Katy Perry shows support for Palestine

[homomo 23,883]

36 minutes ago, alsemanche said:

¿ im 26 babes

You do need to take a side against genocide and ethnic cleansing and colonialism actually. You can be a centrist about what color of skirts you like on a person but being 'neutral' about this is coward and despicable. Either you're with the colonized people who are getting brutally erased from existence or you're on the murderer's side, it's really not that complicated. 

I know Gaga won't change much, but a word on her spcials would help to some extent, even if it's simply for donations like other celebs have done. As I said before, I'm not counting on celebs to be saviors because that's childish anyway and there are much more important things to be thinking about but this would be a plus for sure. 

The “you’re either this or that” rhetoric is super unhealthy and such a toxic trait.

I get holding Gaga to this standard because of her history, but holding members here and saying “you’re either part of the solution or the problem” is just guilting everyday people who probably can’t even financially or mentally support this issue. It’s qualities that narcissistic people use to get others to follow them (therapy taught me this one)

Look, I like you and I know you’re a good person. But please direct your anger towards the right people. No one on this thread should be expected to speak out. I honestly never will, because I personally don’t know much about it because there’s too much going on in my life.

So, I guess my message is that if someone is able to support, awesome. If they aren’t, that’s okay too.

[Dennis 8,391]

6 hours ago, Economy said:

Im not surprised Katy would post this tbh. Theres very little controvery left. Even many Israel supporters agree this attack went too far.

I addressed this in another thread.

But you know what's crazy? To us it may seem like this attack crossed every line, seeing the horrific aftermath. But when you study the facts it paints a completely counter-intuitive picture. This time, Israel actually listened to U.S demands and used GBU-39 bombs (smallest type of bombs Israel can use) as requested by Biden to minimize civilian casualties, unlike many other instances where they recklessly used 2000lbs bombs (50 times more devasting than the bomb they used this time), and it ends being the attack that gets the most attention and the most horrific pictures out there.

This is what's scary about war. You can't control how things play out. Secondary explosions depending on what's in the area, can be a lot more devasting than the bomb itself. 

Even when you try to minimize casualties, it can't always play out that way. That's why there has to be a solution to end the war altogether, release the hostages, get Hamas to seek exile elsewhere and start the reconstruction process. This whole "minimize casualties" thing is not gonna work.

Source: https://www.nytimes.com/2024/05/29/world/middleeast/israel-us-rafah-bombs.html?smid=url-share
 

[Didymus 34,379]

37 minutes ago, monstertoronto said:

“Lol” is not an effective opening conducive to an actual discussion. People are very emotional and invested iin all sides of this ongoing very complicated issue.  I have both passionate Jewish friends and vociferous Palestine supporter friends, and it is a very nuanced and difficult topic that isn’t as black and white as the herd mentality on a pop culture fan forum wants it to be. 

I reject that.

But it's good to know who would be expressing these "it's too nuanced, just shut up" worldviews if we were in, say, Nazi Germany, or trying to end South African apartheid.

[Didymus 34,379]

13 minutes ago, homomo said:

The “you’re either this or that” rhetoric is super unhealthy and such a toxic trait.

I get holding Gaga to this standard because of her history, but holding members here and saying “you’re either part of the solution or the problem” is just guilting everyday people who probably can’t even financially or mentally support this issue. It’s qualities that narcissistic people use to get others to follow them (therapy taught me this one)

Look, I like you and I know you’re a good person. But please direct your anger towards the right people. No one on this thread should be expected to speak out. I honestly never will, because I personally don’t know much about it because there’s too much going on in my life.

So, I guess my message is that if someone is able to support, awesome. If they aren’t, that’s okay too.

I totally see where you're coming from and, in an important way, you're right.

AND no one who is speaking out should be guilted into watering down their disappointment, anger, grief,... because it makes people uncomfortable.

[CautiousLurker 19,468]

I wish people would just stop talking about this, and by this I mean Gaga's silence, because some of the replies are infuriating. Posting quippy comments like 'I'm glad she stayed out of this mess' - we're talking about a f*cking genocide happening in real time. 

Gaga hasn't said anything - whatever, there are other celebrities who have used their platforms. Speculating how this is 'strategic', and she doesn't have to, who knows what she's been doing privately - it's inconsequential at the end of the day, but it still feels like a gross conversation to have. People have died horrible deaths, and many more deaths are to come - I don't think that's the context within which it's appropriate to dwell on how much of a humanitarian a pop star is.

 

[Ziggy 11,863]

18 hours ago, G U C C I said:

It’s not beyond the pale. Not even close. There have been countless monstrosities committed all over the world since she became famous and she isn’t responsible nor should she be held accountable for taking a stance and speaking out against any government body or groups. She has always stood up and spoke for human rights her stance should be a given!
 

She is only responsible for what she can control. Her voice will do nothing in regards to Palestine or for the people who are suffering in the Congo, or anywhere else. She should remain silent. All these random celebs suddenly sounding off are only do so because of PR. At this point does it even really matter? Destruction of Gaza was always going to happen. Israel and billionaires are counting on taking that land. 

