Protesters in Murrieta turn buses carrying detained immigrants away

[uo111 5,282]

Being honest, a TON of employers hire illegals in the country. And on top of filled just spots where a citizen could have paid ALL their taxes (like they've been doing their whole lives!), illegals drive down prices for the entire industry. It's completely irrelevant that they take physical labor jobs and not white collar jobs because they lack skills/talents that are employable; MOST income in this country is coming from blue-collar jobs. That means physical labor!

I'm sorry, but to say illegal immigrants don't take jobs away from American citizens is so ignorant it makes my brain hurt. There are an estimated (at least) 8.2 illegal immigrants in the workforce at this moment who pay no taxes to the government. Plus, the areas where illegal immigration is running the most rampant (on the border, go figure), that state economics greatly suffer from it. Illegals however do not hold the majority of the jobs in any one industry though. Every industry is mostly comprised of working class american citizens. This alone is proof than real Americans WANT those jobs and are actively out looking for them! I have a feeling that you are stereotyping the average American's will to work those laborious jobs. Say what you will about America, but we have to strongest workforce in the world by far, and that's why our GDP is going to stay the largest (by faaarrrrr) of any economy in the world for many, many years to come. Especially if you're comparing poverty levels, which our top(/only) competitor, China, will take over a century to match us in. 

But the only way the US will continue to recover is if we crack down HARD on these criminals that already cost us (and ME!!) BILLIONS of dollars (That is not a made up number. I mean BILLIONS. Tens, possibly HUNDREDS of BILLIONS of dollars by recent estimates). 

I see where you are coming from but you are blaming the wrong people.

 

Illegal immigrants are just trying to do what is best for them and their families. Illegally sure, but on a case by case basis they are just trying to provide a better life for themselves and their kids. A single person doing so is hardly a crisis.

 

The big companies who hire illegal immigrants are to blame and they are the ones who deserve the punishment. Look at it this way, if there was few ways for illegal immigrants to make a living in the united states, then they wouldn't come over here. But there is, and it's not their fault that there is. The 8.2 million "jobs" aren't even available to citizens because they are too dangerous, underpaid, and literally not even legal. If a citizen was expected to work those jobs they could sue for the treatment they receive. So no, immigrants aren't taking jobs, big companies are just using immigrants to work in jobs that they couldn't legally fill otherwise.

[Whispering 18,865]

it's not hard. Calories in = Calories out. It's literally physics and biology. Conservation of energy plus metabolism. If you are gaining weight, it is because you are eating too much. Period. Lack of exercise doesn't make someone fat; fundamentally it's what they eat. To make weight loss easier, you should exercise more. But if you want to loose weight, all you have to do is put down the BigMac and pick up a salad. That's it. That's literally it. By "stop eating", I mean that all you need to do is stop eating sh**. An obese person has never stayed fat by salads/fruit/vegetables, etc. 

Or you have a metabolic or hormone disorder. Or you have a disease, illness, mental disorder or even cancer and have to be on steroids or other medications that cause weight gain.

Things are rarely as simplistic as narrow minded people want to believe they are.

[Willy Wonka 4]

I recall you stating in a few posts back the stat that I brought up too -- the one about illegal immigration costing the US economy 100 billion dollar annually. How does that constitute the American economy backbone? 

 

Look, this whole thread boils down to what you think the government's role should be in the peoples' lives. For me, the government should have an extremely small role in the day to day lives on an individual. I don't think we should be providing housing for tax-paying citizens; I don't think we should be paying for an illegal alien's housing either. The government does too much as it is for the law-abiding citizens. Social programs should be cut down to a fraction of what they are atm.

 

But I guess if you don't believe in individual responsibility, you just have a different philosophy  . Sorry, but we shouldn't be legally required to fork up out tax-dollars and/or redistribute our government spending power that could be used for our children's education to pay for a nice, more hospitable hold cell. It's tough, but illegal immigrants came here with the full knowledge that the law would not welcome them (rather be encouraged and morally persuaded to give to charities and volunteer by our own volitions!). No matter how you spin it, illegal immigration is still illegal, yes - it's still a crime, and the government does not welcome you. We're starting to create a society where instead of limiting the government from our lives (like it was meant to be by the founding fathers as they created this nation), people are turning to the government and demanding that they get the money they are entitled to. Entitlement programs are BS. Your aren't entitled to a-n-y-o-n-e-'s money but your own. Get you hand out of the f**kin jar.

