The GP don't want CrazyGa back

[Katsuki Bakugo 9,788]

14 minutes ago, FinnishGypsy said:

Yeah, but to be fair, they’re the first to drop anything (Miley included!) A year ago, Camila Cabello was their new “Queen” due to her one hit, and now it’s Ariana. This time next year, it’ll be someone else. That’s not a demographic to try to appease because it WILL blow up in your face (again, Miley Cyrus, anyone?)

HEY! She has finally found her true sound (for the what 20th time?) 

[mauvais 0]

3 hours ago, AJRocketMan said:

We downloaded her songs and bought her albums. Here in the USA, ARTPOP debuted at #1 on the Billboard 200 and she had four top 40 singles on the Billboard Hot 100. Applause and Do What U Want (official singles) peaked at #4 and #13 respectively, and Venus and Dope (promo singles) peaked at #32 and #8 respectively. G.U.Y. was the only commercial failure peaking at #76. Remember, streaming hadn’t taken over yet.

I graduated high school in 2014. So while streaming was slowly picking up during the latter half of my high school career, it didn’t blow up until after I had left, by about one year. By the time I started my freshman year of college in the fall of 2015, streaming had definitely become the main source of music consumption. ARTPOP was released during a gradual transitional period where digital downloads were still the most common way to consume music. How old are you by the way?

Yeah, a good number of teen fans left after the Born This Way single. Born This Way was catered to the hardcore fan base and she became more polarizing. Not that this is a bad thing, but a lot of casual fans began to drift away.

However, I wouldn’t say older Gen Z was a profitable demographic yet during the ARTPOP era. I was a freshman in high school when BTW was released and a senior when AP came out. Everyone who was in high school then were young millennials. It wasn’t until the second half of the 2010s when Gen Z became a prime demographic. I would actually say that the Vine/Rage Comics/pre-Snapchat Bitstrips/Hunger Games/EDM (Dubstep and Electro-House) period of popular culture (which was when the ARTPOP era happened) was the final hurrah for millennials.

We're pretty close in age! I was 14 when the Fame came out and I thought Gaga was literally soooo f*cking cool in a big sister way. I never saw photos of pre-fame Gaga in my teenagehood, but it doesn't even matter because 14 year old me still wants nothing more than a teal lamé one-piece and blunt bangs.  That feeling I associate with Gaga is why I say younger Gen Z played a role in ARTPOP underperforming that no one really talks about, especially when like you said it happened during the last millennial hurrah. When you're a teenager, you're emulating whatever 18-25 year olds are doing, and desperately trying to find your own aesthetic. I think a lot of teenagers our age were fans of Gaga for this reason and a large portion of them are still fans. But, with ARTPOP you have an artist who isn't appealing to teenagers, both in the sense that she wasn't courting teenagers, and also teenagers were just not into it.

In the end, though, you have to pick between ARTPOP and 1989. Female artists have to act perpetually 20 if they want massive hits and that sh*t gets old. Taylor experienced her first dip in this demo during rep and I'd reckon didn't make a lot of new fans, but she has a massive safety net after actively appealing to teenagers for 10 years, not just 4. TL;DR it's all about the teenagers, baby!

[Donna Noble 1,752]

She can be whoever she wants to be, I doubt she cares what the GP thinks about her craziness. When she fully returns to being the Rah Rah Bitch, we'll still stan. Her whole personality has become going against expectations, so don't expect yee haw a scalp is torn forever. (Not that I'm complaining about Joanne/Ally Ga, you know what I mean.) 

[Queen Gloria 3,464]

15 hours ago, Gagadonna said:

and she can still be "Gaga" while remaining classy/lowkey :

 

 

 

This ^ she can meet in the middle of classy and crazy and still be Gaga. That's pretty much what she's been for like.. 5 years now. 

[Bonkers 29,484]

It's not that I don't want CrazyGa back...it's that I don't want "tries so hard Gaga" back.  I want to her to stand in her own magnificence like a true legend.  That's why I wasn't so crazy about Enigma. 

Having said that, what I really want is for Gaga to do what makes her happy.  Some fans love both, so do I, but I prefer legend Gaga.

[PartySick 159,836]

Agreed kind of.

