Joumana 463 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Why do lebanese accept to be controlled by other countries and sell their country and identity to them? were a bastardised people to begin with dont even start lol guess whos up in this bitch Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Economy 52,858 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 And I am so glad that I live in a country where I atleast know weather im free or not than to live in a country where people become more and more stupid everytime they talk about how free they are. All countries and governments are immoral, it just depends on what kind of immorals you prefer and I prefer to live under the immorality of Saudi Arabia than America as I lived in both countries unlike you.The reason the world is so slow is because the west is forcing itself down everyones throat to the point where everyone rejects any western ideologies. Leave us to progress and grow into what is moral our way. Stop manipulating and controlling the world in the name of helping others specially when the whole world fears your help. i wasnt picking sides and i havent lived in either. Im just saying im glad i live in the Country i do considering how slow the whole world seems to progress but for Social issues both sound terrible from what i see and hear but id still take USA over any Middle Eastern Nation Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LebaneseDude 6,146 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 im lebanese and i second thisYou'd be stupid not to realize that the money brought in by the Gulf isn't helpful to Lebanon.However you'd be just as stupid if you thought that it was for the right reasons, or even worse, with the right motives.It's a shame we're so dependent on everyone else. It's not really anyone's fault though. A confessional republic like ours is destined to fail, especially since radical Islam is alive and well, and you have countries like KSA and Iran stoking the fire using our country as a battleground for their own Sunni vs Shia war that most Lebanese, particularly Christians, have no vested interest in beyond guaranteeing their own survival. That's a pretty important interest, but the fact that it matters is just...bleh. Edited just now by LebaneseDude. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiltedbliss 915 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 No but Jordan is the best middle eastern country that supports the LGBT rights.Yeah, I heard it's been legal there for a while. But apparently, the public isn't so keen on the idea? I'm not sure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LebaneseDude 6,146 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 No but Jordan is the best middle eastern country that supports the LGBT rights.Technically it's actually Israel. Edited just now by LebaneseDude. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmm 879 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Technically it's actually Israel. We Arabs dont recognize Israel as a state and the UN consider its laws illegal.. Israel also doesnt allow mix racial marriage between palestinians and jews based on DNA so its a apartheid state. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LebaneseDude 6,146 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Yeah, I heard it's been legal there for a while. But apparently, the public isn't so keen on the idea? I'm not sure. Lebanon and Jordan are the most advanced on LGBT rights.Both have progressed in different manners. Jordan is more advanced on a governmental level, while Lebanon has advanced more on a cultural level.I know more about Lebanon, so I'll talk about that.LGB visibility is very high in comparison to other countries in the Middle East. In general, it's an overstatement to call Lebanese people homophobic. At worst. most adults (by poll approximately 60%) look at LGB people with some variation of "disgusted but whatever". It's important to note that this poll was taken a long time ago so the numbers are invariably lower. It is also important to note that millennials are much more tolerant of LGB (not T) issues, particularly Christians and Sunni muslims (ironically). Programs frequently bring up LGBT topics in favourable light. Celebrities publicly acknowledge and promote the acceptance of LGBT rights. That they do so without fear of backlash goes to show how the general trend is. The public consistently has a generally negative reaction towards anti-gay raids on nightclubs and such.The problem in Lebanon is that most anti-LGBT incidents are from the government. There's a major issue of accountability.Once again, the real reason Lebanese LGBT rights are being held back is the confessional system. I don't expect there to ever be a formal recognition of LGBT rights in Lebanon as long as we aren't a secular state, or as long as Christian and Islamic theologists stop being homophobic.The Vatican's current stance gives me some hope. It already shows. When the Pope made his statement at the end of the Synod against conservative "head burying in the sand" regarding current issues (including LGBT), there was signfiicant discourse in Lebanon about it.At this point, the ball is on the Islamic theologist's court. Edited just now by LebaneseDude. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melech 9,900 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 There is many muslim countries that are secular and even ban the hijab (not that thats a good thing) and is a democracy. And what about western countries? they deserve to be rich and powerful you think?Difference is that Western countries have some kinds of Human rights that Saudia Arabia doesn't have. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melech 9,900 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 No but Jordan is the best middle eastern country that supports the LGBT rights.Off topic but Israel is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melech 9,900 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 We Arabs dont recognize Israel as a state and the UN consider its laws illegal.. Israel also doesnt allow mix racial marriage between palestinians and jews based on DNA so its a apartheid state. That makes it even worse. Israel is acknowledged by the UN. And no way Israeli LGBT rights are considered illegal by the UN Btw you can marry in Cyprus for example with a mix race and it's considered legal in Israel. Btw in Saudia Arabia it's not allowed to practice for example Christianity openly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LebaneseDude 6,146 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 We Arabs dont recognize Israel as a state and the UN consider its laws illegal.. Israel also doesnt allow mix racial marriage between palestinians and jews based on DNA so its a apartheid state.Right..not going to get into an Israel debate but..... when someone takes the Royal Jordanian flight to Tel Aviv they walk in and say "I don't recognize your state so let me pass"?Arabs do use Lebanon as a battleground for their private fights against Israel though.Also the notion of whether Israel exists or not is irrelevant. LGBT people (Israeli or Palestinian) in areas designated as "Israel" have their rights respected. That's what's ultimately important, not what their borders are.Note that the intentions behind the advancements are also irrelevant. Even if they were for pinkwashing, LGBT people are ultimately respected. Edited just now by LebaneseDude. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmm 879 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Difference is that Western countries have some kinds of Human rights that Saudia Arabia doesn't have. When did I deny that or claimed otherwise? Off topic but Israel is. I hate when people say off topic! I was replying to someone and having an argument with them and conversations must grow and evolve into different subjects. That makes it even worse. Israel is acknowledged by the UN. And no way Israeli LGBT rights are considered illegal by the UN Btw you can marry in Cyprus for example with a mix race and it's considered legal in Israel. Btw in Saudia Arabia it's not allowed to practice for example Christianity openly. I never said that the LGBT rights are considered illegal! cant you read? and its insane that you have to make two people fly to another country in order for them to get married because they have different DNA and I dont think Palestinians are welcomed in cyprus. That is apartheid! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiltedbliss 915 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Lebanon and Jordan are the most advanced on LGBT rights. Both have progressed in different manners. Jordan is more advanced on a governmental level, while Lebanon has advanced more on a cultural level. I know more about Lebanon, so I'll talk about that. LGB visibility is very high in comparison to other countries in the Middle East. In general, it's an overstatement to call Lebanese people homophobic. At worst. most adults (by poll approximately 60%) look at LGB people with some variation of "disgusted but whatever". It's important to note that this poll was taken a long time ago so the numbers are invariably lower. It is also important to note that millennials are much more tolerant of LGB (not T) issues, particularly Christians and Sunni muslims (ironically). Programs frequently bring up LGBT topics in favourable light. Celebrities publicly acknowledge and promote the acceptance of LGBT rights. That they do so without fear of backlash goes to show how the general trend is. The public consistently has a generally negative reaction towards anti-gay raids on nightclubs and such. The problem in Lebanon is that most anti-LGBT incidents are from the government. There's a major issue of accountability. Once again, the real reason Lebanese LGBT rights are being held back is the confessional system. I don't expect there to ever be a formal recognition of LGBT rights in Lebanon as long as we aren't a secular state, or as long as Christian and Islamic theologists stop being homophobic. The Vatican's current stance gives me some hope. It already shows. When the Pope made his statement at the end of the Synod against conservative "head burying in the sand" regarding current issues (including LGBT), there was signfiicant discourse in Lebanon about it. At this point, the ball is on the Islamic theologist's court. Omg thank you so much for the insight makes a lot more sense! I actually plan on moving to Lebanon for uni, but when I'm done, I'll do my masters in the US/UK. I heard 'AUB' is good? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmm 879 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Right..not going to get into an Israel debate but..... when someone takes the Royal Jordanian flight to Tel Aviv they walk in and say "I don't recognize your state so let me pass"?Arabs do use Lebanon as a battleground for their private fights against Israel though.Also the notion of whether Israel exists or not is irrelevant. LGBT people (Israeli or Palestinian) in areas designated as "Israel" have their rights respected. That's what's ultimately important, not what their borders are.Note that the intentions behind the advancements are also irrelevant. Even if they were for pinkwashing, LGBT people are ultimately respected.Anyone who travels to tel aviv or israel recognize israel and thats why all arabs forbid travelers to enter israel except for egypt I think. I dont know what lebanon being used for battleground have to do with this? all these arguments from you and others have nothing to do with what im saying! All I said is that Saudi Arabia does not kill gays and that all governments are bad. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LebaneseDude 6,146 Posted October 26, 2015 Share Posted October 26, 2015 Omg thank you so much for the insight makes a lot more sense! I actually plan on moving to Lebanon for uni, but when I'm done, I'll do my masters in the US/UK. I heard 'AUB' is good? One of the best in the region. :) Edited just now by LebaneseDude. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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