Chromatican 4,046 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 1 minute ago, Bonkers said: teach me, which of these are genders: male female non-binary (or is it a non gender?) Is 'cis male/female' a "gender" or a type of gender? Are there other genders? And for sexes, besides male/female what are there? Genders: Man, Woman (cis and trans are a type of these genders) Sexes: Male, Female, Intersex Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsemanche 97,855 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 6 minutes ago, Chromatican said: Is she lying though? There are two gender identities (man, woman) and they are based on the two sexes which is based on gamete production. I’d say that third gender identities is a culturally specific belief and not widespread. Yes she is very much lying. Gender isn't sex and gender isn't a binary, it's a spectrum. Man and woman are genders, and so is every single gender in between the two or beyond them. Gender isn't biologically determined by genes and genitals. Soft, soothing, and succulent Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonkers 30,875 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 1 minute ago, Chromatican said: Genders: Man, Woman (cis and trans are a type of these genders) Sexes: Male, Female, Intersex so what vocabulary do you use for non-binary? Just now, alsemanche said: Yes she is very much lying. Gender isn't sex and gender isn't a binary, it's a spectrum. Man and woman are genders, and so is every single gender in between the two or beyond them. Gender isn't biologically determined by genes and genitals. I agree gender is a spectrum, but is it not true there are two ends of this spectrum, male & female? Remember to like and subscribe, and click on the bell icon to get the latest updates Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chromatican 4,046 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 1 minute ago, alsemanche said: Yes she is very much lying. Gender isn't sex and gender isn't a binary, it's a spectrum. Man and woman are genders, and so is every single gender in between the two or beyond them. Gender isn't biologically determined by genes and genitals. Gender is not determined but is strongly aligned with genes and genitals for most people. What exists between the binary of man and woman? Non-binary as a term implies existing outside of man and woman, not between. It’s not inter-binary. Gender cannot be anything you want it to be. That makes the concept amorphous and marginalizes binary transgender people. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsemanche 97,855 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 7 minutes ago, Bonkers said: Is 'cis male/female' a "gender" or a type of gender? cis means you identify with the gender typically linked to your sex (so like if you were born female and you identify as a woman, you are cis) and trans means you don't identify with that, but as another gender (whether man/woman or else) Soft, soothing, and succulent Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chromatican 4,046 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 Just now, Bonkers said: so what vocabulary do you use for non-binary? I agree gender is a spectrum, but is it not true there are two ends of this spectrum, male & female? I don’t believe in non-binary except for in rare cases and culturally specific examples like 2 Spirit people. I prefer the term gender fluid male or gender fluid female. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonkers 30,875 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 6 minutes ago, alsemanche said: Yes she is very much lying. Gender isn't sex and gender isn't a binary, it's a spectrum. Man and woman are genders, and so is every single gender in between the two or beyond them. Gender isn't biologically determined by genes and genitals. also, "man and woman" are genders. not "male and female"? is this an important distinction? I can see how by making it "woman" it would be helpful to transwomen because it takes sex out of the vocabulary. I guess that's why? Remember to like and subscribe, and click on the bell icon to get the latest updates Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsemanche 97,855 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 7 minutes ago, Chromatican said: Gender is not determined but is strongly aligned with genes and genitals for most people. What exists between the binary of man and woman? Non-binary as a term implies existing outside of man and woman, not between. It’s not inter-binary. Gender cannot be anything you want it to be. That makes the concept amorphous and marginalizes binary transgender people. Exactly, it's strongly aligned by what humans decided to strongly align it with. It's not a given. And non-binary means either between or beyond. The outside of the man/woman binary includes both in-between and beyond it. That's why it's non-binary, meaning not belonging to the two extremes that society has created as the "norm". And how does letting people identify with whatever they want marginalizing anyone? Binary transgender people (the way you worded it) are as valid and non-binary people, it's not an either/or equation. Soft, soothing, and succulent Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bottom 1,842 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 This is the perfect example of what modern day conservatism is all about, they don't care about the economy, they don't care about politics, they don't care about helping people, all they care about is who can shout the loudest against various minorities, their whole party and it's supporters only care about hurting others Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsemanche 97,855 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 1 minute ago, Bonkers said: also, "man and woman" are genders. not "male and female"? is this an important distinction. I can see how by making it "woman" it would be helpful to transwomen because it takes sex out of the vocabulary. I guess that's why? It's not a solid rule of language tbh but I prefer to use it that way and many do that too. Male/female refers to sex and man/woman to gender. It creates a more inclusive language system of referring to people. Soft, soothing, and succulent Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alsemanche 97,855 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 4 minutes ago, Chromatican said: I don’t believe in non-binary except for in rare cases and culturally specific examples like 2 Spirit people. I prefer the term gender fluid male or gender fluid female. Except it's not up to you to "believe" in them. You're literally invalidating their identity... Soft, soothing, and succulent Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chromatican 4,046 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 Just now, alsemanche said: Exactly, it's strongly aligned by what humans decided to strongly align it with. It's not a given. And non-binary means either between or beyond. The outside of the man/woman binary includes both in-between and beyond it. That's why it's non-binary, meaning not belonging to the two extremes that society that created as the "norm". And how does letting people identify with whatever they want marginalizing anyone? Binary transgender people (the wya you worded it) are as valid and non-binary people, it's not an either/or equation. For the vast majority, gender and sex are aligned. Give names for what the between and beyond genders are called and what constitutes those experiences. Allowing people to identify as xenogenders does marginalize dysphoric trans people: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJHolland 12,725 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 19 minutes ago, Chromatican said: Is she lying though? There are two gender identities (man, woman) and they are based on the two sexes which is based on gamete production. I’d say that third gender identities is a culturally specific belief and not widespread. You’re a bigot enjoy the block Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chromatican 4,046 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 1 minute ago, alsemanche said: Except it's not up to you to "believe" in them. You're literally invalidating their identity... I am a member of the LGBT community so it is up to me who is a member or not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chromatican 4,046 Posted February 25, 2021 Share Posted February 25, 2021 Just now, MJHolland said: You’re a bigot enjoy the block Bigot? I support transgender rights. My icon is a transwoman, I just believe in gatekeeping the community from nb people who often use the trans label to transgender people's detriment and muddy the water. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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