JanStan 574 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 21 minutes ago, FATCAT said: Progressives won all their seats again because they're safe seats. I'm sorry, but running far left is not going to help us pick up seats in places where even moderates have support gaps. The logic is flawed, and it's pretty blatant. I understand that the answer is not staying centrist but the answer is also not going full-blown AOC. We can find a comfortable middle ground for the party as a whole so that we can be competitive in districts and states that are more conservative. I agree with this. There are issues that are considered far left that are popular among a majority of people like M4A. However, there are some things that are so blatantly unacceptable that people (even moderate democrats) are willing to pass up policies they like on the left to keep the other issues from getting through. Think defunding the police and eradicating ICE. This is why the talk of how popular progressive ideas are way exaggerated. If it were so popular it wouldn’t be considered the far left and would just be ‘the left’. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FATCAT 60,888 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Just now, JanStan said: I agree with this. There are issues that are considered far left that are popular among a majority of people like M4A. However, there are some things that are so blatantly unacceptable that people (even moderate democrats) are willing to pass up policies they like on the left to keep the other issues from getting through. Think defunding the police and eradicating ICE. This is why the talk of how popular progressive ideas are way exaggerated. If it were so popular it wouldn’t be considered the far left and would just be ‘the left’. And what's worse is that it's all semantics. We don't have to say "defund the police" all we have to say is Police reform & people will eat it up. We're literally shooting ourselves in the foot when we use these asinine terms. This kitten over here (meow) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JusKeepBreathin 19,311 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 35 minutes ago, FATCAT said: Progressives won all their seats again because they're safe seats. I'm sorry, but running far left is not going to help us pick up seats in places where even moderates have support gaps. The logic is flawed, and it's pretty blatant. I understand that the answer is not staying centrist but the answer is also not going full-blown AOC. We can find a comfortable middle ground for the party as a whole so that we can be competitive in districts and states that are more conservative. They aren't ready for that conversation. "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." -Martin Luther King Jr. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FATCAT 60,888 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Just now, JusKeepBreathin said: They aren't ready for that conversation. It's a tough thing to accept, but it's a pill that everyone must swallow if we're to make any progressive policy in the country stick. Even the freaking ACA is up for debate after more than a decade, and it's not even close to a public option, let alone M4A. Even popular policies are under attack by republicans. We have to be deliberate and vigilant, Independents will vote against their self interest in a heartbeat if they fear the left. This kitten over here (meow) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JusKeepBreathin 19,311 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 9 minutes ago, FATCAT said: It's a tough thing to accept, but it's a pill that everyone must swallow if we're to make any progressive policy in the country stick. Even the freaking ACA is up for debate after more than a decade, and it's not even close to a public option, let alone M4A. Even popular policies are under attack by republicans. We have to be deliberate and vigilant, Independents will vote against their self interest in a heartbeat if they fear the left. Yes, but they will vote against their best interest in a Presidential election but if it's a state to state vote like increasing the min wage and legalized marijuana they will vote to approve it. What progressive fail to realize is the United States doesn't like the president to have alll the power. They will vote in their best interest in smaller statewide elections. And honestly that isn't a bad thing. Find a way to pass Medicare for all in state wide elections so that a red Senate majority doesn't matter in the result. Also rebrand medicars 4 all so it's not married to Bernie. "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." -Martin Luther King Jr. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanStan 574 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 6 minutes ago, FATCAT said: And what's worse is that it's all semantics. We don't have to say "defund the police" all we have to say is Police reform & people will eat it up. We're literally shooting ourselves in the foot when we use these asinine terms. Absolutely. I’ve said the same thing in past posts. Messaging has been an absolute disaster. Even worse, I think SJWs are destroying the party with their incessant labeling of everyone/everything as racist, homophobic, sexist etc. It’s so off putting as to make even many minorities groups vote republican. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FATCAT 60,888 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 18 minutes ago, JanStan said: Absolutely. I’ve said the same thing in past posts. Messaging has been an absolute disaster. Even worse, I think SJWs are destroying the party with their incessant labeling of everyone/everything as racist, homophobic, sexist etc. It’s so off putting as to make even many minorities groups vote republican. I think cancel culture is definitely not helping us, but to be fair it's nothing new, it's just that Twitter and facebook have turned scandals into a hashtag party over anything. This kitten over here (meow) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JanStan 574 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, FATCAT said: I think cancel culture is definitely not helping us, but to be fair it's nothing new, it's just that Twitter and facebook have turned scandals into a hashtag party over anything. It’s not only social media but even in conversation. For example let’s say someone supports M4A but they don’t support benefits for illegal immigrants. Some SJWs would be so quick to label that person racist, xenophobic etc etc. It happens here all the time. That kind of behavior is such a burden to the Democratic Party. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FATCAT 60,888 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 8 minutes ago, JanStan said: It’s not only social media but even in conversation. For example let’s say someone supports M4A but they don’t support benefits for illegal immigrants. Some SJWs would be so quick to label that person racist, xenophobic etc etc. It happens here all the time. That kind of behavior is such a burden to the Democratic Party. What part of the country do you live in? I've never interacted with anything like that This kitten over here (meow) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LilMonst3r 5,681 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 If shes not the first she will be the best Second female president. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chromatican 4,046 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 Just now, myluis617 said: If shes not the first she will be the best Second female president. AOC, Kamala Harris and Cardi B are all Libra suns with Aries moons. I've learned not to underestimate these people. Trust and believe, if anyone can win the White House in the future it is AOC. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emvee 8,826 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 2 hours ago, JusKeepBreathin said: They aren't ready for that conversation. As if we’ve never heard that tired ass centrist argument While Joe Biden’s unenthusiastic campaign only inspired people to vote against Trump (barely) and ignore down ballot Democrats, Americans voted for progressive policies in some of the most unexpected places in the country. It’s not the policies Americans are turned off by- it’s the slimy neoliberal Democrats who pat you on the head for being a minority with one hand and take money from big corporations with the other. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarstruckIllusion 53,563 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 2 hours ago, FATCAT said: Progressives won all their seats again because they're safe seats. I'm sorry, but running far left is not going to help us pick up seats in places where even moderates have support gaps. The logic is flawed, and it's pretty blatant. I understand that the answer is not staying centrist but the answer is also not going full-blown AOC. We can find a comfortable middle ground for the party as a whole so that we can be competitive in districts and states that are more conservative. Don’t know what’s safe about a swing seat... they literally used to be republicans seats. Read the 4th tweet in the OP. These aren’t New York and San Francisco voters were talking about. Even Cori Bush won in red-ass Missouri. Progressive policies do not hurt people’s chances 1 hour ago, JusKeepBreathin said: Yes, but they will vote against their best interest in a Presidential election but if it's a state to state vote like increasing the min wage and legalized marijuana they will vote to approve it. What progressive fail to realize is the United States doesn't like the president to have alll the power. They will vote in their best interest in smaller statewide elections. And honestly that isn't a bad thing. Find a way to pass Medicare for all in state wide elections so that a red Senate majority doesn't matter in the result. Also rebrand medicars 4 all so it's not married to Bernie. Bernie’s campaign slogan was literally “Not me, Us...” what?? Bernie knew he’d have to use the power of activism to get policy done if he ever became president. Plus Cori Bush and others winning is getting a lot of attention online... there’s attention outside the presidential race. also no need for a rebrand, Bernie and M4A are still popular and favoured and don’t need your personal approval. Anyone not voting for a good policy bc of who its attached to is idiotic and rarely happens. Like, when Florida just secured Bernie’s living wage policy, but not Biden themselves. 2 hours ago, JanStan said: I agree with this. There are issues that are considered far left that are popular among a majority of people like M4A. However, there are some things that are so blatantly unacceptable that people (even moderate democrats) are willing to pass up policies they like on the left to keep the other issues from getting through. Think defunding the police and eradicating ICE. This is why the talk of how popular progressive ideas are way exaggerated. If it were so popular it wouldn’t be considered the far left and would just be ‘the left’. The people who use “far left” seriously, don’t care about its popularity. M4A increased in popularity despite being called too radical all primary long. Good ideas are just good ideas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FATCAT 60,888 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, StarstruckIllusion said: Don’t know what’s safe about a swing seat... they literally used to be republicans seats. Read the 4th tweet in the OP. These aren’t New York and San Francisco voters were talking about. Even Cori Bush won in red-ass Missouri. Progressive policies do not hurt people’s chances Bernie’s campaign slogan was literally “Not me, Us...” what?? Bernie knew he’d have to use the power of activism to get policy done if he ever became president. Plus Cori Bush and others winning is getting a lot of attention online... there’s attention outside the presidential race. also no need for a rebrand, Bernie and M4A are still popular and favoured and don’t need your personal approval. Anyone not voting for a good policy bc of who its attached to is idiotic and rarely happens. Like, when Florida just secured Bernie’s living wage policy, but not Biden themselves. The people who use “far left” seriously, don’t care about its popularity. M4A increased in popularity despite being called too radical all primary long. Good ideas are just good ideas. Cori Bush is litterally in St. Louis. A major city, Missouri's second. Her district is 99% urbanized. If you can find me a progressive candidate that's winning 60% rural districts, let me know. This kitten over here (meow) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JusKeepBreathin 19,311 Posted November 10, 2020 Share Posted November 10, 2020 1 hour ago, FATCAT said: What part of the country do you live in? I've never interacted with anything like that Welcome to South Florida with the highest ACA applications nationwide in Hialeah but also a Cuban Republican no benefits for illegal aliens city. "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." -Martin Luther King Jr. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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