from what we have seen. Even the beginning with them putting her under and dancing around her unconscious body is clearly a reference to people doing what they want with her (not sexually since the dancers are literally having a damn party with food as well on her body lmao)

[gagzus 18,001]

8 minutes ago, TheFrenchGuy said:

Oh for sure, I agree with all of that. What I’m saying is that her need to be controversial was, at its core, a defiant way of dealing with her own trauma. A lot of it was obviously problematic, but I think it makes more sense when you put it in context.

Oh yeah absolutely, that’s why I think she’s more clean now image wise, she’s dealt with her trauma through therapy and more. Also big shoutout to whoever her therapist is for helping her become healthier mentally and for not selling her out by coming out and being like “I’m lady gaga's therapist and these are her secrets” like they would have done back in the early 2000s on a gossip magazine cover story

[gagzus 18,001]

14 minutes ago, Ladle Ghoulash said:

I mean, in no world does what we’ve seen about the video suggest that it glorifies abuse lmao 

And even the descriptions TMZ gave of the rest of the video seem unrealistic tbh, they said they couldn’t post the full video because it was “too much” (this coming from a website that’s literally had celebrities Coochie pics up from paparazzi shots before) but from what we can tell they posted pretty much all they had which was the BTS docu for it, hence why they had the shot of Terry shooting her on the set and the part where the hospital bed breaks and she and a dancer go flying 

[TheFrenchGuy 3,485]

5 minutes ago, Ladle Ghoulash said:

I still stand by that, on a meta reality TV meets performance art level, including a known abuser on a track about the way the media normalizes sexual abuse towards women using R. Kelly as a symbol for that is implicitly dunking on him. I genuinely think turning the reality of women being abused in the industry inside out through that song is brilliant, but the reality of doing it with him resulted in her feeling the need to be on good terms with him as a collaborator, which dilutes the power of the message.

It's been a while since I've seen the leaked intro, but I remember a forced pregnancy storyline (we're going to put you under and when you wake you're going to be pregnant or something like that). Thats WILD considering what we learned later about what happened before The Fame. She really took this notorious abuser sex freak and made him recreate her own story of abuse in such a twisted way

[gagzus 18,001]

Just now, TheFrenchGuy said:

It's been a while since I've seen the leaked intro, but I remember a forced pregnancy storyline (we're going to put you under and when you wake you're going to be pregnant or something like that). Thats WILD considering what we learned later about what happened before The Fame. She really took this notorious abuser sex freak and made him recreate her own story of abuse in such a twisted way

That was never corroborated though, there’s no reference to it in the opening leak (plus the opening leak has cuts of things taken out and chopped up) along with the rest of the video. That was something that TMZ only SAID happened and I doubt if they had the full video it wouldn’t have leaked by now. All they had was clips from the BitTorrent pack collab that was supposed to happen

[TheFrenchGuy 3,485]

10 minutes ago, gagzus said:

That was never corroborated though, there’s no reference to it in the opening leak (plus the opening leak has cuts of things taken out and chopped up) along with the rest of the video. That was something that TMZ only SAID happened and I doubt if they had the full video it wouldn’t have leaked by now. All they had was clips from the BitTorrent pack collab that was supposed to happen

Did I hallucinate that ? I distinctively remember hearing that back then but that part is conveniently muted in the leaked footage. TBH even if it's just from TMZ I believe it, it seems way too precise to be made up. Guess we'll never know for sure (and that's a good thing)

Edited January 12 by TheFrenchGuy

[gagzus 18,001]

11 minutes ago, TheFrenchGuy said:

Did I hallucinate that ? I distinctively remember hearing that back then but that part is conveniently muted in the leaked footage. TBH even if it's just from TMZ I believe it, it seems way too precise to be made up. Guess we'll never know for sure (and that's a good thing)

I don’t normally pull this card, but I have friends in the collector/trading community that have unreleased stuff, and back when it leaked I asked about it; and they said nobody has the video because only the BitTorrent pack was being passed around and those scenes were in the behind the scenes docu part. And I have no reason to not believe them. (The pack had the docu of the making of, pictures from on the set, an interview with Gaga about the video and R Kelly too but not the video itself) 

Like I said in an early comment do we really think of TMZ truly had the full length video and not just clips from the BitTorrent pack collab they would’ve not posted the full video? Because the traction it would get their website would’ve been astronomical, especially if all the things they said about it was true (which they aren’t) 

[TheFrenchGuy 3,485]

27 minutes ago, gagzus said:

I don’t normally pull this card, but I have friends in the collector/trading community that have unreleased stuff, and back when it leaked I asked about it; and they said nobody has the video because only the BitTorrent pack was being passed around and those scenes were in the behind the scenes docu part. And I have no reason to not believe them. (The pack had the docu of the making of, pictures from on the set, an interview with Gaga about the video and R Kelly too but not the video itself) 

Like I said in an early comment do we really think of TMZ truly had the full length video and not just clips from the BitTorrent pack collab they would’ve not posted the full video? Because the traction it would get their website would’ve been astronomical, especially if all the things they said about it was true (which they aren’t) 

That's very interesting thank you for sharing that info ! 

[elsamars 6,746]

I don't remember Miley or Beyoncé claiming to be a "kindness" punk.

Sometimes, the hypocrisy or virtue signaling is what puts people off.

[River 122,224]

2 hours ago, PartySick said:

 

Gaga also poked the bear with the whole "the media tells lies" thing. That's one of the main reasons she had him on the song. She was basically defending R. Kelly's innocence years after we knew what he was really getting up to. When the sh*t hit the fan with him, of course she got swept up in it. 

DJWS is the reason why she defended R. Kelly, he knew Kelly before and he introduced her to him, I believe he influenced her that everything is fiiinnneeee

[nATAH 53,528]

27 minutes ago, elsamars said:

I don't remember Miley or Beyoncé claiming to be a "kindness" punk.

Sometimes, the hypocrisy or virtue signaling is what puts people off.

gaga wasn't doing this either in 2013