Uh no? When you’re rich af and have resources aplenty, your stance is never “a given” lol. Our stance is a given. We don’t have jack sh*t in comparison to impact that these folks have. Dont get it twisted bc they are face not faceless multi millionaires, their platforms mean something. Now granted, when I say “say something” I actually mean *do something bc look at what she was able to accomplish during lockdown. Even still, yes, not every problem can be handled (though don’t drag the Congo into this like it’s some gotcha afterthought) but if there’s one that she’s had active stake in before bc she’s performed there and the president you publicly align with is attaching his sinking ship to it, sorry baby it’s your problem too now. It’s incredibly disappointing bc at one point I would agree, she doesn’t have to talk about everything but that’s bc she at least talked about *something. This ain’t 2011 anymore. Shes silent on everything yet will trot out and stump in Pennsylvania for votes for blue. Yet now when the admin is making an enormous public policy move enacting mass death she’s got nothing to say? It’s tacky.

ive always loved her down, but I don’t need to hear random celebs saying stuff but frankly Gaga posits a lot of her success on her activism. If she wanted to be another celeb she can but then don’t then come out at rallies, tout your activism with a badge of pride. You really can’t have it both ways here.

[Ziggy 11,863]

15 hours ago, ALGAYDO said:

But we all know that big movie companies make their clients sign certain contracts prohibiting them from speaking about certain topics. For all we know, Gaga could be donating a **** ton of money to Palestine aid behind the scenes. I hope nobody here actually believes that Gaga is pro-genocide. And if you do, then you don’t know Gaga lol  

Lmao girl we need to get beyond “her contracts keep her silent” bc if she’s an activist then she wouldn’t be signing that. Period.

im not saying she’s pro genocide. I’m saying it’s pathetic that Katy Perry of all people, who f’in kills nuns for houses and voted for the anti-homeless mayor has had more to say on this than Gaga who is allegedly a beacon of activism in mainstream music. Now, I don’t want her just to speak. It’s been clear how she can use her platform before to create change. She’s done it! But in tying herself *very closely to this administration, frankly, she needs to be saying something at minimum, DOING something I’d hope. At this point it’s not a pro this anti that thing. There’s kids being murdered left and right. Ffs woman, what’s going to compel you to say something when you have the administration’s ear?

and tbh I don’t really care if it’s happening behind the scenes. Bc the point is she’s a public figure. Knowing how she’s using her influence is kind of part and parcel with that.

[LadyxGaGa 1,939]

9 hours ago, Didymus said:

I reject that.

But it's good to know who would be expressing these "it's too nuanced, just shut up" worldviews if we were in, say, Nazi Germany, or trying to end South African apartheid.

like exactly what is nuanced about a fking genocide?? what things are we not seeing that justifies the amount of bloodshed is enough 

[LadyxGaGa 1,939]

genuinely tho lemme ask how many people should b bombed before it’s enough?? 

 

[BULATIO 1,635]

7 hours ago, CautiousLurker said:

Posting quippy comments like 'I'm glad she stayed out of this mess'

It's not quippy comments 

[itsandrewtbh 385]

I'm willing to be enlightened but can somebody explain the importance of Gaga speaking up about this to me?

I see the open letter on twitter and see so many fans share and sign it. I'm totally against genocide in all ways it comes in and I personally want a ceasefire and not to have so many lives lost over this, but I'm just a 20 something from the UK I can't really do anything to help what's going on.

What will it do if Gaga speaks out, will it change laws? Will it stop the war? I'm just so confused and I really get Gaga has been an advocate for oppressed and minority groups and it's great. But does she really need to speak out on everything which involves an oppressed party? I'm pretty sure she would be donating behind the scenes like she did with COVID but why does she have to post about it, what will it do.

I get it's important but what is posting about something going to do, it's like when someone passes away and people say 'thoughts and prayers' how is that helping someone? No bereavement leaflets given, no offers to take someone to counselling or no help, just words. 

I just want to understand people's thoughts on it because I'd be happy to know she's funded free Palestine movements in the background than a post on social media, but does it mean so much to people and will it make a difference?

 

OT: cant wait for KP6

[Siena 6,268]

8 minutes ago, SourAndy said:

I'm willing to be enlightened but can somebody explain the importance of Gaga speaking up about this to me?

I see the open letter on twitter and see so many fans share and sign it. I'm totally against genocide in all ways it comes in and I personally want a ceasefire and not to have so many lives lost over this, but I'm just a 20 something from the UK I can't really do anything to help what's going on.

What will it do if Gaga speaks out, will it change laws? Will it stop the war? I'm just so confused and I really get Gaga has been an advocate for oppressed and minority groups and it's great. But does she really need to speak out on everything which involves an oppressed party? I'm pretty sure she would be donating behind the scenes like she did with COVID but why does she have to post about it, what will it do.

I get it's important but what is posting about something going to do, it's like when someone passes away and people say 'thoughts and prayers' how is that helping someone? No bereavement leaflets given, no offers to take someone to counselling or no help, just words. 

