lego 44,165 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 It wouldn't be the first time, they already did it in 2006 and it was confirmed by Reporters Without Borders, who also stressed that Al Jazeera had been covering the situation objectively. Then again, it has been widely doubted since 2010 that Al Jazeera has the political liberty it had in 2006. It's no secret that Qatar (who owns Al Jazeera) supports Hamas. It's very confusing because there are almost no reporters from the U.S. or Europe who can confirm Al Jazeera's claims. They usually just copy them without being sure of what really happened. It's better to be cautious and always check if the statements are true and if that's not possible (yet), to not post it to avoid confusion and misunderstandings. Just my point of view This just happened tho. And they have reporters from both US and Europe, if you see the names of those who write for them, there are even Jews. Also why would bbc or cnn be present in aljazeera headquorters? It's normal that they first publish this. And if it happened before, why it would surprise anyone this time? Also western media is always pro Israel, I like to see what other side says as well. FreePalestine Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didymus 34,380 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 This just happened tho. And they have reporters from both US and Europe, if you see the names of those who write for them, there are even Jews. Also why would bbc or cnn be present in aljazeera headquorters? It's normal that they first publish this. And if it happened before, why it would surprise anyone this time? Also western media is always pro Israel, I like to see what other side says as well. Well, this case is probably true, but the captured soldier story was false. I'm just speaking in general and trying to find a middle ground between you and Dolev's early discussion. European media is generally pro-Palestine and that also reflects in their humanitarian work. I can't speak for non-European Western media. But yeah, you're right, it's interesting to see what each side says and god knows the Israeli media is completely controlled by the government/army and what they'd like their people to hear. Just saying, using unconfirmed Al Jazeera posts to back up your view that Israel started this whole conflict (which you said in the first pages) is like using unconfirmed Israeli media reports to back up your view that the Israel army has the right to bombard hospitals and public places because there are Hamas terrorists. Both statements are contested in "objective" outsider media because no one knows if there really are terrorists at the places of attacks and it's clear that Hamas started firing rockets with the sole purpose of igniting a huge violence conflict (because what other purpose could they have had?). It's just complicated as hell and we, outsiders (and even the people living there) can only try to understand what's happening from the scraps of information we're receiving (which might not even be legitimate information). Any conclusion made on these scraps is gonna be inaccurate. Something to keep in mind constantly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lego 44,165 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Just saying, using unconfirmed Al Jazeera posts to back up your view that Israel started this whole conflict (which you said in the first pages) is like using unconfirmed Israeli media reports to back up your view that the Israel army has the right to bombard hospitals and public places because there are Hamas terrorists. Both statements are contested in "objective" outsider media because no one knows if there really are terrorists at the places of attacks and it's clear that Hamas started firing rockets first with the purpose of igniting a huge violence conflict. No, I didn't use them at all, check again. I posted link to video of 2 Palestinian teenagers being shot dead by Israeli forces, something they like to skip when they talk about this latest aggression and go straight to what happened after - kidnapping of 3 israeli teenagers. http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/20/video-indicates-killed-palestinian-youths-no-threat-israeli-forces it's clear that Hamas started firing rockets first with the purpose of igniting a huge violence conflict. How is this clear at all? What is the evidence? European media is generally pro-Palestine and that also reflects in their humanitarian work. I can't speak for non-European Western media. No it's not. They are very much pro Israel. Humanitarians are not connected or influenced by their government's media. David Poort â€@davidpoort #Israel' army confirms it has fired warning shots at Al Jazeera's office in #Gaza. Will they come out now and say that Al jazeera invented it all? FreePalestine Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didymus 34,380 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Edit: Not even gonna bother, I don't understand how you're trying to counter a post made by me that tries to honour both sides and wants to promote objecitivity and a sense of caution when making absolute statements about this conflict. It's clear to me now that you made this thread and ignited that awful and boring discussion with Dolev just to derail an honest discussion and have already decided to counter any post that doesn't unite with your anti-Israel, pro-Palestine point of view which is embarrassingly black and white. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmm 979 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 BERLIN (AP)  Berlin authorities say they've banned pro-Gaza protesters from chanting an anti-Semitic slogan and are investigating a sermon by a radical imam who called on Muslims to kill Jews. http://www.chron.com/news/world/article/Berlin-bans-anti-Semitic-slogan-at-Gaza-protests-5637222.php it's good that anti-semitism/anti-Jewish comments are being stopped (no doubt the freedom of expression excuse will be used ). It's also pathetic that some of these protestors are confusing the government and military of Israel with average Israelis and ordinary Jewish people. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lego 44,165 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 I didn't say Hamas started the violence first, I said they started firing rockets first. This has been confirmed by Hamas themselves and countless video's and pictures, including reporters in Israel. Of course the conflict didn't start there, but surely it nullifies arguments like "Israel started it all" like you made. Not even gonna get in to the video thing, I said I made a general statement about posts/threads/statements about this conflict and I wasn't even talking about you or Dolev specifically. What means FIRST? When is that FIRST? Hamas is product of Israel occupation and opression since they were created. If it wouldn't be them, it would be other group, it's normal for people to fight back. Pro-Israelis on this forum say Hamas started this latest conflict with kidnapping 3 teenagers, but they skip 2 palestinians dead and later 1 burned alive. When they mention rockets, it's always talking about the past, "for 15 years we live in fear" but then you can always go further back since their creation. And I was answering to a person who asked about this latest war. Airstrikes and ground invasion were long time planned and thought out and media ground was prepared to always go back and blame the victim-"they started it". FreePalestine Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MonsterMum 2,532 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Mess, there are plenty of way to emphasise on the Palestinian situation without resorting to anti sematic slogans, that's just wrong. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyQueen 2,409 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 I am on Izrael side this time! They strarted with the rockets Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didymus 34,380 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 What means FIRST? When is that FIRST? Hamas is product of Israel occupation and opression since they were created. If it wouldn't be them, it would be other group, it's normal for people to fight back. Pro-Israelis on this forum say Hamas started this latest conflict with kidnapping 3 teenagers, but they skip 2 palestinians dead and later 1 burned alive. When they mention rockets, it's always talking about the past, "for 15 years we live in fear" but then you can always go further back since their creation. How is that directed at me, though? I'm not pro-Israel and not pro-Palestine either. All I wanted to say is that it's probably best that we don't discuss unconfirmed Al Jazeera claims since they have been proven to be wrong at times and can ignite a full discussion when it can turn out to be false That is all I said. If it is indeed confirmed that Al Jazeera's bureau was attacked by the Israel army, then you won't hear me trying to make up another excuse like Dolev, you know.. But I gotta say, you're trying awfully hard to paint this situation as a very simple matter that isn't hard to understand at all. The reality isn't that simple. That was my point Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Didymus 34,380 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 I'm still confused as to why people think the problem of this conflict lies in the Jewish identity of the people in Israel. I've even seen members claim that this whole conflict started for a religious reason, which is not the case at all since the Zionist movement wasn't even religiously inspired in the vast majority of the cases. I'm glad this was banned. No one profits from this stereotyping. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lego 44,165 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 Edit: Not even gonna bother, I don't understand how you're trying to counter a post made by me that tries to honour both sides and wants to promote objecitivity and a sense of caution when making absolute statements about this conflict. It's clear to me now that you made this thread and ignited that awful and boring discussion with Dolev just to derail an honest discussion and have already decided to counter any post that doesn't unite with your anti-Israel, pro-Palestine point of view which is embarrassingly black and white. Don't bother then. I don't see this as honoring both sides, but whatever. Think what you want. FreePalestine Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmm 979 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 I'm still confused as to why people think the problem of this conflict lies in the Jewish identity of the people in Israel. I've even seen members claim that this whole conflict started for a religious reason, which is not the case at all since the Zionist movement wasn't even religiously inspired in the vast majority of the cases. I'm glad this was banned. No one profits from this stereotyping. I guess people just use any excuse to cover up their underlying hatred EDIT: Acc I guess that doesn't cover it up at all, meant more in the sense that they bandwagon on a peaceful protest for their own intolerant and hateful purposes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foivos 64 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 I am on Izrael side this time! They strarted with the rockets [warning] [/warning] Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lego 44,165 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 How is that directed at me, though? I'm not pro-Israel and not pro-Palestine either. All I wanted to say is that it's probably best that we don't discuss unconfirmed Al Jazeera claims since they have been proven to be wrong at times and can ignite a full discussion when it can turn out to be false That is all I said. If it is indeed confirmed that Al Jazeera's bureau was attacked by the Israel army, then you won't hear me trying to make up another excuse like Dolev, you know.. But I gotta say, you're trying awfully hard to paint this situation as a very simple matter that isn't hard to understand at all. The reality isn't that simple. That was my point But you don't need to discuss it. People here are free not to believe what Al Jazeera says. That won't stop me from posting though if I think it's worth posting. To me they're media like any other. People use all kinds of sources for their news, no one is really objective. FreePalestine Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnaLucia95 2 Posted July 22, 2014 Share Posted July 22, 2014 I'm still confused as to why people think the problem of this conflict lies in the Jewish identity of the people in Israel. I've even seen members claim that this whole conflict started for a religious reason, which is not the case at all since the Zionist movement wasn't even religiously inspired in the vast majority of the cases. I'm glad this was banned. No one profits from this stereotyping. I already see some Americans coming that this is restriction of freedom of speech and that it is bad :roll: :roll: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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