Macron will not ask for ‘forgiveness’ over the colonization of Algeria

[FfFfFfFF 58,081]

French President Emmanuel Macron does not intend to “ask for forgiveness” over his country’s colonization of Algeria and its role in the war of independence, he said in an interview published Wednesday in French weekly Le Point.

“It’s not relevant, and the word [forgive] would break all bonds,” Macron told French-Algerian writer Kamel Daoud during his state visit to Algeria back in August.

A former French colony, Algeria gained its independence in 1962, after an eight-year war that claimed hundreds of thousands of lives — most of them on the Algerian side.

The brutality of the war, which included executions and acts of torture against Algerian nationalists, had a lasting impact on French politics and society, and remains a highly sensitive subject in France.

Source - https://www.politico.eu/article/emmanuel-macron-france-will-not-ask-algeria-for-forgiveness-over-colonisation/, https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/1/12/macron-will-not-ask-algeria-for-forgiveness-over-colonialism. 

[Better Day 5,766]

Why is it his responsibility? Colonisation happened unfortunately, no pointless apologises will change that fact. 

[FfFfFfFF 58,081]

Just now, Midnights Mayhem said:

Why is it his responsibility? Colonisation happened unfortunately, no pointless apologises will change that fact. 

I get that not all individual French people are guilty for their country's past, but Macron is, as a leader of a country inheriting a colonial past, one of the French people that bear a responsibility (moreover France is still colonizing African nations to this day). And even if the apologies won't change anything now, that doesn't mean he should not give them if they are justified (this is like saying Turkey can deny the Armenian genocide because all those lives are lost and not coming back).

[Better Day 5,766]

4 minutes ago, FfFfFfFF said:

I get that not all individual French people are guilty for their country's past, but Macron is, as a leader of a country inheriting a colonial past, one of the French people that bear a responsibility (moreover France is still colonizing African nations to this day). And even if the apologies won't change anything now, that doesn't mean he should not give them if they are justified (this is like saying Turkey can deny the Armenian genocide because all those lives are lost and not coming back).

Colonisation was vital back in they days. It was a dog eats dog world, if a country was not coloniser, it was colonised. 

[BBhomemaker 5,611]

"It's not relevant" ..to him ofc, millions of us have their roots tied to Algeria, the feeling of anger and needs for answers are getting pass on from generation to generation. Its not about excuses, it's about acknowledging, why and how this became a total catastrophe that soldiers didn't know where to shoot, people lost their houses, their lives, their jobs for what ??? They traumatised multiples groups from different religions and cultures that lived all together for decades .. how they succeeded to put them against each others. And Macron is dealing with it rn, the consequences of millions of people (french or not) living in France rejecting France, its valors, ideas, culture.. the proudness of it, cause today it's the reality that he have to face : many people don't feel french or don't wanna be french or at least what it represent. Me first, I feel angry on how France erased people and history by simply putting up front what they wanted and hidding the rest. They are still not ready to talk about it

[FfFfFfFF 58,081]

Just now, Midnights Mayhem said:

Colonisation was vital back in they days. It was a dog eats dog world, if a country was not coloniser, it was colonised. 

Not all countries had colonial empires. Western Europe had, but the East didn't (and to this day remains poorer than the West). Nobody was pointing a gun to France, UK's and Spain heads to start the Scramble for Africa. Colonialism is a shameful legacy the West needs to assume and pay reparations for. And the logic of "everybody was doing it so we're fine" can excuse a plethora of immoral things.

[Rat Boy 43,832]

Omg are there people here minimising the impacts of colonisation?? As a POC, some people will never understand how actions that happened many years ago are still impacting us today.

[Natalia Kills 413]

1 minute ago, FfFfFfFF said:

Not all countries had colonial empires. Western Europe had, but the East didn't (and to this day remains poorer than the West). Nobody was pointing a gun to France, UK's and Spain heads to start the Scramble for Africa. Colonialism is a shameful legacy the West needs to assume and pay reparations for. And the logic of "everybody was doing it so we're fine" can excuse a plethora of immoral things.

Russia had a colonial Empire, in all fairness.