I think, post-Fame, people got fatigued with her. First she was that rad bitch that bled to death at the vma's and now she's...in an egg? Is that an iPad on her dress? DID THIS BISH JUST GET PUKED ON???

Then she resurfaced with the "hey, I'm human, here's an album about my family. Ignore the round bean-flicking song." And ASIB killed so...yeah.

People know she's talented now. So I think if she can continue being that crazy rad girl that shows up and blows people out of the water with her pipes rather than trying to razzle dazzle them with meat dresses or vomit art (even though SXSW is still my fav), she'll keep doing great.

That said, she'll always have an audience and a consumer base. I don't think she needs to pander or cater to either her fans or the gp. Just do what she wants and do it well (which she always does).

[LilyLark 10,095]

Artists change and evolve all the time. I liked ARTPOP, but I don't see her going back to it because it was her most poorly received album and more importantly, Elton basically implied that Gaga was not happy with it.  Furthermore, that type of EDM-sound-isn't necessarily popular right now and arguably sounds a bit dated with the exception of Applause and Donatella while the older electro-pop/dance-pop meets pop-rock tracks hold up better both lyrically and musically.

I wouldn't be surprised if she stuck, at least for a while, with a type of Enigma meets Joanne aesthetic. Enigma was well reviewed and was theatrical and still kind of nutty, without being a complete shock factor like some parts of 2010-13. Vanity Fair had an interesting article about her today that kind of discussed how all of this but more in terms of how singer Gaga and actress Gaga have some mild aesthetic overlap. The Grammy performance was polarizing but still struck that sort of balance, and I think it would have been better received if she had done a different song with that style.

I think fans just have to accept she has a pretty eclectic sound, and that she's not likely to revert to one type of sound and remain that way.  I've always had pretty eclectic tastes in music, in that I love nearly every type of music and appreciate Joanne (I still think Dancin' in Circles would have done well as a single and Perfect Illusion was the weakest track) as much as The Fame and BTW, so I don't mind myself. She's established enough that I don't think she has to "pander" one way or another.

But I also think people brought up the weird juxtaposition with Gaga: she has fans who love Joanne/ASIB/parts of BTW/parts of The Fame/Fame Monster sound and fans who are way more into ARTPOP and The Fame/Fame Monster.

[SCHEISSEMONTRE 2,783]

14 hours ago, Lord Temptation said:

Actually current teens (those born in the early to mid 2000s) love Gaga because they have only known her from Joanne and ASIB.

It’s the 90s babies (those born in the early to late 90s who are currently in their 20s - think Miley and Ariana’s age group) who were the first to drop Gaga. 

I find that Gaga’s core fans right now either really young (under 15) or really mature (30 and over - including me!)

 

I disagree I was born in the 2000's and I’ve knew of her since the BTW era and ARPOP era

[FinnishGypsy 921]

16 hours ago, LilyLark said:

I liked ARTPOP, but I don't see her going back to it because it was her most poorly received album and more importantly, Elton basically implied that Gaga was not happy with it. 

I wasn’t aware of this! Do you happen to have a link handy? (I’m not doubting you, just very curious because I had previously assumed she didn’t like the album simply due to how few songs she had performed from the album following the artRAVE—including SB Halfime—until Coachella, that is, wherein she performed a ton of ARTPOP tracks and then made me reconsider whether or not not she actually did, in fact, dislike it).

The album era was super messy and the tracklist was all over the place, but ARTPOP has some amazing pop songs: G.U.Y., Sexxx Dreams, Do What U Want (including the “new official” Xtina version, which is also fantastic), Venus, Applause, Gypsy, etc. And then some really fantastic, really unconventional tracks where art and pop really do fuse brilliantly (e.g., Aura, the title track). 

I really hope the entire album isn’t always going to be paid dust, but that she’ll surprise us at times, like she did at Coachella, by putting some of the fan favorite tracks from that era in the set list. Also, even if we only got a couple of music videos that era, they were ****ing fantastic.

ETA: I also agree with you that DIC should’ve been a single (although not as much as JW, talk about missed opportunity for a radio hit). But yeah, at around the the time Joanne was released, Ariana was dominating (with her very young fanbase) with a song about being ****ed so hard you can’t walk straight the next day (I.e., “Side to Side.”) DIC seems pretty tame in comparison, considering it’s concerning a healthy (and lifespan elongating!) habit that every single person over the age of puberty engages in. But to be fair, DIC is still far less subtle, and would’ve definitely needed more toned-down lyrics for the radio (like the blatant “I touch myself” parts). 

