Cameron begs Scotland: Don't rip our family of nations apart

[Goosey 3,017]

Scottish lass here and no all the way

 

Why would you not want to be independent?

 

[craig 680]

Why should the poor person in Newcastle receive zero benefit from the oil?

Or the Shetland Islanders not claim it all for themselves?

 

Anyway, isn't peak North Sea oil already past?

[Better Day 5,766]

Why should the poor person in Newcastle receive zero benefit from the oil?

Or the Shetland Islanders not claim it all for themselves?

It isn't in Newcastles land, It's Scottish land, Sheltland would be part of a independent country so it would benefit them as much it does say Abeerdeen

Anyway, isn't peak North Sea oil already past?

Most of the scaremongering that is going about on here is it just as bad as the BBC

[CalumGaGa 0]

Wow, I'm shocked to discover that I'm in the minority as being the only No voter here. All my nearest and dearest are too and we are seriously worried about the effects independence will bring. You can't get a single straight answer out of the Yes side and the claims of Scotland relying on oil to pay for everything and being one of the richest, most prosperous nations on earth is pure fantasy. If all our industries are so successful, then how come so many of us are broke? Why do we have to rely on English funding? Why are dozens of major retailers closing and being replaced with pound shops (and they end up closing too?) Why have there been dozens of health and education cuts? It's misguided to blame the English and Westminister for all this. This is how we're suffering when we have England to help us. To go from a nation of 63 million to just 5 million overnight is madness. The hassle and stress this would cause is not worth it. Here's a bullet point rundown of the facts:

 

The negatives of Scottish independence:

- Losing the UK currency. There are no solid plans in place as to what will replace it.

- Price rise of everything, including credit cards, mortgages, loans, shopping bills, household and utility bills.

- Higher taxes.

- Extreme cuts to health care and education.

- As 1 in 5 Scottish jobs are with companies based elsewhere in the UK, 600,000 jobs will be put at risk.

- No more UK taxpayers paying for Scotland's health care.

- No more UK taxpayers funding Scotland's pensions.

- No longer being a part of the £34 billion UK military defence budget to keep us safe from overseas threats.

- Losing out on our huge standing and financial benefits we got within the EU as part of the UK.

- No longer being part of the successful Team GB in sport and Scottish athletes being kicked off UK teams.

- Hundreds of thousands of Scottish university applications and funding being cut.

- Welfare cuts.

- More money having to be spend on border control for the first time.

- Relying on North Sea Oil to fund the country, which is predicted to run out by around 2030. This same oil that has only been paying for education, health care and pensions is planned to pay for literally EVERYTHING in Scotland.

 

 

Those statistics are terrying. Scotland will gain nothing that it doesn't already have. We already have a famous independent identity, our own language, flag, football team, currency, parliament. What positive things could independence give us that we don't already have other than an official national anthem? Staying part of a 63 million population country that is one of the world's richest and most powerful...or taking a huge leap into the unknown with no clear plan? No contest. NO.

Agree 100%

[CalumGaGa 0]

Most of the scaremongering that is going about on here is it just as bad as the BBC

Funny when someone says something that the yes campaign don't agree with its automatically scaremongering or project fear even when it's an economic fact, the yes campaign do not have the answers to the questions they are asked, they are playing to people's hearts and more fool them for believing it. The whole thing had been the SNP's obsession for decades and all they want is to break up britain no matter what the cost.

[MonsterOfSpain 8,331]

If I was Scottish I'd vote NO (just as if I was Catalonian)

[StrawberryBlond 15,566]

Why would you not want to be independent?

 

 

It's not Scotland's oil. It never has been and never will be. Just because it's on Scottish territory doesn't mean it's in Scotland's possession. As part of a union, it had to be shared, which means it was never Scotland's alone. Only an independent country can completely claim possession of its oil, not one that got independent later. I can answer those questions above and it's nothing to do with being non-independent. How can there be only be jobs for 1 in 5 school leavers? There's job's everywhere, it's just that not everyone is trained for them or interested in them. Plus, as a small country, there's only so many jobs around despite a growing population. And there are lots of people unemployed because they're looking for a specific job that they can't achieve or don't want to work at all and live off benefits. Maybe it's the work ethic that's the problem, not the lack of independence? It's frequently noted that foreign immigrants are great workers and are willing to take any job, no matter how low paid or unskilled. But in the UK, we approach employment differently. We want jobs, but only good ones and we treat low paid, low skilled jobs like they're beneath us, even if we can barely pay the rent. There are jobs out there, we just don't want them.

