Ed Sheeran Has a Toxic Masculinity Problem

[Maleficent 6]

Wait, he didn't actually shart on stage right???

[sipthistea 21,099]

Just like TS, writing about how their exes were mean to them.

Why not exploring something more interesting? 

[elijahfan 26,049]

5 hours ago, Claymore said:

 

1989 sold like crazy too but left Taylor with a scathed reputation, hence this analogy.

Well... I have the feeling her reputation somehow suffered the most with the whole Kim & Kanye issue, which was a good year and a half after the release of 1989.

And to say her reputation suffered is a bit of a stretch in itself... In stan spheres, maybe, where people have nothing more interesting to do than bash the artists that are more successful than their faves. But for the general public and her own fanbase, I'm not sure much has changed and I'm confident her next record will sell like crazy too. And the same goes for Ed.

[StrawberryBlond 14,820]

They've got it pretty spot on. New Man really shows how Ed's nice guy schtick is a bit of an act. In reality, he bashes any man his ex dates and convinces himself that he's the better one for her. The lyrics in that song sounds like he was trying to tick off a list of all the things the average "man's man" hates about "pretty boys" and it certainly resonated with a lot of men, hence why it's top 5 in the UK without even being a single. There must be a lot of bitter men out there. His songs are unapologetically for men, which is why I don't understand why he has so many female fans. As a woman, I can barely relate to any of this stuff. Yes, some of his work is directed at a woman he loves, but in that case, it's not like a woman can sing it, so...I don't know, I tend to connect more with artists whose songs that I can actually sing myself. You can change the gender but there are entire gender-specific lyrics in Ed's work, meaning you'd have to rewrite the entire thing to sing it as a woman.

But on the topic of Don't, that is one of the very few "man dissing a woman" songs that I have a guilty pleasure for. Even if Ellie was just looking for casual sex, judging by the way Ed described how things panned out, she sure as hell didn't make her intentions clear. Now, sure, he could have been fabricating details (as is the case with a lot of break up songs, there's a real feeling of we're only getting one side of the story). But these details are so specific, they're some of his most indepth lyrics ever...that I feel like it is all true. Does anyone consider that Ellie was indeed just playing with his head and leading him on? Don't act like women don't do that. I'm a woman, I know how manipulative we can be and how some of us like to tease, not realising how it can hurt others. Potentially the most revealing line in the entire thing to suggest Ellie was giving him the wrong impression was: "She said 'I was never looking for a friend, maybe you could swing by my room around ten, baby, bring a lemon and a bottle of gin, we'll be in between the sheets til the late AM, baby, if you wanted me then you should've just said.'" Sorry, that definitely sounds like a girl who is just having fun leading someone on. And judging by Ellie's very sheepish and much more vague response song, On My Mind, I think she knows deep down that she's in the wrong and is desperately trying to cover her tracks. I mean, she says "I don't even know what you intended," but then later says "you were talking deep like it was mad love to you." So...you did know what he intended? And she doesn't address the fact that she had sex with another guy while she seemed to in some level of closeness with someone else. I'm not denying that Ed loves playing the victim to some devious girl but don't act like women don't do it in reverse. Yes, a lot of men unceremoniously dump women after sex and cheat on them and stuff but plenty of women lead men on and manipulate them to get what they want. Both sexes have never been innocent.

5 hours ago, uo111 said:

She didn't cheat on him.

They were never even together. The lyrics of the song make it clear, she just wanted to have casual sex.

 

But never have casual sex with a man child like Ed, or else he will write a rather nasty song about you being a slut.

