LordEnigma 11,313 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 This sounds very Gaga and I am living for it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morphine Prince 105,787 Posted July 21, 2017 Author Share Posted July 21, 2017 52 minutes ago, Buddy said: Most people who are in-your-face with the American flag are Trump supporters, so sadly the flag has become synonymous with those sorts of people to many. It's a logical association, but letting this persist will only make the flag associate with them even more. Lol I never even thought about this. On Twitter usually the people who have flags next to their names are racist and xenophobic. So sad that these nationalists have made a flag associated with ignorance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJHolland 12,725 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 1 hour ago, Lona Delery said: She only ever said we should research both Trump and Hillary and decide what's best for the country, which is, in my opinion, a better approach than Katy and Gaga did. It's a much more sensible approach than praise Hillary as if she was the 2nd coming when she's clearly not and demonize Trump. right but then you can't turn around and demonize the entire country because of Trump like if Trump can make you lose ALL pride in your fellow countrymen/women, you were just faking pride the entire time Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lona Delery 7,214 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 3 minutes ago, MJHolland said: right but then you can't turn around and demonize the entire country because of Trump like if Trump can make you lose ALL pride in your fellow countrymen/women, you were just faking pride the entire time I dont think it has anything to do with pride in Lana's case. I remember last year, a lot of ppl on here, Lanaboards and ATRL called her a Trump supporter and a republican because she didn't tell who she is going to vote for. In her case, it feels more like a statement to debunk these rumors. Sometimes it feels like I've got a war in my mind, I wanna get off but I keep riding the ride Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buddy 5,686 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 1 hour ago, Morphine Prince said: Lol I never even thought about this. On Twitter usually the people who have flags next to their names are racist and xenophobic. So sad that these nationalists have made a flag associated with ignorance. Yeah, it is sad. You wouldn't believe the American of big trucks I see with huge American flags driving around, it's so extra. But they don't own the flag, every American does. We don't have to let it represent them or take our pride away. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tresor 1,649 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 The American flag certainly gained a different connotation under this Trump presidency, I see why she did it. Can't wait for the alt-rights to lose their mind over this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrawberryBlond 14,828 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 I totally get where she's coming from. American flags won't be associated with the best things right now and could serve the wrong message if she uses it on tour right now. But at the same time, not everyone makes these associations. When I see the American flag, I never think of the president at the time. I think of the actual country and what it represents. Just like I do with all flags. It's too overly simplistic to base it all on politics. I certainly hated it when people judged my country, the UK, for having a prime minister that supported the Iraq war. Almost all of us were against it, not our fault he decided to do it. Yet Eurovision punished us for years in points because of it (so childish). Now it's happening again with people judging us for voting for Brexit despite the fact that 51% of a country is in no way an overall majority (not to mention, how many people regretted voting Leave the very next day when they realised they'd been duped). I don't want anyone judging me and by extension, my country, for the decisions that some people have made. And I'm not going to do it to America either. A president can last 8 years tops and I doubt Trump's even got it in him to stick around for another term, if he doesn't get impeached before then. Yet, so many Americans are acting as if this is a forever thing, that the flag will always be associated with close-mindedness and hatred. Stop over-reacting. The flag is the least of your worries right now. There's a very high chance the next president will be Democrat to make up for the last mess and you can all breathe easy then. Holding on for 4 years might be hard but it will be over soon. Becoming too dramatic about things only makes your enemy stronger. But I do appreciate the fact that this has made Lana more aware of feminism and how important it is. So many women are surprisingly ignorant about it and aren't aware of what it actually is and how it affects you until you or someone you know is a victim of sexism. Suddenly, now that her feminist rights are under threat, now she suddenly wants to burn her bra! Better late than never, I suppose. I love her and all but her ignorance on feminism really irked me and now she's finally moving past that, which makes me feel so much better. 16 hours ago, ItsTommyBitch said: Wait some of ya'll didn't celebrate the 4th either? Mess, I thought I was weird for sitting it out OT: I fully get what's shes saying... He says its hard to be romantic, but I think everyone knows its more like "how can you romanticize America" because there's nothing to romanticize anymore and romanticizing the flag would put out the wrong message at the moment. I don't think its a matter of "This flag = America, America = bad so don't show the flag", its about sensitivity. To me, Lana is the kind of person who loves aesthetic, nostalgia, memories, stories, the past, etc... but she is not a "character" like many think she is. She doesnt go do coke on the weekends or anything like that, despite what her songs might tell you. She is a romantic in the sense that most writers are. Similarly, while I do think she's not all there yet politically, I know she is smart enough to understand that America has never been a perfect, free land. I think she loves the idea of it, so much more than the reality. Lana is still a majorly privileged white woman, and shes still quite an enigma. I'm always very wary to make comments on her political views because she seems like such a mercurial woman that she can say things like "I'm not interested in Feminism" just because she is sad that day and not because she means it, but not feel the need to clarify... but her interviews this era have confirmed for me that she is socially aware and she actually does have really strong political feelings, but shes just now understanding that there is value in sharing them with the world. It might have taken her longer than most, but I love and appreciate her growth and journey. I'm a bit pressed she had 3 political tracks that she took off the record though WTW and GBA are actually both very subtly political; especially GBA, but very heavily inspired, and its clear that some of the lyrics are supposed to be vague which is lovely but frustrating Overall though, this comes off to