Israel - Palestine Conflict Discussion Thread

[Noam Zioni 1,201]

 

You are talking in advance. This is just happening. Yeah also 4 kids on the beach playing football were also hiding weapons.... in their shorts.

 

 

Ross & Phoebe were good Friends. Also Ross likes to hit that report button. I thought you said ''don't quote me''?

The kids were not killed in purpose. The beach contained weapons and ammunition.

[Ursula Buffay 73]

 

You are talking in advance. This is just happening. Yeah also 4 kids on the beach playing football were also hiding weapons.... in their shorts.

 

 

Ross & Phoebe were good Friends. Also Ross likes to hit that report button. I thought you said ''don't quote me''?

 

You've lost all logics. Are you just going mad over nothing? Is this your way of convincing others of your point of view? If you think you're being an activist about the topic, you are making more people fear from Palestine than anything else. And you'll probably be the reason this thread would be closed.

 

Other than that chill, and listen to ARTPOP :)

[Noam Zioni 1,201]

You've lost all logics. Are you just going mad over nothing? Is this your way of convincing others of your point of view? If you think you're being an activist about the topic, you are making more people fear from Palestine than anything else. And you'll probably be the reason this thread would be closed.

 

Other than that chill, and listen to ARTPOP :)

THIS

[lego 44,165]

Jewish-American Organizations Have Abandoned the Israeli Left

 

The Israeli assault on the Gaza Strip called “Protective Edge†will eventually come to an end. But the destruction wrought upon Gaza and its people has been monstrous – according to one calculation, explosives equal to the atomic bomb dropped on Hiroshima – and it will be a source of great suffering for years and decades to come.

With the fatalities being borne overwhelmingly by the Palestinian side, it seems inappropriate to speak of Jewish losses. However, it is important to note a passing that will have repercussions for both Israelis and Palestinians in the future. For in addition to the 2,000 dead Palestinians and 60 dead Israelis, the assault has produced another casualty: the pretense that diasporic Jewish leaders are any more liberal than their Israeli counterparts.

In a recent article for Religion Dispatches, I chronicled how horrific language by Israeli political and religious officials, including calls to ethnically cleanse the Land of Israel and commit genocide against Palestinians, has recently been adopted by leading Jewish American public figures, secular and religious. Notably, the president of the New York Board of Rabbis, David-Seth Kirshner, justified the non-combatant death toll in Gaza, telling a crowd of 10,000 people that Palestinians who voted for Hamas are not civilians.

While mainstream Jewish leaders like Kirshner have embraced the far-rights rhetoric, there have long been alternative groups who have spoken out against racism and in favor of human rights for all inhabitants of the land, whether Israeli, Arabs, Africans or others. Even as it broke from Rabbis For Human Rights, its parent organization, the North American group T’ruah continued to claim to be one of these forces, comprised of rabbis calling for racial and social justice.

While T’ruah has expressed support for human rights in the past, it seems to have been swept up in the recent wave of ultra-nationalism surging through Jewish communities in Israel and abroad. Earlier this week at the Times Of Israel – which has already demonstrated its willingness to publish dog-whistles for the genocide of non-Jews – T’ruah’s Senior Rabbinic Educator in Israel, Rabbi Gideon Sylvester, penned a blog laying bare a most dangerous ideology.

In true Times of Israel tradition, Sylvester floats a reprehensible suggestion, but falls short of advocating for it outright, giving him plausible deniability. In his piece, called “When legitimate criticism becomes treachery“, Sylvester suggests that Ha’aretz columnist Gideon Levy may be a “moser or Jewish traitor… the most detested figure of allâ€. In the not-so-distant past, Jewish courts have punished these so-called “snitches†with mutilation and death.

Levy’s crime, according to Sylvester, is that he told a TV team from the U.K. that Israel’s assault on Gaza “inevitably led to an unacceptable number of civilian casualties†and that “in this war, Israelis did not even bother to question what our army was doingâ€. Levy’s a--lysis was born out by Tel Aviv University poll results published this week: a full 97% of Jewish Israelis rated the army’s recent actions in Gaza as “very good or moderately good.â€

In his final paragraph, Sylvester summarizes his point: “Indiscriminate criticism of our country [israel] in a hostile media is a luxury we cannot afford, at least until our people in the South of Israel, South America and everywhere else can live their Jewish lives openly and without fear.†In other words, as long as there is any anti-Jewish racism anywhere in the world, Israel cannot abide whistleblowers who expose its crimes, even crimes against humanity.

