Beyonce Cultural Appropriation

[Bam 1,695]

Just now, Fable said:

It completely does have to do with power dynamics  if your understanding of power dynamics is limited to "____ people were once slaves" then you have a very basic understanding of racism and power dynamics - especially in the U.S

Some popular depictions of Ancient Greece (Europe) in the media:

 

Now some depictions of the Ancient Egypt (African):

Does that help?

In isolation, if there was scarce representation of 'white' ancient Egyptians, it probably wouldn't really be such a big deal if a white performer went on stage dressed like an ancient Egyptian- like I don't think it would be a big deal if Beyonce dressed like she was from Ancient Greece. The problem is that Ancient Egypt is consistently white washed black/brown people are not represented within tellings of their own history.

Ancient Greeks are always depicted as European, a person of colour dressing as someone from ancient Greece isn't going to erase that, but Ancient Egyptians are also always depicted as European which is problematic - media representations of an ancient African country/empire are consistently white washed  

It has nothing to do with hating white people.

Again, with my point earlier. I'm Filipino in the Philippines and we have these Ancient Egyptian films as well. We have a Filipino Jesus movie. A Filipino Genghis Khan. Is it ever culturally appropriating if the main point is to convey a message? No. It's simply like translating a book for us here. We have our version here to understand the message.

But I do get why America is so sensitive about this, you are dealing with multiculturalism and now that other cultures are in the forefront, people want the representation because they are already there. Not white.

Again, this only happens in america or some portions in the west where identity is yet to be found. There are chinese versions of ancient egyptian movies. There are Korean, thai, who portray these cultures--to educate and to entertain.

 

So to say cultural appropriation is relatively bad, it isn't, unless not in my country nor asian countrieds that portray middle easterns, indians, egyptiand. We celebrate their culture to entertain and educate the people.

[Bebe 17,094]

4 minutes ago, Infinity Wave said:

Yeah sorry I used the wrong word anyway, my point was that Egyptians were not Africans, they were just living in the modern Egypt. But, anyway, if you don't wanna accept that there is no point in going on discussing 

I mean by definition they were African... Even if they bare little resemblance to, lets say, modern central African cultures. Ancient Egyptian religion was a complex system of polytheistic rituals and beliefs, many of which were deeply rooted in African thought and practices. Many Egyptian artifacts are similar to those considered African artifacts, and the art history of Egypt shows pieces very similar to those found in other areas of Africa

[Damon 10,904]

I swear to God I alsays cringe when I see cultural appropiation comments about any artist 

[Bebe 17,094]

Just now, Bam said:

Again, with my point earlier. I'm Filipino in the Philippines and we have these Ancient Egyptian films as well. We have a Filipino Jesus movie. A Filipino Genghis Khan. Is it ever culturally appropriating if the main point is to convey a message? No. It's simply like translating a book for us here. We have our version here to understand the message.

But I do get why America is so sensitive about this, you are dealing with multiculturalism and now that other cultures are in the forefront, people want the representation because they are already there. Not white.

Again, this only happens in america or some portions in the west where identity is yet to be found. There are chinese versions of ancient egyptian movies. There are Korean, thai, who portray these cultures--to educate and to entertain.

 

So to say cultural appropriation is relatively bad, it isn't, unless not in my country nor asian countrieds that portray middle easterns, indians, egyptiand. We celebrate their culture to entertain and educate the people.

There are differences between that when you are talking locally produced movies aimed at a Filipino audience. Obviously Filipinos understand that these figures did not look Fillipino and the ethinic demographics of the Phillipinnes are very different to that of the U.S

However for big budget Hollywood films distributed worldwide, the representations of Ancient Egypt are consistently white washed. Media representations matter and it's problematic when T.V, film, video games consistently portray Ancient Egyptians as White Europeans and then export that image to the world. 

It means that the history of people of colour are being erased.

[KIT 39]

Girls,  when Katy did Dark Horse I didn't hear any backlash. I'm sure that if Beyonce did something of japanesse culture, will also get backlash.

[geopang 4,831]

Some of you clearly don’t know your history. Ancient Egyptians were Black. Until the Arabs moved in. So she is not appropriating anyone’s culture. 

[Jessica Germ 2,129]

Who actually cares?

[Frankenztein 1,172]

5 hours ago, geopang said:

Some of you clearly don’t know your history. Ancient Egyptians were Black. Until the Arabs moved in. So she is not appropriating anyone’s culture. 

You clearly don't know your history, because that isn't true.