me as much more genuine than Katy, who was just literallyignorant and made a whole media spectacle out of her "journey" (though I do appreciate shes ON a journey, I don't love that it was marketed after some reflection) You've nailed it when you said that she's a person who loves aesthetic and nostalgia. That's partly the reason why I fell in love with her music, because that stuff is right up my street as well. She made a reference in the monologue of Ride to her expression of Americana imagery: "I believe in the country America used to be. I believe in the person I want to become. I believe in the freedom of the open road." I think that sums it up pretty well. She believes in the American Dream but gets that it isn't a reality for everyone. She likes the freedom that American preaches. I'm not even American but I totally get that. Like you were saying, she loves the idea of American freedom rather than the reality. It reminds me of this great quote I once saw, regarding how a lot of Republicans support raunch despite the party they're voting for supporting conservatism: "Raunch culture transcends elections. The values people vote for are not necessarily the same values they live by. A lot of people might consider themselves conservative or vote Republican because it's a reflection of they way they wish things were in America rather than a product of the way they actually experience it." I agree about the feminism quote. It always bothered me that she never felt the need to clarify if she truly believed in what she said or if she just felt out of sorts the day. Going back to that freedom thing again, I think Lana loves partaking in the freedom to not explain herself if she doesn't want to and the right to remain silent. What political tracks did she leave off the record? I never heard about this. She did put Coachella on it despite saying she wasn't sure if it was going to make it which I'm so pleased about because that track is one of her best ever. I'm going to listen to the album in the next hour or so, so I still have to judge it, though. And yeah, I think her political awakening is so much more genuine and intelligent than Katy's. This is how you do intelligent pop music about politics, not generic pop about something being "bigger than me" which is so vague it could apply to just about anything. 4 hours ago, freebit said: I could never get a bead on her Americana schtick. Sometimes I thought her use of it was a bit ironic in the first place (ex; she mentions crystal meth in American), but then she would use it to romanticize the past, like the monologue in Ride, but once again, I didn't if she was for real, or just doing it because it made sense for the "character" of Lana Del Rey. Read what I said in the reply above to get a better idea of it. Her monologue at the end of Ride is a very good example of what she's trying to do. I never understood what people struggled to understand about her use of imagery. Maybe it's because the way she expresses her music is so in tune with my personality, I never found it hard to decipher at all but then, not everyone's like that. I always found Lana to be a very difficult artist to define to people when they asked who she was because there's so much irony and subtext wrapped up in her work that you can't sum her up in one sentence. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supersonic 49,376 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 She's just dropping a visual because she doesn't feel comfortable with it anymore, leave it to hooray-patriotic GGD members to make an elefant out of a mosquito. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest bostonGUY Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 It's a shame, since she invented the American flag Spoiler Im kidding of course Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Denys 848 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Well, she needs to ditch more than the flag, her aesthetics are so boring 😒 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBEY 57,109 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 She's right when i see the USA flag rn i think of Trump, racism etc Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whispering 18,865 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 10 hours ago, KingOfTheClouds said: The flag represents where ur from not whos President. Idk seems silly. I put my flag out still. Im still American. Same here. Put my flag out, had people over for a cookout, wore red, white and blue, had fireworks....same as always. An idiot in the White House isn't going to stop me from celebrating holidays, appreciating the good things about my country and living my life! Yes, it does mean that I have become more active in fighting for what I believe are basic human rights and that I have started donating to some organizations promoting equality. What it doesn't mean is that I'm going to sit around, pout, and give up. Like Obama said, Progression isn't a straight line. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterPan 0 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 15 minutes ago, OBEY said: She's right when i see the USA flag rn i think of Trump, racism etc Well my best friend is a Trump supporter and a majority of the people in my facebook are Trump supporters but I do live in a Red state so it's unavoidable lol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
StrawberryBlond 14,828 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 48 minutes ago, Supersonic said: She's just dropping a visual because she doesn't feel comfortable with it anymore, leave it to hooray-patriotic GGD members to make an elefant out of a mosquito. I'm not even American and I don't see it this way at all. Why can't you just take Lana at her word? Why assume she has different intentions? I'm sure if she wanted to ditch a part of her imagery because she was bored of it she'd have no problem saying just that. If anyone's making a mountain out of a molehill, you are. You don't have to patriotic to see things in a certain way. I'm starting to get the impression that you're one of those people who trawl through well-meaning posts looking for things to make others appear close-minded when they're not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supersonic 49,376 Posted July 21, 2017 Share Posted July 21, 2017 Just now, StrawberryBlond said: I'm not even American and I don't see it this way at all. Why can't you just take Lana at her word? Why assume she has different intentions? I'm sure if she wanted to ditch a part of her imagery because she was bored of it she'd have no problem saying just that. If anyone's making a mountain out of a molehill, you are. You don't have to patriotic to see things in a certain way. I'm starting to get the impression that you're one of those people who trawl through well-meaning posts looking for things to make others appear close-minded when they're not. I literally did take her by the word, did you not read my post? She said, she's ditching this particular visual because she doesn't feel comfortable using it anymore (under the current registration). I'm literally saying that people on here take this WAY TOO SERIOUSLY and feel attacked for no reason, how am I the one at fault here? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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