Elizabeth Warren supports reparations discussions

[Othon 34,299]

I've advocated for reparations for years and what Warren is talking about isn't really reparations at all. She wouldn't commit to payments to ADOS, which... is literally what reparations are, by definition.

In other words, she's doing what Harris, Castro, and Booker have all done, which is to say that they've all endorsed reparations rhetorically without actually backing them substantively. Sanders endorsed Warren's approach in his town hall when he was asked about it (after saying that we need to define what "reparations" means, which is true). None of them go far enough. Reparations won't reverse the residual economic and social effects of slavery and segregation (which is still extremely common, even if it's not being mandated by the state), but providing a subsidy to descendants of the people white Americans enslaved to try to counteract some of those effects is a no-brainer.

[HorusRa2 5,005]

7 minutes ago, OG Gaga Stan said:

I've advocated for reparations for years and what Warren is talking about isn't really reparations at all. She wouldn't commit to payments to ADOS, which... is literally what reparations are, by definition.

In other words, she's doing what Harris, Castro, and Booker have all done, which is to say that they've all endorsed reparations rhetorically without actually backing them substantively. Sanders endorsed Warren's approach in his town hall when he was asked about it (after saying that we need to define what "reparations" means, which is true). None of them go far enough. Reparations won't reverse the residual economic and social effects of slavery and segregation (which is still extremely common, even if it's not being mandated by the state), but providing a subsidy to descendants of the people white Americans enslaved to try to counteract some of those effects is a no-brainer.

The problem (in my view) is quantifying what an acceptable reparation would be in terms of dollars. Because the arguments I’ve seen involve using the basis of calculating 400 years of slavery in order to quantify a reparation. Then there is the argument of only giving reparations to direct descendants or to all African Americans. Then you have to ask, well what do we about interracial people? Do we base everything on direct lineage? The next question we ask is what is the price tag of all of this? And who’s to say that once this has been initiated that there won’t be other factions of persons who will fight for additional funds because they don’t agree with the payments made? While I understand why people think cash payouts are what is needed, I don’t think that it is something that can be done in a linear and logical way that is going to appease those calling for reparations. 

[Othon 34,299]

8 minutes ago, HorusRa2 said:

The problem (in my view) is quantifying what an acceptable reparation would be in terms of dollars. Because the arguments I’ve seen involve using the basis of calculating 400 years of slavery in order to quantify a reparation. Then there is the argument of only giving reparations to direct descendants or to all African Americans. Then you have to ask, well what do we about interracial people? Do we base everything on direct lineage? The next question we ask is what is the price tag of all of this? And who’s to say that once this has been initiated that there won’t be other factions of persons who will fight for additional funds because they don’t agree with the payments made? While I understand why people think cash payouts are what is needed, I don’t think that it is something that can be done in a linear and logical way that is going to appease those calling for reparations. 

Yeah, it's a logistical nightmare. Attempting to quantify the price of enslavement in and of itself is almost nonsensical. How do you even begin to put a price on something that barbaric?

But that's a problem inherent in any issue pertaining to any kind of reparation. We've paid out reparations to other oppressed groups in the past and several European countries have done the same. We've put a price on barbarism before, and as insufficient as that answer is, it's the only one we have.

I see reparations as something that accompanies revolutionary redistributive policies, where everyone descending from an American slave is given a specific amount allocated for that atrocity.

The reasons you're giving are logical and are the same exact ones that leftists that can't get on board with reparations give. I think it's possible, which is why I've always backed them.

[Whispering 18,865]

6 hours ago, Alii said:

People should move on. 

Slavery was a part of every culture. The West had many abolishment movements and eventually forced many Middle Eastern countries to abolish it. 

I don’t think I should get paid for what my great grandfather went through. Bringing all these stuff up only create more tension and more hate. 

This isn’t about someone’s great great grandparents, but about their generation. You don’t have to go back to the days of slavery to reach the inequalities that have been levied on the Black community.

In 1965, a century after the formal end of slavery, African-Americans were still largely excluded from programs that helped build middle-class wealth. In the decades following World War II, the US made unprecedented public investments to subsidize debt-free college education and low-cost mortgages. But these wealth-building measures benefited millions of mostly white households.

People of color, meanwhile, faced overt discrimination in mortgage lending and separate-and-unequal school systems throughout the United States. Barred from traditional forms of credit, African-Americans were pushed into wealth-stripping mortgage scams like “contract for deed mortgages,” where a missed payment would lead to eviction and loss of all equity.

So while many whites were able to board an express train to middle-class wealth between 1945 and 1975, people of color were left standing at the railway station waiting for a train that never showed up. As a result of government subsidies, white homeownership rates steadily rose to as high as 75% in 2005, according to the US Census, while black rates peaked at 46% the same year, a 30-point gap that remains today.

White households were able to help their children obtain access to homeownership and stability through what sociologists call the “intergenerational transmission of advantage.”

[HorusRa2 5,005]

15 minutes ago, OG Gaga Stan said:

Yeah, it's a logistical nightmare. Attempting to quantify the price of enslavement in and of itself is almost nonsensical. How do you even begin to put a price on something that barbaric?

But that's a problem inherent in any issue pertaining to any kind of reparation. We've paid out reparations to other oppressed groups in the past and several European countries have done the same. We've put a price on barbarism before, and as insufficient as that answer is, it's the only one we have.

I see reparations as something that accompanies revolutionary redistributive policies, where everyone descending from an American slave is given a specific amount allocated for that atrocity.

The reasons you're giving are logical and are the same exact ones that leftists that can't get on board with reparations give. I think it's possible, which is why I've always backed them.

Then I would say that we’re both in agreement that someone has to develop a policy position (which is going to require some calculations and research) in order to do the right thing.

Meanwhile, we can course correct with progressive policies to change the systemic systems of racism already in place. It may not be reparations in-full but it moves the yardsticks closer together.