I just want to understand people's thoughts on it because I'd be happy to know she's funded free Palestine movements in the background than a post on social media, but does it mean so much to people and will it make a difference?

 

OT: cant wait for KP6

I’ve been seeing the post going around too and what I can’t understand is how they’re essentially begging for performative activism. I’m sorry but I think it’s a worse look for her to only say something after her fans have practically begged her too. That just shows she said something because she felt forced, not because she wanted to and actually means what she says. Her saying something will just allow fans to check her off the list of “ celebrities who’ve done nothing”, when in reality we have no idea what she has done behind the scenes to help.  An Instagram post isn’t going to  bring peace to governments who have had nothing but turmoil with each other. All she can do is donate and reach out to government officials, both of which we have no idea if she has done or not.  

[Didymus 34,379]

39 minutes ago, SourAndy said:

I'm willing to be enlightened but can somebody explain the importance of Gaga speaking up about this to me?

I see the open letter on twitter and see so many fans share and sign it. I'm totally against genocide in all ways it comes in and I personally want a ceasefire and not to have so many lives lost over this, but I'm just a 20 something from the UK I can't really do anything to help what's going on.

What will it do if Gaga speaks out, will it change laws? Will it stop the war? I'm just so confused and I really get Gaga has been an advocate for oppressed and minority groups and it's great. But does she really need to speak out on everything which involves an oppressed party? I'm pretty sure she would be donating behind the scenes like she did with COVID but why does she have to post about it, what will it do.

I get it's important but what is posting about something going to do, it's like when someone passes away and people say 'thoughts and prayers' how is that helping someone? No bereavement leaflets given, no offers to take someone to counselling or no help, just words. 

I just want to understand people's thoughts on it because I'd be happy to know she's funded free Palestine movements in the background than a post on social media, but does it mean so much to people and will it make a difference?

It absolutely makes a difference.

This isn't a new cause. The Palestinian freedom movement has been around for decades, and several high profile celebs (esp Susan Sarandon, Mark Ruffalo and Roger Waters) have been engaged in pro-Palestinian activism for many, many years.

This is critically important because people do not get neutral information from mainstream media. You'll notice that these and many other activists rely on independent journalists, civilians on the ground, human rights organizations,... to spread news and knowledge about what is really going on and has been going on in occupied Palestine.

You have to understand that Israel has a multi-million dollar propaganda strategy to manipulate the country's public image, so it can get away with violating international laws and committing war crimes. A huge part of this is its intimate ties with the US. Without US support for Israel, their military operations would crumble. This is why American protests have been far more important than, say, European: European politicians are, on the whole, more positive towards Palestine, and it's the US that is mostly single-handedly delaying the international peace process.

We've seen in the past with, for example, slavery and apartheid, that it was boycotts and protesting that ultimately motivated politicians to change course. One thing Gaga could talk about, for example, is the BDS movement, which boycotts companies that collaborate with Israel in its illegal settlement campaign in the occupied Palestinian territories. This movement has been demonized by Israel and American politicians because it works and has convinced multiple companies to stop this collaboration.

The goal here is to improve public perception about Israel and what it is doing, and to provide a powerful corrective against the manipulative stance of politicians that Israel is a democratic partner of the West. It is not. It is a far right state that wields an apartheid that has been described by humanitarian workers as worse than South African apartheid. Celebrities have legitimate power in shaping public perception and public knowledge. While American politicians, incl. the White House, are trying to convince the public that it is morally acceptable to arm a government carrying out a genocide, it's critical that people distance themselves from what their government is doing in their name.

This movement has grown dramatically in the last few years and it is all because of the actions of a bunch of people coming together, raising awareness in their own way, and showing courageous solidarity. The movement and its growing political urgency would've died a long time ago if these things didn't matter in the grand scheme of things. They do.

[monstertoronto 10,195]

10 hours ago, Didymus said:

Nazi Germany, or trying to end South African apartheid.

This is a very inaccurate comparison. 

Nazi Germany killed 6 million Jews (and millions and millions of other people), which was over a third of the entire Jewish population in the world and the majority of Europe’s Jewish population. Although it is also awful, the number of Palestinians killed in the last decade is no where near that scale to compare the two as equivalent  

Nazis herded Jews into death camps, where they were actual prisoners. Gaza is not an actual concentration camp. It is a territory with its own economy and security force. 

Jews were imprisoned and systematically executed. Gaza is a party in the middle of a two-party conflict. 

It’s this kind of emotional but inaccurate rhetoric that gets tossed around quickly and easily to shame people that escalates this discussion into unhealthy territory. 
 

[Daenerys 6,120]

22 hours ago, holy scheisse said:

Speaking against Israel does not mean a person hates Jews 

It really doesn’t. I absolutely agree. But look at the current state of social media. One post alienates one side no matter which way things go. Perception is showing if you support Palestine you support Hamas, are anti-simetic and condone terrorism. The other side perceives if you support Israel you are a Zionist and approve of the G word. At this point it’s a lose-lose.