And even if oil production does continue on for 30-40 years, it peaked in 1999 and has dropped ever since, running a deficit in 20 out of 21 years. And if it is still going to be produced for the next 40 years, what happens after that? If oil is going to pay for everything, what will happen when it all runs out, less than half a century away? That is the question I can't get any yes voters to confirm. And future generations are going to grow up in a Scotland where the so-called biggest revenue is extinct. Independence is forever, oil is not.

 

Most of the scaremongering that is going about on here is it just as bad as the BBC

 

It isn't scaremongering, it's fact, confirmed not by politicians, but by the respective experts. This is what ultimately is getting to me about the yes campaign - the truth is toxic to them. Any time a fact is brought up that the yes voters don't like, they write it off as scaremongering. But the no voters write off the things they say as delusion, fantasy and downright lies. What remains is that there is no solid plan in place as to how things will function. The reply to a lot of topics is "We'll see to it when we get to it." Basically, we're being told to vote for independence with no solid information about what it'll bring. You cannot vote for something if you don't know for sure what you're going to get out of it. It's clear to listen to the Yes politicians that they have done no planning in the four years they had to build up to this referendum. I can't support a decision that will cause loss of jobs and cuts to major services just to fufil an independence fantasy. But as long as it's not their job they're losing, yes voters don't seem to care. All I've seen from the yes side is greed and self-importance and its made me very disappointed in the nation I love so much. I can't believe so many are falling for Salmond's lies and acting so anti English. I have seen some English admitting that independence is going to be terrible for us and think that if we want to make a stupid gamble, we deserve whatever we get. They can see it, why can't we?

 

Remember that if we do get independence, we can no longer blame England for any problems we face. No hand-outs, no funding, no connections, nothing. If independence does bring Scotland to its knees, we can't re-join the union and we'd have to admit that our downfall was all our fault because we voted for it. Consider if that's a risk you want to take.

[Goosey 3,017]

It's not Scotland's oil. It never has been and never will be. Just because it's on Scottish territory doesn't mean it's in Scotland's possession. As part of a union, it had to be shared, which means it was never Scotland's alone. Only an independent country can completely claim possession of its oil, not one that got independent later. I can answer those questions above and it's nothing to do with being non-independent. How can there be only be jobs for 1 in 5 school leavers? There's job's everywhere, it's just that not everyone is trained for them or interested in them. Plus, as a small country, there's only so many jobs around despite a growing population. And there are lots of people unemployed because they're looking for a specific job that they can't achieve or don't want to work at all and live off benefits. Maybe it's the work ethic that's the problem, not the lack of independence? It's frequently noted that foreign immigrants are great workers and are willing to take any job, no matter how low paid or unskilled. But in the UK, we approach employment differently. We want jobs, but only good ones and we treat low paid, low skilled jobs like they're beneath us, even if we can barely pay the rent. There are jobs out there, we just don't want them.

And even if oil production does continue on for 30-40 years, it peaked in 1999 and has dropped ever since, running a deficit in 20 out of 21 years. And if it is still going to be produced for the next 40 years, what happens after that? If oil is going to pay for everything, what will happen when it all runs out, less than half a century away? That is the question I can't get any yes voters to confirm. And future generations are going to grow up in a Scotland where the so-called biggest revenue is extinct. Independence is forever, oil is not.

 

 

It isn't scaremongering, it's fact, confirmed not by politicians, but by the respective experts. This is what ultimately is getting to me about the yes campaign - the truth is toxic to them. Any time a fact is brought up that the yes voters don't like, they write it off as scaremongering. But the no voters write off the things they say as delusion, fantasy and downright lies. What remains is that there is no solid plan in place as to how things will function. The reply to a lot of topics is "We'll see to it when we get to it." Basically, we're being told to vote for independence with no solid information about what it'll bring. You cannot vote for something if you don't know for sure what you're going to get out of it. It's clear to listen to the Yes politicians that they have done no planning in the four years they had to build up to this referendum. I can't support a decision that will cause loss of jobs and cuts to major services just to fufil an independence fantasy. But as long as it's not their job they're losing, yes voters don't seem to care. All I've seen from the yes side is greed and self-importance and its made me very disappointed in the nation I love so much. I can't believe so many are falling for Salmond's lies and acting so anti English. I have seen some English admitting that independence is going to be terrible for us and think that if we want to make a stupid gamble, we deserve whatever we get. They can see it, why can't we?