I don't think reparations are fair because we can't draw a straight line through history and decide anyone past that line should pay for the future. 

I'd only agree to pay reparations if the countries/recipients agree to improve a common factor like human rights or environment, or the payer can choose what to spend it on to help the country. 

[BBhomemaker 5,611]

It's also typical Macron attitude looking others down, and giving "lessons", watch him preaching about solidarity and pointing out others countries next week. 
Idk why i'm surprise, France is uncomfortable each time they have to talk about Algeria 

[FfFfFfFF 58,081]

1 minute ago, Pineapple said:

Russia had a colonial Empire, in all fairness.

I don't think reparations are fair because we can't draw a straight line through history and decide anyone past that line should pay for the future. 

I'd only agree to pay reparations if the countries/recipients agree to improve a common factor like human rights or environment, or the payer can choose what to spend it on to help the country. 

Well, yes, Russia was the only Eastern European country with a colonial empire (though not in Africa).

On the other hand, Germany paid reparations for WW2 and I don't see people contesting it. But then even if not financial, the figure heads of former colonial empires deserve to at least give some moral, verbal reparations to their former colonies.

 

[Natalia Kills 413]

3 minutes ago, FfFfFfFF said:

Well, yes, Russia was the only Eastern European country with a colonial empire (though not in Africa).

On the other hand, Germany paid reparations for WW2 and I don't see people contesting it. But then even if not financial, the figure heads of former colonial empires deserve to at least give some moral, verbal reparations to their former colonies.

 

I agree on verbal reparations to be fair!

[Dennis 8,391]

Sure, then let's get the U.S to apologize to the natives, China to apologize to much of Asia (including Taiwan) for colonizing them under the Qing Dynasty, Russia to apologize for the stolen land they still control to this day in Siberia and Central Asia, Britain, Turkey to apologize the arab countries for subjugating them for centuries, and the list goes on and on.

In my opinion, instead of being obsessed with the past let's focus on what we can change in our lifetime. A lot of people are turning a blind eye to injustices unfolding before our eyes.

[alsemanche 97,796]

32 minutes ago, Midnights Mayhem said:

Colonisation was vital back in they days. It was a dog eats dog world, if a country was not coloniser, it was colonised. 

You can't be serious

[Economy 52,842]

39 minutes ago, FfFfFfFF said:

I get that not all individual French people are guilty for their country's past, but Macron is, as a leader of a country inheriting a colonial past, one of the French people that bear a responsibility (moreover France is still colonizing African nations to this day). And even if the apologies won't change anything now, that doesn't mean he should not give them if they are justified (this is like saying Turkey can deny the Armenian genocide because all those lives are lost and not coming back).

People seem to get even more angry when you apologize because "it doesn't change what happened".

 

I agree the government bears responsibility overall tho even if u can't blame any specific leaders now for it as individuals 

[Economy 52,842]

5 hours ago, Dennis said:

Sure, then let's get the U.S to apologize to the natives, China to apologize to much of Asia (including Taiwan) for colonizing them under the Qing Dynasty, Russia to apologize for the stolen land they still control to this day in Siberia and Central Asia, Britain, Turkey to apologize the arab countries for subjugating them for centuries, and the list goes on and on.

In my opinion, instead of being obsessed with the past let's focus on what we can change in our lifetime. A lot of people are turning blind eyes to injustices unfolding before our eyes.

That I kinda agree with. Ppl sometimes get triggered more by something that happened 50, 100 or even more years ago while completely ignoring present horrors (for example child slavery)

 

Not to say that the past doesn't deserve attention too to learn from history, or that an apology or official recognition isn't a positive thing...

 

But where ppls greater emphasis seems to go to me seems questionable. 

 

Sometimes I think it's because discussions about whether the past matters now or not gets into more political discussions and ppl subconsciously enjoy arguing, anything political is ALWAYS more triggering even if it's less severe. It's why some ppl get more angry if someone accidentally misgenders someone than if you read a story about someone who killed their parents. We all agree present things like child slavery is bad so who cares to try and drag about it online? It doesn't bring the same rush