 

Oh please. I know you're much smarter than that. If you deported all illegal immigrants, the economy would collapse like you can't imagine. Liberal and conservative think tanks have all said that the best thing to do would be to just grant citizenship to any illegal immigrants that are in the US right now. Doing so would expand the economy. Our economy depends on illegal immigrants right now whether you like it or not. 

 

And you're right. I don't agree at all. I'd much rather pay more in taxes so that we can ensure that every citizen's basic needs are met. What kind of uncivilized society lets members die and suffer because of the greed and selfishness of the privileged? That's barbaric. I believe in the inherent dignity of mankind. Like it says in the Declaration of Independence, all people have a right to life. It doesn't say all people have a right to life unless you're poor or disabled. Classical liberalism has driven this country into the ground. The wealth gap grows larger and larger and people still condemn poor people for asking for help and allege that poor people falsely feel that they are "entitled" to money that is not theirs. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer and we think that is okay. We don't want to help those who we have injured. Money is now more important than people. That's ****ing disgusting.

 

I don't believe it's right whatsoever to shove hundreds of people in a room and have them sleep on cement. I believe in human dignity. America was supposed to be righteous, humane, just, equal, and fair. People have a right to a certain level of treatment and this falls below my threshold for what I feel is right.

 

I'm just shocked that you have no empathy for anyone who is struggling. I'm shocked you feel no moral duty to help those who need help.

[uo111 5,282]

Or you have a metabolic or hormone disorder. Or you have a disease, illness, mental disorder or even cancer and have to be on steroids or other medications that cause weight gain.

Things are rarely as simplistic as narrow minded people want to believe they are.

The amount of people that are naturally obese might be 1 in 100 million.

 

That excuse is so old. There are many reasons to be obese but to say you can't lose weight is absolutely ridiculous.

 

Water weight, thyroid problems, whatever might make you gain weight does 20 pounds in severe cases. Not 200.

[Willy Wonka 4]

The amount of people that are naturally obese might be 1 in 100 million.

 

That excuse is so old. There are many reasons to be obese but to say you can't lose weight is absolutely ridiculous.

 

Water weight, thyroid problems, whatever might make you gain weight does 20 pounds in severe cases. Not 200.

But also the amount of people that are actually 200 pounds overweight are grossly overestimated by anti-fat activists.

 

EDIT: actually no. This isn't even relevant. It's no one's place to comment on someone else's weight. Everyone who has struggled with their weight has a unique experience.

[Whispering 18,865]

The amount of people that are naturally obese might be 1 in 100 million.

That excuse is so old. There are many reasons to be obese but to say you can't lose weight is absolutely ridiculous.

Water weight, thyroid problems, whatever might make you gain weight does 20 pounds in severe cases. Not 200.

Completely and totally false...and no one said anything about water weight.

Btw, you don't have to gain 200 pounds to be categorized as obese. Depending on an individual's height, a 30 to 35 pound weight gain could take them from a normal weight straight to obese.

[lastlinefirst 1]

1.) If they really are fleeing their countries because of instability, the conditions in those photos looks MUCH better than the place they left behind. Plus, it's not like it's an unsafe place. It's totally secure, heated/cooled, plus food and water.

 

2.) The US has no responsibility in providing shelter for these people at the border. What they were trying to do was very illegal and creates MASSIVE problems domestically. Why should I, as a tax paying citizen, have to pay for the children of criminals who aren't even citizens themselves? Why can't the US gov. just keep all the criminals on the opposite side of the border where there is no shelter for them?

 

It's extremely generous that all these illegals were provided shelter at all! They could have just told them to turn around and go home!

As harsh as it sounds I agree with all of this.

[ThisGuyTony 34,860]

"Criminals"

:awkney:

[MJHolland 12,725]

Completely and totally false...and no one said anything about water weight.

Btw, you don't have to gain 200 pounds to be categorized as obese. Depending on an individual's height, a 30 to 35 pound weight gain could take them from a normal weight straight to obese.

Excuses. Eat less (smarter), get health. Don't break the law, don't sleep on a cement floor. 

 

 

I don't believe it's right whatsoever to shove hundreds of people in a room and have them sleep on cement. I believe in human dignity. America was supposed to be righteous, humane, just, equal, and fair. People have a right to a certain level of treatment and this falls below my threshold for what I feel is right.