The thing about racism is that it is unlikely to ever be completely extinguished. This is the case for hatred towards all minority groups, not only Jews. No matter how much effort a society devotes to combating racism, there will always be people who prejudge and discriminate on the basis of group membership. So according to Sylvester’s logic, calling out the Israeli government for its crimes must be delayed indefinitely, permanently, until a utopian era when no anti-Semitism exists anywhere.

In short, non-Jews do not deserve to be treated fairly in Israel as long as even one Jew, anywhere in the world, is treated unfairly.

Suffice it to say that unless we start listening to Israel’s whistleblowers, rather than accusing them of race-treason, Israel will not enter any Messianic age – in fact, just the opposite will happen. As I wrote last month in Muftah, and as Chemi Shalev wrote yesterday in Ha’aretz, American Jewish “leaders†have long chosen to ignore pervasive evidence of a vast increase in Israeli state-sponsored racism which continues to grow, surpassing previously-unimaginable levels.

A precious few Jewish citizens of Israel are risking employment opportunities and their social standing to demonstrate against the assault on Gaza, the siege on the Strip, and the entire system of racial and religious-based discrimination that is at the root of the conflict. Many more Palestinians, in Israel and in the West Bank, are risking much more to demonstrate the same. More than ever, they need Jewish voices from outside to stand in solidarity for freedom and equality.

But as ultra-Zionist groupthink engulfs even those who once called themselves Rabbis for Human Rights, the last vestiges of the Israeli left have been betrayed by their former friends. Instead of bolstering the voices of human rights advocates, so-called American liberal groups like T’ruah have joined their conservative counterparts in a McCarthyist campaign to crush dissent.

On the same day Sylvester published his screed, an Israeli government lawmaker ridiculed the low turnout at a recent anti-war rally in Tel Aviv, saying “the Left has become an endangered species.†If his assessment is accurate, it is in no small part thanks to the American Jewish groups who responded to the progressive camp’s plea for help by piling logs on the fire.

 

http://muftah.org/jewish-american-organizations-abandoned-israeli-left/#.U_U9k_mSw12

[lego 44,165]

RAFAH NOW, most of the injured are kids.#GazaUnderAttack.

 

 

 

[Woolfsmck 2,763]

How are their bombs accurate when majority killed are civilians?

Israel is targeting ammunition and launch sites... Placed very intentionally beside or under civilians...

Rockets without guidance will obviously hit indiscrimently.... The morality is clearly the problem. I can't see Palestinians crying about their victims till they halt the rocket fire... Only until then will civilian losses be considered victims.

[lego 44,165]

Israel is targeting ammunition and launch sites... Place very intentionally beside or under civilians...

Rockets without guidance will obviously hit indiscrimently.... The morality is clearly the problem. I can't see Palestinians crying about their victims till they halt the rocket fire... Only until then will civilian losses be considered victims.

Do you have kids?

 

 

 

I can't see Palestinians crying about their victims till they halt the rocket fire... Only until then will civilian losses be considered victims.

 

I can't believe what I'm reading...do you have a heart? What do these kids have to do with rockets? 

[Woolfsmck 2,763]

Do you have kids?

none of your business. Off topic and close to getting a complaint filed.

[ByeBye49 161]

First post in this thread.

 

Anyway, I support the innocent civilians on BOTH sides of the argument. The military on the other hand, I think a lot differently towards.

 

I'm probably not going to post in here often But I'll lurk on here. Quote me if you want to ask anything.

[Shadow 6,697]

I respect you for many reasons, I just got feeling from your post that there is censorship coming.

Like if someone bugs you enough, you would have to react.

You don't need to take sides, just wanted to explain why permanently closing would be unfair to one side.

No problem.

Censorship by far is not my goal, I want there to be discussion, as fair and honest as civilly possible. However, derogatory and personal insults will not be tolerated as it adds nothing to the discussion, is against the forum rules, and deters from the issues at hand related to the Israeli invasion of Gaza and the rocket assault on Tel Aviv.

This isn't a matter of bugging me with "reports" to get me to close it. I thought I made it clear in my reopening post that only reports for serious violations will be taken into consideration. Moderators are well aware of how users abuse that feature over idle things. We are attempting to continue this discussion with order and reason.

