En_Sabah_Nur 9,366 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 1 minute ago, PaperIz said: You're angry and Hillary could literally break every finger on your hand and you'd still love her. Having a conversation about the witch with you is like talking to a brick wall so Oh here we go again!!!!!!!! Egypt. W Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
En_Sabah_Nur 9,366 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 7 minutes ago, Bebe said: Hillary is one of the most conservative Democrats, Jimm Webb is in that category too. ??? Yeah I did my research on Trump - i'm constantly criticising him and have been doing so since he announced his run It's just an interesting statement from a respected and well known Republican It also says a lot about the conventional thinking about foreign policy that the U.S has had since Reagan. Establishment Democrats and Republicans hold a lot of the same ideas about foreign policy. 'conventional wisdom' that isn't often challenged. I agree with everything you just said, minus the Jim Webb statement. He is wayyy more conservative than Hillary... He was on stage talking about guns during the primary if I remember correctly, and is liked by the NRA... Egypt. W Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whispering 18,865 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 messed up post, let me try again Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebe 17,289 Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 5 minutes ago, Whispering said: I listed the many policies that clearly put Hillary in the Democratic Party. Those are facts. Way to get personal over a list, though. It shows how angry you are to jump to a personal attack over a simple listing of policies. Yeah Hillary is no doubt a Democrat I said so myself. If she ran as a Republican she would be a very progressive Republican. Hillary fought for Healthcare, she is finally more socially progressive, she is more diplomatic in her foreign policy than real neo cons. I'm not sure what you are referring to with the last part of your paragraph? *Edit, just realised you were quoting another user - I didn't see the post from them and you didn't quote them so I got confused - apologies Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bio 23,538 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 He's not wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebe 17,289 Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, En_Sabah_Nur said: I agree with everything you just said, minus the Jim Webb statement. He is wayyy more conservative than Hillary... He was on stage talking about guns during the primary if I remember correctly, and is like by the NRA... Yeah, I'd say Jim Webb is more conservative. I'd put Hillary in the list of conservative Democrats at this point though too I'm not saying Hillary is the most conservative Democrat, just that she is on the right side of the Democratic party. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
En_Sabah_Nur 9,366 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 5 minutes ago, Bebe said: Yeah, I'd say Jim Webb is more conservative. I'd put Hillary in the list of conservative Democrats at this point though too I'm not saying Hillary is the most conservative Democrat, just that she is on the right side of the Democratic party. Funny how times change.... I'm old enough to remember when she was considered liberal & the darling of the left! Wow @ the times, they are a changin... Smh Egypt. W Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whispering 18,865 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 18 minutes ago, Bebe said: Hillary is one of the most conservative Democrats, Jimm Webb is in that category too. ??? Yeah I did my research on Trump - i'm constantly criticising him and have been doing so since he announced his run It's just an interesting statement from a respected and well known Republican It also says a lot about the conventional thinking about foreign policy that the U.S has had since Reagan. Establishment Democrats and Republicans hold a lot of the same ideas about foreign policy. 'conventional wisdom' that isn't often challenged. She's really not. Clinton was one of the most liberal members during her time in the Senate. According to an analysis of roll call votes by Voteview, Clinton’s record was more liberal than 70 percent of Democrats in the Senate. She was more liberal than 85 percent of all members. Her 2008 rival in the Democratic presidential primary, Barack Obama, was nearby with a record more liberal than 82 percent of all members — he was not more liberal than Clinton. Clinton also has a history of very liberal public statements. Clinton rates as a “hard core liberal” per the OnTheIssues.org scale. She is as liberal as Elizabeth Warren and barely more moderate than Bernie Sanders. And while Obama is also a “hard core liberal,” Clinton again was rated as more liberal than Obama. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whispering 18,865 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 21 minutes ago, PaperIz said: You're angry and Hillary could literally break every finger on your hand and you'd still love her. Having a conversation about the witch with you is like talking to a brick wall so I listed the many policies that clearly put Hillary in the Democratic Party. Those are facts. Way to get personal over a list, though. It shows how "angry" you are to jump to a personal attack over a simple listing of policies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebe 17,289 Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 9 minutes ago, Whispering said: She's really not. Clinton was one of the most liberal members during her time in the Senate. According to an analysis of roll call votes by Voteview, Clinton’s record was more liberal than 70 percent of Democrats in the Senate. She was more liberal than 85 percent of all members. Her 2008 rival in the Democratic presidential primary, Barack Obama, was nearby with a record more liberal than 82 percent of all members — he was not more liberal than Clinton. Clinton also has a history of very liberal public statements. Clinton rates as a “hard core liberal” per the OnTheIssues.org scale. She is as liberal as Elizabeth Warren and barely more moderate than Bernie Sanders. And while Obama is also a “hard core liberal,” Clinton again was rated as more liberal than Obama. Political compass puts her at center right, and she is in a lot of issues. Most Democrats are in comparison to the rest of the world. Obama was pretty center right too, although would be closer left than Hillary. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whispering 18,865 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 11 minutes ago, Bebe said: Political compass puts her at center right, and she is in a lot of issues. Most Democrats are in comparison to the rest of the world. Obama was pretty center right too, although would be closer left than Hillary. Then all Democrats are center right. The OnTheIssues scale, DW Nominate and her voting record labeled her as a "hard core liberal". In American politics, there are distinct differences between Republicans and Democrats and Hillary fell squarely in the more liberal side of her party. Clinton was the chamber’s 11th most-liberal member. She was progressive relative to members of her own party, Democrats. She isn't close to being conservative enough to be a Republican. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bebe 17,289 Posted February 9, 2017 Author Share Posted February 9, 2017 7 minutes ago, Whispering said: Then all Democrats are center right. The OnTheIssues scale and her voting record labeled her as a "hard core liberal". In American politics, there are distinct differences between Republicans and Democrats and Hillary fell squarely in the more liberal side of her party. Clinton was the chamber’s 11th most-liberal member. She was progressive relative to members of her own party, Democrats. She isn't close to being conservative enough to be a Republican. I think a lot of Democrats, especially establishment democrats, are center right. I'm aware of the distinction between Republicans and Democrats - I'm also aware, as I've stated, that Hillary isn't conservative enough to be a Republican. With all of that said though - at this point in time - she is pretty conservative. You have said OnTheIssues have rated her as a hardcore liberal - I would disagree. On social issues like abortion of course she is 'liberal' - but on foreign policy she is sways pretty conservative (again I've defended her from being a neocon - but she is still pretty conservative like Obama and even Bill Clinton). The problem with OnTheIssue is that it rates politicians like Hillary based on where they place within the party - Clinton has consistently shifted left with the party however has a poor record of pushing the Democrats left. Clinton moved left on Gay Marriage as soon as 51 percent of Americans and around two-thirds of Democrats were in favor of gay marriage. When 57 percent of Americans favored a pathway to citizenship and 71 percent of Democrats favored a pathway to citizenship for illegal immigrants Hillary came out and supported a pathway to citizenship. On criminal justice reform Clinton called for rolling back mandatory minimum sentencing laws when 54 percent of Americans and 55 percent of Democrats agreed. Even after her primary with Bernie. Clinton started to voice her support for the nationwide “fight for $15,” even though she supported raising the federal minimum wage to $12 before. She flipped on the Trans-Pacific Partnership. On Marijuana legalization she still lags behind but is more supportive of the Democratic platform that calls for a reasoned pathway to future legalization of marijuana. Clinton has backed the death penalty in certain situations but now the platform of the democratic party is that it should be abolished. Based on the Democratic platform established after she won the nomination, Clinton is further to the right then what the Democratic platform advocates for. Clinton isn't one that generally fights for progress within the Democratic party - she has always just moved with it. As of now - according to the platform of the democratic party - she is right of those positions. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmm 879 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Even Trump in more Liberal than her Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adakam 2 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Coulda woulda shoulda.... Why does this even matter, can we just focus on fixing the fascist cheeto before he destroys the country? Lets stop living in the past Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleCharter 130 Posted February 9, 2017 Share Posted February 9, 2017 Daily reminder Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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