Look above for my analysis about the situation. I think Ellie made it very unclear what she wanted. Even if it was casual, what's up with her not telling him that she was interested in someone else? Even people in casual and open relationships tell one another when they want to start seeing someone else or ask permission to have sex with someone else. Most open relationships operate under the concept of "other people are fine as long as you tell me beforehand - if you do it without telling me first or keep it completely secret, then it's cheating." And the way that she did it was beyond insulting. Like he said "It wasn't like we were both on tour, we were staying on the same f***ing hotel room floor." Essentially, he's saying that she was wrong to not even used the "what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas" excuse for cheating, she did it right under his nose. Sorry, I don't think there's much defending that. It's not like Ed thought she was going to be a forever thing either, he does say "I was never looking for a promise or commitment but it was never just fun and I thought you were different." If Ellie can change her mind and is allowed to be unsure of what she wants, why can't he? Most people just like a relationship develop naturally and it becomes more. Sleeping with someone else in the middle of a developing relationship without even telling the other person about your changing feelings is a very sh***y thing to do. By the sounds of things, Ellie is the insecure type who would date a guy to make someone jealous and feel better about herself. She even says "Thought that you were cut and you could make me jealous." Bit weird what she means by making herself jealous but she all but admits insecurity there.

5 hours ago, Skrill said:

So when a girl writes a song about a ****boy or someone who was a bad influence on her its A REVOLUTIONARY INSPIRING PIECE OF ART but if a guy does it it's considered to be 'trashing women' - oh double standards

Thanks for this. I'm a feminist, so naturally, I hate double standards. But that applies to women too. If it's acceptable to bash a man for something, we should treat a woman the same and vice versa. Break up songs only seem to be truly acceptable when women do them. Do a lot of men deserve to be called out for their wrongdoings? Of course. But we need to stop acting like women are saints in comparison. We also mistakenly think that that if we insinuate that a woman is a bit dubious in her romance choices (to be put it mildly) that she's an all-round bad person as well. You can sleep around but be a nice person. Not that I've met many people like that but they do exist. Man or woman, I don't like when people mess around with other's feelings, use them for sex, manipulate them, etc. If men don't get a free pass for that behaviour, neither should women.

[uo111 5,261]

12 minutes ago, StrawberryBlond said:

They've got it pretty spot on. New Man really shows how Ed's nice guy schtick is a bit of an act. In reality, he bashes any man his ex dates and convinces himself that he's the better one for her. The lyrics in that song sounds like he was trying to tick off a list of all the things the average "man's man" hates about "pretty boys" and it certainly resonated with a lot of men, hence why it's top 5 in the UK without even being a single. There must be a lot of bitter men out there. His songs are unapologetically for men, which is why I don't understand why he has so many female fans. As a woman, I can barely relate to any of this stuff. Yes, some of his work is directed at a woman he loves, but in that case, it's not like a woman can sing it, so...I don't know, I tend to connect more with artists whose songs that I can actually sing myself. You can change the gender but there are entire gender-specific lyrics in Ed's work, meaning you'd have to rewrite the entire thing to sing it as a woman.

But on the topic of Don't, that is one of the very few "man dissing a woman" songs that I have a guilty pleasure for. Even if Ellie was just looking for casual sex, judging by the way Ed described how things panned out, she sure as hell didn't make her intentions clear. Now, sure, he could have been fabricating details (as is the case with a lot of break up songs, there's a real feeling of we're only getting one side of the story). But these details are so specific, they're some of his most indepth lyrics ever...that I feel like it is all true. Does anyone consider that Ellie was indeed just playing with his head and leading him on? Don't act like women don't do that. I'm a woman, I know how manipulative we can be and how some of us like to tease, not realising how it can hurt others. Potentially the most revealing line in the entire thing to suggest Ellie was giving him the wrong impression was: "She said 'I was never looking for a friend, maybe you could swing by my room around ten, baby, bring a lemon and a bottle of gin, we'll be in between the sheets til the late AM, baby, if you wanted me then you should've just said.'" Sorry, that definitely sounds like a girl who is just having fun leading someone on. And judging by Ellie's very sheepish and much more vague response song, On My Mind, I think she knows deep down that she's in the wrong and is desperately trying to cover her tracks. I mean, she says "I don't even know what you intended," but then later says "you were talking deep like it was mad love to you." So...you did know what he intended? And she doesn't address the fact that she had sex with another guy while she seemed to in some level of closeness with someone else. I'm not denying that Ed loves playing the victim to some devious girl but don't act like women don't do it in reverse. Yes, a lot of men unceremoniously dump women after sex and cheat on them and stuff but plenty of women lead men on and manipulate them to get what they want. Both sexes have never been innocent.