[AJRocketMan 2,684]

14 hours ago, ManilaMonster said:

The Gaga I fell in love with has matured and we just have to accept it rather than expect another Born This Way or ARTPOP. It shows in her songs, whether its Joanne or ASIB songs or her fashion. I read comments here saying there'll be a balance not full on CrazyGa and I agree thats whats more likely to happen. Shock factor isnt Gaga's best known quality anymore and she knows it too. 

Considering she’s working with Boys Noize, SOPHIE, DJ White Shadow, BloodPop, and possibly Baseck, I am sure we will get CrazyGa again a la Born This Way and ARTPOP. BN even said he wrote a “f*cking hit” with her last year.

I would also say this is further substantiated by the fact that she posted those creepy Eli Russell Lennitz photos in August (which did shock people). It’s not so much the immediate future I’m worried about, it’s that LG6 could truly be the last CrazyGa era in her career for a long time or possibly ever. 

10 hours ago, Lord Temptation said:

Just admit it. When Gaga was seen as uncool and over by the media your age group dropped Gaga like a dirty rag. Maybe not you personally, but your demographic - the streaming generation - avoided Gaga like the plague until last year after the Super Bowl / Coachella / and now ASIB.

I should have articulated myself better—many people in my age group did drop her like a hot potato and ran like there was no tomorrow. 👐🏼🥔🔥🏃‍♂️🏃‍♀️

But the ones who stayed make up the majority of her Little Monsters. Not the casual fans. The casual fans are mostly those born before and after the 90s. Her Little Monsters are generally young people and we’re pretty much the exact same age as Gaga was when she first came out. 😳 But there are some who are older who identify as LMs.

5 hours ago, mauvais said:

We're pretty close in age! I was 14 when the Fame came out and I thought Gaga was literally soooo f*cking cool in a big sister way. I never saw photos of pre-fame Gaga in my teenagehood, but it doesn't even matter because 14 year old me still wants nothing more than a teal lamé one-piece and blunt bangs.  That feeling I associate with Gaga is why I say younger Gen Z played a role in ARTPOP underperforming that no one really talks about, especially when like you said it happened during the last millennial hurrah. When you're a teenager, you're emulating whatever 18-25 year olds are doing, and desperately trying to find your own aesthetic. I think a lot of teenagers our age were fans of Gaga for this reason and a large portion of them are still fans. But, with ARTPOP you have an artist who isn't appealing to teenagers, both in the sense that she wasn't courting teenagers, and also teenagers were just not into it.

In the end, though, you have to pick between ARTPOP and 1989. Female artists have to act perpetually 20 if they want massive hits and that sh*t gets old. Taylor experienced her first dip in this demo during rep and I'd reckon didn't make a lot of new fans, but she has a massive safety net after actively appealing to teenagers for 10 years, not just 4. TL;DR it's all about the teenagers, baby!

1) That’s so awesome! Are you a girl? And I get what you mean now. I would say a lot of her would-be replacement teen fans moved on to Ariana Grande instead. When Gaga’s brand was in tatters and she disappeared from pop music, Ariana skyrocketed. In part because her music is was less offensive and progressive than Gaga’s catalogue, but also because of her image. Her high ponytail and her fashion style was easily imitable for girls, and guys crushed on her and wanted to date girls who looked like her. I’m actually surprised at the number of non-gay male fans she has!

2) As for the second one, I thought Taylor experienced a blip here because of the Kanye & Kim snapchat controversy when she approved the use of her name on “Famous”? Remember the snake emojis that were being posted on Twitter in reference to her? Good girl went bad real quick. 🤐

If I’m wrong about anything or if I’m missing the point, please let me know. I love these discussions!

[Gaga4stef 112]

12 hours ago, AJRocketMan said:

I strongly disagree. The ‘90s babies make up the majority of her core fanbase and were the ones that stuck around. Of course there are plenty of people that fall out of that demographic, but you can expect the majority of Little Monsters to be people who were born in the 1990’s.

