Economy 52,845 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Saint Laurent said: As I said, I'm in my early twenties and the age I will be able to retire is nowhere near being announced, it won't be for probably another 15/20 years, so there is every possibility that 85 is likely. In relation to your last point, perhaps you don't fully understand how the UK's tax system works. We all pay a considerable percentage of our salaries in National Insurance, which is intended to fund our State Pensions (among other things). As such, I frankly couldn't care less if it's incredibly costly because we are and will be contributing to the pension pot until the point we receive one. I find it hard to believe that any party would go to the extreme of raising it to 85 unless ppl started living to 110 ... For a long time no reforms were done globally to account for great increases in life expectancy and lower birth rates. I don't think the move some Countries are making of a few years increase is even remotely unreasonable. I think it's just realistic And I get that u may deduct a lot... But the money u deduct now is not for you, it's not a personal RSP. The money u deduct now is to finance the fund for current retirees and the money u receive when u retire will be from the working ppl (unless the UK system is far different from other Countries) If ppl keep refusing to accept that 65 is an outdated standard from a time many ppl didn't even make it to 70... the effects on the economy will continue to build I guess some of it is a matter of values... I don't think it's worth living your entire life in a strained system that affects the finances and economy of a Nation in order to avoid 2 or 3 extra years at the end Portugal where I used to live has risen it to nearly 67 now and it's helped them a lot in economic output and in helping financial challanges Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,845 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 11 minutes ago, Cello said: I don't see how it's reasonable for people to still have to work at 68, especially in manual jobs. It seems to me that the conservatives will continue to increase the pension age to encourage people to save more of their own money for retirement and eventually phase out pensions entirely. But how can people even save enough to do that when just living costs so much. I literally just said I think manual jobs should be exempt As for ur claim that they will keep raising it I think that's an unfair assumption Again for SOOO long the retirement systems were never adjusted for significant increases in life expectancy and years of benefit increases I don't think making a couple years adjustment should label u as a bad guy that will keep raising them... I think these adjustments are long overdue tbh What if life expectancy keeps rising? What if it goes up to 88 one day? Or 90? Or even higher? Are we supposed to keep it at 65 indefinitely? Sooner or later ppl have to acknowledge something isn't sustainable no matter how unpopular it might be and adjustments just have to be made Reminds me of the old timers back in Portugal that complained when the Government started to make it mandatory for ppl to do more than grade 4 and parents had to make the sacrafice of having to wait longer to be able to use kids to help them out Ppl didn't like th change at first but in a modern world grade 4 gets u nowhere. It had to be changed whether ppl liked it or not Ever longer life spans I think Is also a reality that forces adjustments to how we view retirement. Keep ignoring it and when the government is finally forced to take action the increase will end up being more severe than if it's dealt with now Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xoxo Craig 55,649 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 30 minutes left and we should have an exit poll End Racism Now Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Laurent 4,862 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 12 minutes ago, Economy said: I find it hard to believe that any party would go to the extreme of raising it to 85 unless ppl started living to 110 ... For a long time no reforms were done globally to account for great increases in life expectancy and lower birth rates. I don't think the move some Countries are making of a few years increase is even remotely unreasonable. I think it's just realistic And I get that u may deduct a lot... But the money u deduct now is not for you, it's not a personal RSP. The money u deduct now is to finance the fund for current retirees and the money u receive when u retire will be from the working ppl (unless the UK system is far different from other Countries) If ppl keep refusing to accept that 65 is an outdated standard from a time many ppl didn't even make it to 70... the effects on the economy will continue to build I guess some of it is a matter of values... I don't think it's worth living your entire life in a strained system that affects the finances and economy of a Nation in order to avoid 2 or 3 extra years at the end Portugal where I used to live has risen it to nearly 67 now and it's helped them a lot in economic output and in helping financial challanges You're right, it is a matter of values and I would say that there are far more moralistic (if you like) ways of improving financial issues that don't see people having their pensions ripped from under them, forcing them to work well beyond their desire to. We do not exist, as individuals, to serve the financial interests of the country, that time is politics has long passed. We, as individuals, contribute handsomely and a large proportion of us are willing to contribute even more to assist, but we must not lose sight that there are people and companies not paying the taxes that they ought to be. The individual should not be punished for that. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celloo Deng 56,317 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 🌹🌹🌹🌹 she/her 🖤 Gaga, Billie, MJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zander 14,944 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 Something I'm not a fan of in general (and what I saw a lot of in the US election) are these celebrities endorsing who people NEED to vote for. Decide for yourself and dont be influenced because someone you follow or like says so. Sadly there are too many impressionable voters around who don't really know what policies they are voting for. By all means get people to go out and vote but don't tell them who they should be voting for. Celebrity millionaires telling me who I should vote for? I have to laugh. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,845 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 2 minutes ago, Saint Laurent said: You're right, it is a matter of values and I would say that there are far more moralistic (if you like) ways of improving financial issues that don't see people having their pensions ripped from under them, forcing them to work well beyond their desire to. We do not exist, as individuals, to serve the financial interests of the country, that time is politics has long passed. I don't think an adjustment to keep in mind changing life expectancy qualified as "ripping pensions from under them"... Ppl in the 21st century are literally receiving these benefits for an unprecedented amount of time And yes there's always some way to fund it otherwise... But I can't think of any realistic way to fund it long term that won't affect everyone's quality of life tho if life expectancy keeps rising and retirement age stubbornly stays flat If life expectancy flattens out near here ok... while a strain, it's still manageable... Should some of the revolutionary ideas in medical science come to fruit and we start living beyond 100 let's say... Would u still want to keep it at 65??? Where is the line drawn? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Laurent 4,862 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Economy said: I don't think an adjustment to keep in mind changing life expectancy qualified as "ripping pensions from under them"... Ppl in the 21st century are literally receiving these benefits for an unprecedented amount of time And yes there's always some way to fund it otherwise... But I can't think of any realistic way to fund it long term that won't affect everyone's quality of life tho if life expectancy keeps rising and retirement age stubbornly stays flat If life expectancy flattens out near here ok... while a strain, it's still manageable... Should some of the revolutionary ideas in medical science come to fruit and we start living beyond 100 let's say... Would u still want to keep it at 65??? Where is the line drawn? I can! Forcing companies to pay the tax they ought to. Hopefully if we wake up tomorrow to a Labour majority that will happen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJM 1,520 Posted December 12, 2019 Author Share Posted December 12, 2019 9 minutes ago, xoxo Craig said: 30 minutes left and we should have an exit poll I am not emotionally prepared for this exit poll 🙋🏼♂️ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xoxo Craig 55,649 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 Just now, DrewJayC said: I am not emotionally prepared for this exit poll End Racism Now Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celloo Deng 56,317 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Economy said: I don't think an adjustment to keep in mind changing life expectancy qualified as "ripping pensions from under them"... Ppl in the 21st century are literally receiving these benefits for an unprecedented amount of time You probably wouldn't know about it, being a UK problem, but it has been a big news story for quite some time here now that a generation of women have literally had a portion of their pensions taken away. That's probably what Saint Laurent is referring to. she/her 🖤 Gaga, Billie, MJ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJM 1,520 Posted December 12, 2019 Author Share Posted December 12, 2019 We have hope girlies. QUEEN sturgeon could be our saviour come the morn 🙋🏼♂️ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zander 14,944 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 Worth keeping this in mind with accuracy of Exit Polls. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,845 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 11 minutes ago, Saint Laurent said: I can! Forcing companies to pay the tax they ought to. Hopefully if we wake up tomorrow to a Labour majority that will happen. Taxes can only go up on companies so much before higher costs are passed on to consumers and then ur still paying for it in the end I think going after wealthy individuals themselves is maybe a better target than companies But regardless there is a limit to how much u can raise taxes before negatives start to show up... U may be able to increase taxes from current levels without harm but up till what point?... U didn't answer my question about any kind of limit. What if we did all start to live to 100? 110? Is there some point u think we should finally raise it or just keep it at 65 forever? The issue goes far beyond just how your going to finances the retirement itself. It's also the fact that the higher the percentage the population isn't producing, the lower GDP per capita because wealth cannot be generated without labor If GDP per capita falls, it's doubtful wealth redistribution alone will compensate the standard of living Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,845 Posted December 12, 2019 Share Posted December 12, 2019 7 minutes ago, Cello said: You probably wouldn't know about it, being a UK problem, but it has been a big news story for quite some time here now that a generation of women have literally had a portion of their pensions taken away. That's probably what Saint Laurent is referring to. Thanks for clarifying I thought he was refering to slight increases in eligibility age itself Tbh I think that's inevitable at some point... I don't think it's something u can fight forever especially if life expectancy increases haven't topped out yet Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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