All members who participate need to think about what they are posting with a calm, collected mind. If we focus on the issues on hand, things can carry on fine. Individuals are accountable for their own actions and closing this thread would be a consequence on users for not following the rules.

So it behooves everyone participating to do their part to keep this thread open by keeping it civil.

[Shadow 6,697]

You've lost all logics. Are you just going mad over nothing? Is this your way of convincing others of your point of view? If you think you're being an activist about the topic, you are making more people fear from Palestine than anything else. And you'll probably be the reason this thread would be closed.

Other than that chill, and listen to ARTPOP :)

I would be more concerned with yourself if I were you... Phoebe... If you continue talking like this to members, it could be you who ends up being the reason this thread closes and following consequences.

Edit: This goes for everyone. Please stay on topic and stop getting personal...

[Jjang 2,262]

The kids were not killed in purpose. The beach contained weapons and ammunition.

We have all seen videos of the 4 children getting bombed, i dont understand, it was an open -clean- area, there was no weapons, how could a trained pilot/soldier make a mistake as tragic and obvious as that? Thats no excuse for this crime, especially when you claim that you dont target civilians.

[Dolev 867]

http://bcove.me/v0atbnrf

The amount of propaganda

So sad it could almost fit a movie script

If you are going to kidnap an Israeli soldier there will be consequences.

[Adakam 2]

Censorship by far is not my goal, I want there to be discussion, as fair and honest as civilly possible. However, derogatory and personal insults will not be tolerated as it adds nothing to the discussion, is against the forum rules, and deters from the issues at hand related to the Israeli invasion of Gaza and the rocket assault on Tel Aviv.

This isn't a matter of bugging me with "reports" to get me to close it. I thought I made it clear in my reopening post that only reports for serious violations will be taken into consideration. Moderators are well aware of how users abuse that feature over idle things. We are attempting to continue this discussion with order and reason.

All members who participate need to think about what they are posting with a calm, collected mind. If we focus on the issues on hand, things can carry on fine. Individuals are accountable for their own actions and closing this thread would be a consequence on users for not following the rules.

So it behooves everyone participating to do their part to keep this thread open by keeping it civil.

 

but are mods considering if people are being offensive from both sides? because I only see one side posting phrases like "delusional""educate yourself""hater""immature""Youre embarrassing yourself""childish" or abusing the use of sarcastic emojis, IM NOT saying the other side hasnt thrown any insults, but its clear as day which side is the most offensive towards others, so if this thread gets closed it really would be censorship.

 

also, im sorry but this isnt a Gaga vs Katy thread discussion, this is a serious issue and things are going to get hot, the mods just cant be so uptight about these kinds of threads, because regardless of the involved members, im sure there are many others learning and getting information trough here, so the mods have to get serious and monitor the thread, not just close it, its probably the most serious thread in the history of GGD, and it should NOT be closed

 

not planning on keeping this offtopic anymore, so i wont respond to your response (which i do expect) but that is my opinion

[Shadow 6,697]

but are mods considering if people are being offensive from both sides? because I only see one side posting phrases like "delusional""educate yourself""hater""immature""Youre embarrassing yourself""childish" or abusing the use of sarcastic emojis, IM NOT saying the other side hasnt thrown any insults, but its clear as day which side is the most offensive towards others, so if this thread gets closed it really would be censorship.

also, im sorry but this isnt a Gaga vs Katy thread discussion, this is a serious issue and things are going to get hot, the mods just cant be so uptight about these kinds of threads, because regardless of the involved members, im sure there are many others learning and getting information trough here, so the mods have to get serious and monitor the thread, not just close it, its probably the most serious thread in the history of GGD, and it should NOT be closed

not planning on keeping this offtopic anymore, so i wont respond to your response (which i do expect) but that is my opinion

Use the report feature. Do not give me "the mods only favor the other group" bs or "closing this thread would be censorship and a crime against humanity..." If people continue to break the rules, users here will be responsible for the consequences as plenty of forewarning has been given.

Each person on this forum is accountable to follow the rules and using any thread here is a privilege. If users abuse their privilege to discuss topics like these, they will lose it. Simple as that. If you wish to debate this issue to your heart's content without any rules, I'm sure you could find another forum on the World Wide Web to suit your interests.

Please respect the forum staff and carry on with the topic at hand.