KleinGa 18,177 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 4 hours ago, HorusRa2 said: Bernie’s demographics aren’t majority white or male today & so the term is erasure to majority of his base. In fact, Bernie’s support is fueled by Latinos (the only race demo he beats every candidate in). So, I see the term as sexist and racist. If you would read what I’ve been talking about in this thread, you would see that I only refer to Bernie supporters as Bernie Bros when talking about 2016 because then his supporters were white and male. note I speak about them as “Bernie fans” when speaking generally about the present day. Additionally, Bernie’s campaign (although more diverse than 2016) remains white and male. If you’re a bernie bro and feel victimized by me calling you a bernie bro, you’re part of the problem. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
En_Sabah_Nur 9,366 Posted November 8, 2019 Author Share Posted November 8, 2019 23 minutes ago, HorusRa2 said: What does it even mean to be a “democrat?” You keep saying the same talking points that CNN and MSNBC taught you but you don’t really contribute anything of value to the conversation. And did it not occur to you that he’s running as a democrat to change what it means to be a “democrat.” You act as if you have to check specific boxes in order to BE a democrat when the reality is that it’s a lot more like pop music when the definition is actually quite vague. I.E. conservative Democrat could also be a liberal Republican. Etc Your ad hominem attacks against me when it comes down to the news channels I “supposedly” get my “talking points” from do not phase me. What I originally said remains true, and as for what defines a Democrat or a Republican for that matter in general.... Democrat: fiscally liberal/moderate & socially liberal. Republican: fiscally conservative & socially conservative. Egypt. W Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorusRa2 5,005 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 25 minutes ago, KleinGa said: If you would read what I’ve been talking about in this thread, you would see that I only refer to Bernie supporters as Bernie Bros when talking about 2016 because then his supporters were white and male. note I speak about them as “Bernie fans” when speaking generally about the present day. Additionally, Bernie’s campaign (although more diverse than 2016) remains white and male. If you’re a bernie bro and feel victimized by me calling you a bernie bro, you’re part of the problem. False and false. There’s enough proof out there that shows his base is now majority female and people of color. He does the worst with white females followed by white males but I’m not going to keep providing links every time this conversation comes up. I don’t feel victimized by being called a Bernie Bro & newsflash being male and white doesn’t make you part of the problem by default. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorusRa2 5,005 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 10 minutes ago, En_Sabah_Nur said: Your ad hominem attacks against me when it comes down to the news channels I “supposedly” get my “talking points” from do not phase me. What I originally said remains true, and as for what defines a Democrat or a Republican for that matter in general.... Democrat: fiscally liberal/moderate & socially liberal. Republican: fiscally conservative & socially conservative. So by your own definition, Bernie is a democrat. He’s more fiscally liberal and socially liberal. So, unless you’re qualm is with how he registers with the state of Vermont, then you’re upset at the fact he won’t label himself the way you do. It’s a really disingenuous attack when I could be a Republican by ideology but registered as a democrat for voting purposes. What I label myself as on paper doesn’t necessarily mean what I believe or vote on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
En_Sabah_Nur 9,366 Posted November 8, 2019 Author Share Posted November 8, 2019 35 minutes ago, HorusRa2 said: So by your own definition, Bernie is a democrat. He’s more fiscally liberal and socially liberal. So, unless you’re qualm is with how he registers with the state of Vermont, then you’re upset at the fact he won’t label himself the way you do. It’s a really disingenuous attack when I could be a Republican by ideology but registered as a democrat for voting purposes. What I label myself as on paper doesn’t necessarily mean what I believe or vote on. So then why be an Independent to begin with then?! Stop complaining about what the democrats are doing or not doing, and create your own(his) lane???! 🤔 Egypt. W Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whispering 18,865 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 7 hours ago, HorusRa2 said: Bernie’s demographics aren’t majority white or male today & so the term is erasure to majority of his base. In fact, Bernie’s support is fueled by Latinos (the only race demo he beats every candidate in). So, I see the term as sexist and racist. Not Joe Biden. The latest polls still show Biden ahead with Latinos. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guillaume Hamon 6,992 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 12 hours ago, KleinGa said: And I'm sorry if you interpreted my phrasing in that way, that isn't my fault. Your phrasing clearly came across as if you were making bernie voters to be a big factor in HRC loss so you either were clumsy in the way you expressed yourself or you're backtracking a bit on your point. One or the other, several people got the same impression I had reading you so, at some point, it's surely more your fault than it is mine lol. 12 hours ago, KleinGa said: What don't you understand about I am speaking about Bernie specifically. I don't know why you all crave me talking about ALL the reasons. It will always be deemed too easy to focus on one point when there are many, mainly when this point is a minor factor among big ones. Also you clearly hate bernie voters so you choosing to only talk about it seems more like an occasion for you to talk crap about them than anything else lmao. 12 hours ago, KleinGa said: Who the hell lied to you? The MAJORITY of Bernie supporters are white MALES! Hide contents https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/the-fix/wp/2016/05/05/white-male-democrats-have-disproportionately-voted-against-hillary-clinton-for-eight-years-running/ https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/where-sanders-clinton-are-dominating-n505381 https://www.vox.com/2016/1/15/10770524/who-supports-bernie-sanders and many many more prove this All of these are from January 2016 to May 2016...How can you even make deductions on who "Bernie supporters are" with that?... Here are datas which are not even 40 days old saying it's NOT mostly a male base: https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/gyzjmb/bernie-bros-women-under-45-make-up-a-larger-share-of-bernie-sanders-base-than-men 12 hours ago, KleinGa said: And I've had several (overwhelming) personal experience with the sexism of the bernie bros Well if we have to believe your honesty ( despite the fact you describe with the past proofs lol ) and assume your obvious bias against them didn't motivate this statement.. Let's say you remind me of these person saying they saw racists among HRC fans and concluding it was a racist base... It's too easy to to pick individuals experiences to make wide conclusions about millions of people proved by nothing except the mere fact you're telling us it's this way. 12 hours ago, KleinGa said: I'm deeply sorry if you cannot accept the facts about Bernie or his fans. I seriously cannot have discourse with someone who feels targeted when I say what the facts are. Talking about how "sanders supporters are" using old facts which doesn't represent the current reality anymore ( even when you've already been proved it doesn't in a former answer ) isn't "debating with facts". It's called manipulation. If you actually had facts on your side you wouldn't need these tricks. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorusRa2 5,005 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 7 hours ago, Whispering said: Not Joe Biden. The latest polls still show Biden ahead with Latinos. I’ll give you this one. I checked the most recent Monmouth poll (it kept all non whites together so I couldn’t tell). Morning consult doesn’t break down by race. The most recent NBC poll didn’t break down by race as far as I saw. The only recent pollster with breakdown of only Latinos is the economist poll. I remain highly skeptical of that pollster as it always has Bernie under 15% and Warren is always upper 20s. It’s the only pollster that consistently shows Warren doing better with under 30 demo. I did find a telemundo poll that corroborates your point and a NYT article that I think has the recent poll I was referring to when I posted but I can’t read it because the paywall. The politico article definitely can show that Bernie has made the most money for his campaign from Latinos than the other candidates. About 34% of the total donations given by Latinos. Considering that includes Joe and Beto along with the huge field, at the very least it suggests he has support from the Latino community, which is a fact often ignored by people who dismiss Bernie’s campaign and continue the Bernie Bro narrative. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2019/11/05/poll-latinos-want-biden-or-sanders-to-take-on-donald-trump-in-2020-elections/4167908002/ https://www.politico.com/amp/news/2019/11/05/bernie-sanders-latino-2020-vote-065820 https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/08/us/bernie-sanders-latino-voters.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ltlmnstr 2,771 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 This thread was suppose to be about the senate confirming judges We have to be like old people and send letters and call our senators plead practically beg the republican ones to not vote with party lines there’s more to american politics than the presidency we have to keep the seats we have in the senate and flip seats in 2020 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KleinGa 18,177 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 4 hours ago, Guillaume Hamon said: Your phrasing clearly came across as if you were making bernie voters to be a big factor in HRC loss so you either were clumsy in the way you expressed yourself or you're backtracking a bit on your point. One or the other, several people got the same impression I had reading you so, at some point, it's surely more your fault than it is mine lol. I truly believe you all being bernie fans were looking to be attacked by what I was saying. It's either that or your comprehension sucks! But I believe its the former. A hard pill to swallow I know. In all of your replies, I see that you do lack basic comprehension skills, twisting everything I say. That's just sad. Wake up! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KleinGa 18,177 Posted November 8, 2019 Share Posted November 8, 2019 12 hours ago, En_Sabah_Nur said: Your ad hominem attacks against me when it comes down to the news channels I “supposedly” get my “talking points” from do not phase me. What I originally said remains true, and as for what defines a Democrat or a Republican for that matter in general.... the same type of attacks I've been getting! It seems as if their only refute is this over actual facts and discussions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guillaume Hamon 6,992 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 17 hours ago, KleinGa said: I truly believe you all being bernie fans were looking to be attacked by what I was saying. You know well that with all the blaming in yours words and tone you come across as someone talking crap about them so of course they gonna see you as a crap-talker. Own it at least lol. 17 hours ago, KleinGa said: In all of your replies, I see that you do lack basic comprehension skills, twisting everything I say. That's just sad. Wake up! You have 0 argument left after being debunked so you rely on the "you twist my words anyway" trick now... Use all the disdain you want, we all understood you well, you're just dishonest and not smart enough to hide it. 17 hours ago, KleinGa said: their only refute is this over actual facts and discussions. Dear you know well that you did get facts and discussions and it didn't help you out. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KleinGa 18,177 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 7 hours ago, Guillaume Hamon said: You have 0 argument left after being debunked so you rely on the "you twist my words anyway" trick now... Use all the disdain you want, we all understood you well, you're just dishonest and not smart enough to hide it. If you call "your tone suggests that you think Bernie is the only reason Hillary's campaign failed" debunking then I can't even engage further Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rumours 45,521 Posted November 9, 2019 Share Posted November 9, 2019 Another thread with people blaming third party voters or those who didn’t vote. How enlightening Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guillaume Hamon 6,992 Posted November 10, 2019 Share Posted November 10, 2019 18 hours ago, KleinGa said: If you call "your tone suggests that you think Bernie is the only reason Hillary's campaign failed" debunking then I can't even engage further I talked about debunking your clichés about who sanders fans are supposed to be/ how they supposedly weren't good for the party unity when they did more for it than most democrats. And you tried to make the "sanders voters factor" seem bigger than it really was in HRC loss but everybody shown you it was a minor factor so even that was debunked lol. You try to find a reason to not engage further" since a while cause you had no arguments left anyway... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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