Okay, I wouldn’t go that far. Anecdotally speaking I find that Little Monsters tend to be an even split between straight women and gay men (pair up the bisexuals of each gender those two as well) and are generally young. The casual fan base is more diverse than that though.

Lmao then why are you here? Classic Gaga changed the world. She ruled it! She made being LGBT acceptable, she made electronic music cool, she made self-disclosure more socially acceptable, she made self-expression mainstream, and she made talking about rape and drug addiction a thing when nobody else in pop music was doing it. She is the most influential celebrity of the 21st century, and classic Gaga/CrazyGa is how people will remember her!

Excuse me? Just because I would rather have a toned down Crazyga I don't belong here? I never denied she was influential or anything else. Her celebrity status is pretty solid so she doesn't for example need to resort to wearing meat dresses to get the GP's attention or whatever she was trying to do. She can still be edgy and play with her style and I hope that she will. Sorry in your opinion that doesn't qualify me to be here. Your opinion doesn't matter to me tho. 

[mauvais 0]

1 hour ago, AJRocketMan said:

Considering she’s working with Boys Noize, SOPHIE, DJ White Shadow, BloodPop, and possibly Baseck, I am sure we will get CrazyGa again a la Born This Way and ARTPOP. BN even said he wrote a “f*cking hit” with her last year.

I would also say this is further substantiated by the fact that she posted those creepy Eli Russell Lennitz photos in August (which did shock people). It’s not so much the immediate future I’m worried about, it’s that LG6 could truly be the last CrazyGa era in her career for a long time or possibly ever. 

I should have articulated myself better—many people in my age group did drop her like a hot potato and ran like there was no tomorrow. 👐🏼🥔🔥🏃‍♂️🏃‍♀️

But the ones who stayed make up the majority of her Little Monsters. Not the casual fans. The casual fans are mostly those born before and after the 90s. Her Little Monsters are generally young people and we’re pretty much the exact same age as Gaga was when she first came out. 😳 But there are some who are older who identify as LMs.

1) That’s so awesome! Are you a girl? And I get what you mean now. I would say a lot of her would-be replacement teen fans moved on to Ariana Grande instead. When Gaga’s brand was in tatters and she disappeared from pop music, Ariana skyrocketed. In part because her music is was less offensive and progressive than Gaga’s catalogue, but also because of her image. Her high ponytail and her fashion style was easily imitable for girls, and guys crushed on her and wanted to date girls who looked like her. I’m actually surprised at the number of non-gay male fans she has!

2) As for the second one, I thought Taylor experienced a blip here because of the Kanye & Kim snapchat controversy when she approved the use of her name on “Famous”? Remember the snake emojis that were being posted on Twitter in reference to her? Good girl went bad real quick. 🤐

If I’m wrong about anything or if I’m missing the point, please let me know. I love these discussions!

Yes, I am a girl! And, no worries, we're totally on the same page now.

1) Yeah, I think Ariana represents something obtainable for today's teenagers, boys and girls alike, in terms of music and aesthetic like Gaga did before her and Britney before that, etc. In the Atlantic's review of Shallow, the author wrote "it all feels long ago, so Obama-era opulent, when Lady Gaga used award-show stages to perform magic tricks" and it stung! New girlies like Ariana serve a totally different purpose in today's culture. This cultural shift also explains why Gaga made Joanne and ASIB, but not in a bad way. Perhaps this is what the OP is getting at when they say the GP doesn't want CrazyGa back. In times like these, for kids especially, something less confrontational is more comforting. 

2) Yeah! The entire reputation era was a mess because it was a response to Kimye exposing her and teenagers roasting her online ... bringing it back to Gaga, if an artist ever releases a song like LWYMMD or DWUW, maybe even Applause , they're losing the online war and it only makes teenagers roast them more! Then, you have the rest of rep and ARTPOP that are just about being in love and super happy and it feels like a missed opportunity to just be like Hello, world! I'm in love!!!  Also, as I said before, I think the role of the artist is different post-Tr*** and there was something a little grotesque about Taylor trying to get us to care about her hurt feelings when the world is total ****. Something that's still melodramatic but also mad tragic like ASIB is more on trend. 