I think a lot of things you say are insightful and smart, but this is not one of them. The government didn't shove anyone in any room. Their parents led them to that holding cell. No matter their intentions, they forced the had of the government. They can't just let them waltz right into the country.... And the other option is to send them back the way they came to fight the elements at night in the desert (they probably would have died tbh) 

 

What was the humane thing to do in this situation if you care so much about human rights? Just have each officer take a dozen back home and drive them back to Guatemala in the morning? 

[Willy Wonka 4]

Excuses. Eat less (smarter), get health. Don't break the law, don't sleep on a cement floor. 

 

I think a lot of things you say are insightful and smart, but this is not one of them. The government didn't shove anyone in any room. Their parents led them to that holding cell. No matter their intentions, they forced the had of the government. They can't just let them waltz right into the country.... And the other option is to send them back the way they came to fight the elements at night in the desert (they probably would have died tbh) 

 

What was the humane thing to do in this situation if you care so much about human rights? Just have each officer take a dozen back home and drive them back to Guatemala in the morning? 

 

The humane thing? At least provide them with a cot or type of mattress. Find alternative emergency locations to hold children so that they aren't overcrowded like this (which it sounds like they did). Like it says in the article, the officials should have seen this coming and this situation of overcrowding should not have occurred.

 

 

 

 

 

 

America should strive for much better than this. This isn't how people should be treated. This is inhumane.

[Whispering 18,865]

Excuses. Eat less (smarter), get health. Don't break the law, don't sleep on a cement floor. 

 

Disorders and illnesses are not excuses. Having to take certain medications, that cause weight gain, in order to live is not a choice.

One day Karma might catch up with you. One of these children or grandchildren of yours could have health circumstances beyond their control. I hope you don't mock them and call them lazy and fat...

[uo111 5,282]

But also the amount of people that are actually 200 pounds overweight are grossly overestimated by anti-fat activists.

 

EDIT: actually no. This isn't even relevant. It's no one's place to comment on someone else's weight. Everyone who has struggled with their weight has a unique experience.

Everyone has a unique experience in life. That doesn't make them not responsible for their own bodies.

 

Completely and totally false...and no one said anything about water weight.

Btw, you don't have to gain 200 pounds to be categorized as obese. Depending on an individual's height, a 30 to 35 pound weight gain could take them from a normal weight straight to obese.

35 pounds is a lot depending on an individuals height. 200 pound individuals are an example, the norm being less than 200 pounds overweight does not make it okay.

 

The fact of the matter is, what you look like or how you feel about the way you look like doesn't matter when it comes to how physically healthy you actually are. And most people who are not physically healthy because they are overweight, do not have a legitimate excuse to be overweight. However, I'd love to read some studies that show that most people who are overweight can't be healthy if they want to be if you come across any.

[Willy Wonka 4]

Everyone has a unique experience in life. That doesn't make them not responsible for their own bodies.

 

35 pounds is a lot depending on an individuals height. 200 pound individuals are an example, the norm being less than 200 pounds overweight does not make it okay.

 

The fact of the matter is, what you look like or how you feel about the way you look like doesn't matter when it comes to how physically healthy you actually are. And most people who are not physically healthy because they are overweight, do not have a legitimate excuse to be overweight. However, I'd love to read some studies that show that most people who are overweight can't be healthy if they want to be if you come across any.

Amen. Everyone is responsible for their own bodies. So stop worrying about the bodies of others.

 

All you should worry about is if you are happy with yourself and you are healthy.

[uo111 5,282]

Amen. Everyone is responsible for their own bodies. So stop worrying about the bodies of others.

 

All you should worry about is if you are happy with yourself and you are healthy.

Considering many people in my family and community are going to die early from heart disease and/or diabetes, it's not something I feel comfortable just ignoring it. I don't preach it but I can't bring myself to listen to excuses that don't apply and complaints that merely take knowledge (which is lacking unfortunately) and willpower (which is hard I'll admit) to overcome.

[Willy Wonka 4]

Considering many people in my family and community are going to die early from heart disease and/or diabetes, it's not something I feel comfortable just ignoring it. I don't preach it but I can't bring myself to listen to excuses that don't apply and complaints that merely take knowledge (which is lacking unfortunately) and willpower (which is hard I'll admit) to overcome.

If someone asks for your advice, then you can give it.

 

I find that a lot of people who share your perspective really don't fully grasp the emotional and psychological nature of the issue and the self-perpetuating cycle that comments like yours can provoke.