Look above for my analysis about the situation. I think Ellie made it very unclear what she wanted. Even if it was casual, what's up with her not telling him that she was interested in someone else? Even people in casual and open relationships tell one another when they want to start seeing someone else or ask permission to have sex with someone else. Most open relationships operate under the concept of "other people are fine as long as you tell me beforehand - if you do it without telling me first or keep it completely secret, then it's cheating." And the way that she did it was beyond insulting. Like he said "It wasn't like we were both on tour, we were staying on the same f***ing hotel room floor." Essentially, he's saying that she was wrong to not even used the "what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas" excuse for cheating, she did it right under his nose. Sorry, I don't think there's much defending that. It's not like Ed thought she was going to be a forever thing either, he does say "I was never looking for a promise or commitment but it was never just fun and I thought you were different." If Ellie can change her mind and is allowed to be unsure of what she wants, why can't he? Most people just like a relationship develop naturally and it becomes more. Sleeping with someone else in the middle of a developing relationship without even telling the other person about your changing feelings is a very sh***y thing to do. By the sounds of things, Ellie is the insecure type who would date a guy to make someone jealous and feel better about herself. She even says "Thought that you were cut and you could make me jealous." Bit weird what she means by making herself jealous but she all but admits insecurity there.

Thanks for this. I'm a feminist, so naturally, I hate double standards. But that applies to women too. If it's acceptable to bash a man for something, we should treat a woman the same and vice versa. Break up songs only seem to be truly acceptable when women do them. Do a lot of men deserve to be called out for their wrongdoings? Of course. But we need to stop acting like women are saints in comparison. We also mistakenly think that that if we insinuate that a woman is a bit dubious in her romance choices (to be put it mildly) that she's an all-round bad person as well. You can sleep around but be a nice person. Not that I've met many people like that but they do exist. Man or woman, I don't like when people mess around with other's feelings, use them for sex, manipulate them, etc. If men don't get a free pass for that behaviour, neither should women.

Ed says a lot of ****. He is the trump of the pop world.

Ellie is a normal person who has made it clear they were never seeing each other. You don't have to tell **** buddies when you **** someone else, and one side doesn't get to decide you are in a relationship. Ed fell in love with a **** buddy and then wrote a song to suggest she is a slut. Rediculous. 

Break up songs are criticized by female artists way more often than by male artists. Let's not be delusional, Taylor Swift is proof enough of that. I'm actually suprised that Ed is being called out on his bullshit, because it's not normal for a man to be called out on **** like this.

[StrawberryBlond 14,820]

20 minutes ago, uo111 said:

Ed says a lot of ****. He is the trump of the pop world.

Ellie is a normal person who has made it clear they were never seeing each other. You don't have to tell **** buddies when you **** someone else, and one side doesn't get to decide you are in a relationship. Ed fell in love with a **** buddy and then wrote a song to suggest she is a slut. Rediculous. 

Break up songs are criticized by female artists way more often than by male artists. Let's not be delusional, Taylor Swift is proof enough of that. I'm actually suprised that Ed is being called out on his bullshit, because it's not normal for a man to be called out on **** like this.

Prove that he's making it all up, though. Because you can't. Of course Ellie would defend herself whether it was true or not. She's hardly going to admit he was right, was she?

Not everyone operates under the same code, though. Some people just have no clue when it comes to relationship etiquette, they just go with what they want and don't care about who they hurt in doing so. Show me where Ellie made clear to Ed what's expected of this relationship because it's not there. The most you can get  is the beginning when Ed says "Met this girl late last year, she said 'don't be worried if I disappear.'" But as the song progresses, it sounds like her feelings towards him have intensified by her saying "I was never looking for a friend." That sounds like someone who wants more than a casual thing, right? One side doesn't have to decide, but it's wise to let the other person know if you're exclusive or not anyway. A simple "Are you hoping this will lead to more or is it just a casual thing?" would suffice.