[Lord Temptation 11,209]

3 hours ago, AJRocketMan said:

Considering she’s working with Boys Noize, SOPHIE, DJ White Shadow, BloodPop, and possibly Baseck, I am sure we will get CrazyGa again a la Born This Way and ARTPOP. BN even said he wrote a “f*cking hit” with her last year.

I would also say this is further substantiated by the fact that she posted those creepy Eli Russell Lennitz photos in August (which did shock people). It’s not so much the immediate future I’m worried about, it’s that LG6 could truly be the last CrazyGa era in her career for a long time or possibly ever. 

I should have articulated myself better—many people in my age group did drop her like a hot potato and ran like there was no tomorrow. 👐🏼🥔🔥🏃‍♂️🏃‍♀️

But the ones who stayed make up the majority of her Little Monsters. Not the casual fans. The casual fans are mostly those born before and after the 90s. Her Little Monsters are generally young people and we’re pretty much the exact same age as Gaga was when she first came out. 😳 But there are some who are older who identify as LMs.

1) That’s so awesome! Are you a girl? And I get what you mean now. I would say a lot of her would-be replacement teen fans moved on to Ariana Grande instead. When Gaga’s brand was in tatters and she disappeared from pop music, Ariana skyrocketed. In part because her music is was less offensive and progressive than Gaga’s catalogue, but also because of her image. Her high ponytail and her fashion style was easily imitable for girls, and guys crushed on her and wanted to date girls who looked like her. I’m actually surprised at the number of non-gay male fans she has!

2) As for the second one, I thought Taylor experienced a blip here because of the Kanye & Kim snapchat controversy when she approved the use of her name on “Famous”? Remember the snake emojis that were being posted on Twitter in reference to her? Good girl went bad real quick. 🤐

If I’m wrong about anything or if I’m missing the point, please let me know. I love these discussions!

That’s cool. I’m 31 now so when ARTPOP came out I was already 25. My younger brothers though are born in the mid 90s and I remember them telling me “Gaga is over...bla bla bla...Gaga is so yesterday” in 2013!!! They were all looking for the “next best thing”, whether it was Ariana, Miley, Lorde, Meghan, Selena, Iggy....there was a massive glut of new pop girls that year and Gaga was deemed yesterdays news by the teens at that time.

I remember it so well...dark times tbh 

[AJRocketMan 2,684]

42 minutes ago, Lord Temptation said:

That’s cool. I’m 31 now so when ARTPOP came out I was already 25. My younger brothers though are born in the mid 90s and I remember them telling me “Gaga is over...bla bla bla...Gaga is so yesterday” in 2013!!! They were all looking for the “next best thing”, whether it was Ariana, Miley, Lorde, Meghan, Selena, Iggy....there was a massive glut of new pop girls that year and Gaga was deemed yesterdays news by the teens at that time.

I remember it so well...dark times tbh 

Are they straight? And are you LGBT?  Are you a man or a woman? Straight men don’t have good taste in what’s truly great art imo. Women and LGBT men are more highly evolved. And what do they think of Gaga now?

There were PLENTY of teens who were saying she was over by then, but there were also plenty that were defending her (the Little Monsters! ). I’m American, those who dropped her were the casual fans who latched onto her only because she was cool, and were generally socially conservative. Gaga was never going to last amongst that demographic anyway.

As for those new at-the-time pop girls: Meghan and especially Iggy’s cultural relevance were relegated to strictly 2014, Lorde and Miley don’t release new music consistently enough to keep up, and Selena is proving to be more of a Jennifer Lopez case in terms of fame. So that leaves Ariana. If you look at my post that responds to another user, Ariana I would say is definitely Gaga’s successor in regards to mainstream success, attention, and relevance amongst adolescents. She knows how to give the consumer exactly what they want, when they want it.

[FRANK1991 3,329]

I was like ok ok and then I saw this

23 hours ago, nicolasrumet said:

I think Gaga's fanbase has switched, and she needs to be aware of that. I don't think she's as popular among gays/teens... Most of those stan Ariana now.

well for one the gay/teens that stan Gaga all grew up, I mean it's been 10 years!! Her fanbase didn't switch to older people just got older. Vegas show was super crazy and I loved that.

 

of course Ari is the new pop star here with younger fans makes sense