 

Remember that if we do get independence, we can no longer blame England for any problems we face. No hand-outs, no funding, no connections, nothing. If independence does bring Scotland to its knees, we can't re-join the union and we'd have to admit that our downfall was all our fault because we voted for it. Consider if that's a risk you want to take.

 

Does this even matter though? The country isn't independent I doubt 300 years ago the Scots would want to submit to the English yoke they'd probably be happier living in a thatch hut the SCOTS ARE supposed to be a proud and independent people but that's not the case for many of them! It's too bad people these days worry about every little thing and don't think about their national honour just sitting around content with taking orders from Westminster (they should call it North Britain not Scotland). I was talking to people here involved with the SNP back in the 70s and they found it very sad that many Scots won't vote for independence because they're too scared of change and quote "all the nervous old people will come out of the woodwork and go, ooh, I had better vote to keep things the same". Alba gu bràth!

[Cersei 56]

Personally, I think this could be a huge mistake for scotland

 

but if they want to be be independent... go ahead, but remember this is PERMANENT. So if you want independence, make sure you're 100% BEHIND IT.

[Better Day 5,766]

Remember guys, Australia, Canada, New Zealand (Ex British Empire countries) all successful. Yeah I am pertified about what happens after we become independent: 

 

Firstly we will keep the pound, The British Government can't stop this, Alastair Darling even said so in the last debate 

 

- How do we know they will be cuts, We will be able to fund our own services, We do have the oil, then we will be able to use renewable energy which is a emerging market. 

 

- The fear of being invaded, We have no modern day enemies (Scotland). In the last 1000 years we have had ONE country invade us (England). Plus we will have a army to create, Weapons etc to make creating jobs for people. 

 

- We won't have border control, We will be part of the EU, Which includes no border control between countries. 

 

- It is our oil, It's in Scottish ground. Just Westminister keep it part of the union (which means sharing) but in reality if we do go independent it will be ours again. 

 

- Yes Scotland IS NOT anti English, They believe Scotland would make a better country for itself, We don't want independence because we feel 'Scottish' not 'British'. I am mainly voting yes (as is other people, I have asked) because we would make a better country for ourselves. 

 

- No country has ever regretted going independent 

 

- It isn't UK's taxpayers for our health care. UNI fees. It us, It's the Scottish Government funding it through money we receive from Westminister which is money we earned (We give more money than we receive). 

 

- Remember the poverty rates the Westminister Government hasn't solved. The problem is getting worse and worse. Britain is literally going down the drain have been since the Second World War. The Tories aren't doing anything to solve the problems, They keep all the money for the rich, Labour isn't that much better. 

 

Finally, Scotland is a strong country (14th richest in the WORLD). Westminister is giving us under representation. Those in England or abroad you don't know what it is like in Scotland. I mean I ain't Anti English I just believe Scotland will make a better country for itself. I mean it can't get any worse than it is right now. 

 

18 of September 2014, Vote YES

[craig 680]

Does this even matter though? The country isn't independent I doubt 300 years ago the Scots would want to submit to the English yoke they'd probably be happier living in a thatch hut the SCOTS ARE supposed to be a proud and independent people but that's not the case for many of them! It's too bad people these days worry about every little thing and don't think about their national honour just sitting around content with taking orders from Westminster (they should call it North Britain not Scotland). I was talking to people here involved with the SNP back in the 70s and they found it very sad that many Scots won't vote for independence because they're too scared of change and quote "all the nervous old people will come out of the woodwork and go, ooh, I had better vote to keep things the same". Alba gu bràth!

 

Scotland requested the Union of Parliaments. They were not conquered. I think many NO supporters feel being British is part of their identity, and they share a language and 300 years of proud history with the southern part of the British Isles. Old people have living memory of that history, like fighting together against Hitler. 