Oh, definitely, females are criticised worse, however, I don't judge it on the gender, but on the story of the situation involved. If a man's singing about a woman who just wasn't that into him or simply moved on after breaking up with him, that's wrong. But singing about a woman who betrayed him, used him, or was basically an absolute nightmare, that's completely justified. If a woman can do it and be praised for finding the strength to do so, then why should there be a double standard for men? When it comes to real life providing inspiration for songs, it's from situations like this.

[TimisaMonster 31,073]

Basically the male Taylor Swift...

[uo111 5,261]

27 minutes ago, StrawberryBlond said:

Prove that he's making it all up, though. Because you can't. Of course Ellie would defend herself whether it was true or not. She's hardly going to admit he was right, was she?

Not everyone operates under the same code, though. Some people just have no clue when it comes to relationship etiquette, they just go with what they want and don't care about who they hurt in doing so. Show me where Ellie made clear to Ed what's expected of this relationship because it's not there. The most you can get  is the beginning when Ed says "Met this girl late last year, she said 'don't be worried if I disappear.'" But as the song progresses, it sounds like her feelings towards him have intensified by her saying "I was never looking for a friend." That sounds like someone who wants more than a casual thing, right? One side doesn't have to decide, but it's wise to let the other person know if you're exclusive or not anyway. A simple "Are you hoping this will lead to more or is it just a casual thing?" would suffice.

Oh, definitely, females are criticised worse, however, I don't judge it on the gender, but on the story of the situation involved. If a man's singing about a woman who just wasn't that into him or simply moved on after breaking up with him, that's wrong. But singing about a woman who betrayed him, used him, or was basically an absolute nightmare, that's completely justified. If a woman can do it and be praised for finding the strength to do so, then why should there be a double standard for men? When it comes to real life providing inspiration for songs, it's from situations like this.

A simple, "Is this leading to more or are you just looking for fun?" From Ed works too. Sex is a two way street, no matter how you look at it.

"I was never looking for a friend, maybe you should swing by more room around 10." That means let's ****, and not be friends. 

I don't doubt that he felt hurt. But that doesn't make it her fault. No one is gonna look out for your heart except you, and if you get hurt easily, then it's up to you to make better decisions or be mature enough to ask people what they want.

[StrawberryBlond 14,820]

3 minutes ago, uo111 said:

A simple, "Is this leading to more or are you just looking for fun?" Works too. Sex is a two way street, no matter how you look at it.

"I was never looking for a friend, maybe you should swing by more room around 10." That means let's ****, and not be friends. 

I don't doubt that he felt hurt. But that doesn't make it her fault. No one is gonna look out for your heart except you, and if you get hurt easily, then it's up to you to make better decisions or be mature enough to ask people what they want.

But she didn't ask that, so, yeah. You can't just go ahead and do something without considering the other person's potential feelings.

It can also mean they want a relationship to result from it. Plenty of people have gone on to have meaningful relationships that started as sex on the first meeting. "I was never looking for a friend" could imply that she was looking for a partner, hence, love. I know I'd interpret it that way, potentially.

[Gardevoir 9,822]

3 hours ago, Maleficent said:

Wait, he didn't actually shart on stage right???

He did, and he said that himself in an interview. 

[uo111 5,261]

17 hours ago, StrawberryBlond said:

But she didn't ask that, so, yeah. You can't just go ahead and do something without considering the other person's potential feelings.

It can also mean they want a relationship to result from it. Plenty of people have gone on to have meaningful relationships that started as sex on the first meeting. "I was never looking for a friend" could imply that she was looking for a partner, hence, love. I know I'd interpret it that way, potentially.

I realized after that my words implied I was talking about Ellie. I was talking about Ed, trying to say that if he thought it was gonna go somewhere, he should've asked and not assumed.