It's pretty silly to think Egyptians were black until the Arabs came. It's not like the Arabs were even the first to take over, the Romans did before,  Alexander the Great before that, the Persians before that, they had a Nubian King before that, and the Hyskos before that as well. They have been ruled by and mixed with Asian, Persian, Greek, Roman, and who knows what else. Cultures have always influenced each other. It's not a question of black or white it's more likely that Egypt contained multiple races and had people with many different skin colors living there.

We shouldn't white-wash history but it's wrong to black-wash it too. This is the exact hypocrisy many in this thread are complaining about. 

[River 117,260]

It's because it's the middle east culture.. not because black/white can or can't do it.. so it's ok to do.. even SJW won't cry about it..

It's just the global racism of the US about the middle east..

[elijahfan 26,305]

13 hours ago, VOLANTIS said:

She's an AFRICAN-American woman. Katy Perry is not. I think that's how that works. 

The font used on her Egyptian cape had Greek-inspired letters - so would you say both cultures were respected, or just mindlessly looted?

Just an example to show how ridiculous those cultural appropriation statements can be when you choose to be picky about it. For all I know, she and other pop girls can draw inspiration from, mix and honor whatever culture they want. In Katy's case, I think she was more paying homage to Elizabeth Taylor than the actual Egyptian culture.

To me, it becomes a problem when people from a certain ethnicity are chosen to portray people from a totally different ethnicity in a historical depiction. Pop is more about fantasy than accuracy.

Like, it has always baffled me how occidental countries, and America in particular, represent Jesus - realistically, the man most likely looked like the very people our politics are trying to keep out of our borders  But am I shocked when I see Madonna crucified on a disco cross in one of her tours? Not really.

[dit 46,483]

That's ancient egyptian clothing. Ancient egyptians were a mix of white, black and what we consider modern day "arabs". So she is not really appropriating a culture when her ancestors could of very well been a part of that culture. For all we know Bey could of had some ancestors from Egypt. 

[Zazekina 785]

I wish everybody could wear anything without people saying they are appropiating a culture. I'm a mexican girl, I love my culture but I love other cultures as well and I would love to add some of those aesthetics to my own style without being bashed.

 

[migamiga 12,102]

Well aside from the fact that Beyonce is black, Beyonce's intent was to honor and glorify it whereas Katy's was just to use as a gimmick. Beyonce is referencing it knowing its historical context whereas Katy was like oooh what can I do that would look cool?

[geopang 4,831]

3 hours ago, Frankenztein said:

You clearly don't know your history, because that isn't true.

It's pretty silly to think Egyptians were black until the Arabs came. It's not like the Arabs were even the first to take over, the Romans did before,  Alexander the Great before that, the Persians before that, they had a Nubian King before that, and the Hyskos before that as well. They have been ruled by and mixed with Asian, Persian, Greek, Roman, and who knows what else. Cultures have always influenced each other. It's not a question of black or white it's more likely that Egypt contained multiple races and had people with many different skin colors living there.

We shouldn't white-wash history but it's wrong to black-wash it too. This is the exact hypocrisy many in this thread are complaining about. 

how does that change the fact that ancient Egyptians were indeed black? Just because a country was invaded, does not mean the race of the people changed. For example with Ethiopia. The country was inhabited by Italy, yet we don’t view their history as anything but black/African. The fact is Ancient Egyptians were not middle eastern/arab... they were black Africans. Therefore, she is not appropriating culture. 

[doppelganger 3,933]

10 hours ago, Fable said:

It completely does have to do with power dynamics  if your understanding of power dynamics is limited to "____ people were once slaves" then you have a very basic understanding of racism and power dynamics - especially in the U.S

Some popular depictions of Ancient Greece (Europe) in the media:

 

Now some depictions of the Ancient Egypt (African):

Does that help?

In isolation, if there was scarce representation of 'white' ancient Egyptians, it probably wouldn't really be such a big deal if a white performer went on stage dressed like an ancient Egyptian- like I don't think it would be a big deal if Beyonce dressed like she was from Ancient Greece. The problem is that Ancient Egypt is consistently white washed black/brown people are not represented within tellings of their own history.

Ancient Greeks are always depicted as European, a person of colour dressing as someone from ancient Greece isn't going to erase that, but Ancient Egyptians are also always depicted as European which is problematic - media representations of an ancient African country/empire are consistently white washed  

It has nothing to do with hating white people.

I only hear this criticism from the united states though. People from other countries know Hollywood is simply a money making machine, and will always present stories from the lense of  Hollywood-ness rather than a pursuit for authenticity which honestly is not realistic for films about ancient cultures. 

Hollywood sometimes represent Borneo or SouthEast Asia with laughable interpretations. It’s really not that big of a deal for us. We make our own films.