 

Get rid of Westminster, you'll still like Brussels/Berlin, and international bankers constraining what you can do, and you'll just be blaming politicians in Glasgow instead of Westminster. With Devo-Max, your Glasgow politicians will have plenty of say anyway.

[StrawberryBlond 15,566]

Does this even matter though? The country isn't independent I doubt 300 years ago the Scots would want to submit to the English yoke they'd probably be happier living in a thatch hut the SCOTS ARE supposed to be a proud and independent people but that's not the case for many of them! It's too bad people these days worry about every little thing and don't think about their national honour just sitting around content with taking orders from Westminster (they should call it North Britain not Scotland). I was talking to people here involved with the SNP back in the 70s and they found it very sad that many Scots won't vote for independence because they're too scared of change and quote "all the nervous old people will come out of the woodwork and go, ooh, I had better vote to keep things the same". Alba gu bràth!

 

Their "national honour?" Those are some frightening words in this context. It brings up connotations of Nazi Germany, not something I would want to associate with Scotland. The bullying and intimidation tactics from the yes voters are getting more extreme now. I don't want to be part of a country where its citizens harrass people who don't think the same way they do. Some view of a free, democratic, independent Scotland, where anyone who goes against the so-called status quo is put down. It's a big misconception that no voters are not patriotic. We're voting no because we are patriotic and don't want Scotland to be destroyed by the negatives of independence. I am not voting no because I'm afraid of change. I'm voting no because I'm afraid of guaranteed failure. Two different things. Yes voters will not know what they have until it's gone, mark my words. The sad thing is, whatever the result is, both sides will blame one another for Scotland's outcome. If we gain independence and everything goes wrong, no voters will be cursing the yes voters. If we don't gain independence and life in the UK gets worse, the yes voters will curse the no voters. No one will truly win. This referendum has brought out the true colours of a lot of Scots and turned fellow Scots against each other and no matter which way this goes, Scotland will not be the same again. The closer the vote is, the more divided it will be as a nation. I'm absolutely positive fights and riots might begin in some regions. God help us.

[Goosey 3,017]

Their "national honour?" Those are some frightening words in this context. It brings up connotations of Nazi Germany, not something I would want to associate with Scotland.

 

Bahaha, nice reductio ad Hitlerum...

Scotland requested the Union of Parliaments. They were not conquered. I think many NO supporters feel being British is part of their identity, and they share a language and 300 years of proud history with the southern part of the British Isles. Old people have living memory of that history, like fighting together against Hitler. 

 

Get rid of Westminster, you'll still like Brussels/Berlin, and international bankers constraining what you can do, and you'll just be blaming politicians in Glasgow instead of Westminster. With Devo-Max, your Glasgow politicians will have plenty of say anyway.

Well, I'm still sore about Culloden and Glencoe... long memories...

[Melech 9,900]

Their "national honour?" Those are some frightening words in this context. It brings up connotations of Nazi Germany, not something I would want to associate with Scotland. The bullying and intimidation tactics from the yes voters are getting more extreme now. I don't want to be part of a country where its citizens harrass people who don't think the same way they do. Some view of a free, democratic, independent Scotland, where anyone who goes against the so-called status quo is put down. It's a big misconception that no voters are not patriotic. We're voting no because we are patriotic and don't want Scotland to be destroyed by the negatives of independence. I am not voting no because I'm afraid of change. I'm voting no because I'm afraid of guaranteed failure. Two different things. Yes voters will not know what they have until it's gone, mark my words. The sad thing is, whatever the result is, both sides will blame one another for Scotland's outcome. If we gain independence and everything goes wrong, no voters will be cursing the yes voters. If we don't gain independence and life in the UK gets worse, the yes voters will curse the no voters. No one will truly win. This referendum has brought out the true colours of a lot of Scots and turned fellow Scots against each other and no matter which way this goes, Scotland will not be the same again. The closer the vote is, the more divided it will be as a nation. I'm absolutely positive fights and riots might begin in some regions. God help us.

Nazi Germany has nothing to do with national honour 

[garnite 8]

streaming some of the uk news channels online. they're quite negative today, more so than before. endless doom and gloom.