How Lady Gaga cemented herself as a legend with ARTPOP

[Bebe 17,094]

Working with these people can be admirable, but outside of the fanbase or hardcore artists, it's forgettable. 

Versace? She was the face of Versace. Many brands go through many faces. 

Richardson- you mean a man who has photographed pretty much everybody? How unique. 

R.Kelly? People hate him. Why do you think the video and song never got properly promoted for long? 

 

I would say TFM/BTW cemented her as a legend and this was a drawback outside of the fanbase. 

She'll slay again someday though.

 

She had paintings of her in the louvre. She has world famous artists creating custom pieces for her stage performances and music videos.

 

Gaga saved Versace in 2011, she made it profitable again and now she bringing Versace into a new golden era through her extensive campaigns.

Richardson did a book with Lady Gaga. He is part of the Haus of Gaga and she has basically around the clock access to the most controversial and in demand photographer of our times.

Yeah everyone hates R.Kelly and everyone thinks Xtina is a flop. That's why their collaboration to DWUW was such a cool idea.

DWUW will always be her first single that missed out on a top ten entry and didn't get a video. That will make it memorable when it was a collaboration with the likes of R.Kelly and Terry Richardson.

[Bebe 17,094]

Ok first of all I have no problem with her calling herself an artist. 

 

I have a problem with her desperation to associate herself to the word art.

That's really the problem then!

Gaga's a performance artist that deals with the subject of Fame. Her life is the performance, her life is the art.

You don't like that but this is what is going to make her a legend. This is what will make her talked about in generations because she is associating herself with, and re-creating the images of, some of the most influential artists and pop icons of our time.

 

[tokyodisko 0]

She had paintings of her in the louvre. She has world famous artists creating custom pieces for her stage performances and music videos.

 

Gaga saved Versace in 2011, she made it profitable again and now she bringing Versace into a new golden era through her extensive campaigns.

Richardson did a book with Lady Gaga. He is part of the Haus of Gaga and she has basically around the clock access to the most controversial and in demand photographer of our times.

Yeah everyone hates R.Kelly and everyone thinks Xtina is a flop. That's why their collaboration to DWUW was such a cool idea.

DWUW will always be the single that just missed out on a top ten entry and didn't get a video. That will make it memorable when it was a collaboration with the likes of R.Kelly and Terry Richardson.

How would any of this make her a legend? Memorable and admirable? Oh yes, probably, but not a legend by any stretch. 

This is all very concentrated and in five years the only people who remember will be her fans and die hard fans of art. 

Participation does not make one legendary. 

That's really the problem then!

Gaga's a performance artist that deals with the subject of Fame. Her life is the performance, her life is the art.

You don't like that but this is what is going to make her a legend. This is what will make her talked about in generations because she is associating herself with, and re-creating the images of, some of the most influential artists and pop icons of our time.

 

Yes, but they have to be widely iconic and not obscure to masses, like the examples listed. 

[Tokyo Rose 1,475]

That's really the problem then!

Gaga's a performance artist that deals with the subject of Fame. Her life is the performance, her life is the art.

You don't like that but this is what is going to make her a legend. This is what will make her talked about in generations because she is associating herself with, and re-creating the images of, some of the most influential artists and pop icons of our time.

 

 

Once again you misconstrue my words, but thank you for rehashing direct quotes from 2009 for me again.

 

I love the album "The Fame" and her Fame fragrance campaign as well as her other explorations of these themes.

 

I dedicate this interview to you, Bebe

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtTbGt0pOkc

[Bebe 17,094]

How would any of this make her a legend? Memorable and admirable? Oh yes, probably, but not a legend by any stretch. 

This is all very concentrated and in five years the only people who remember will be her fans and die hard fans of art. 

Participation does not make one legendary. 

Yes, but they have to be widely iconic and not obscure to masses, like the examples listed. 

 

This is contradictory. You think this makes her work memorable, but then you say that it is obscure and nobody knows the references

If it makes her memorable it makes her a legend. When people talk about Nathan Sawaya they will talk about his work with Lady Gaga at Hearst Castle. (Nathan Sawaya doesn't create custom pieces for most people) and people don't just film at Hearst Castle. In fact, when people mention the history of Hearst Castle Lady Gaga will come up as a piece of that history.

When people talk about Jeff Koons they will mention his work with Lady Gaga. (Jeff Koons doesn't just make statues of anybody)

 

When people talk about Terry Richardson they will mention his work with Lady Gaga. (He spends his life following Lady Gaga and she helped him kickstart his career.)

Why do people talk about Michael Jackson? Because he had such an impact on culture.

Why do people talk about Andy Warhol? ""

Why do people talk about Elvis? ""

Why do people talk about Beethoven? ""

Why do people talk about Nirvana?""

 

ect.

[Bebe 17,094]

Once again you misconstrue my words, but thank you for rehashing direct quotes from 2009 for me again.

 

I love the album "The Fame" and her Fame fragrance campaign as well as her other explorations of these themes.

 

I dedicate this interview to you, Bebe

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UtTbGt0pOkc

 

I'm not misconstruing your words. You said that you don't think these collaborations will make her legendary and you essentially said that you don't like the ARTPOP era because you find it insincere and essentially shallow. 

I would argue that these collaborations will make sure she is remembered and talked about due to her impact on culture.

I don't really care about what your favourite era is. You misunderstood the point of the thread which was to discuss whether ARTPOP will make her a legend. I argue that these collaborations have ensured her a place in pop history/art history because it is these collaborations that will be talked about for generations. IMO that makes her a legend whether you personally like ARTPOP or not.

[TheFamexXx 0]

ARTPOP will not left a mark in music history despite it's quality.

[Tokyo Rose 1,475]

I'm not misconstruing your words. You said that you don't think these collaborations will make her legendary and you essentially said that you don't like the ARTPOP era because you find it insincere and essentially shallow. 

I would argue that these collaborations will make sure she is remembered and talked about due to her impact on culture.

I don't really care about what your favourite era is. You misunderstood the point of the thread which was to discuss whether ARTPOP will make her a legend. I argue that these collaborations have ensured her a place in pop history/art history because it is these collaborations that will be talked about for generations. IMO that makes her a legend whether you personally like ARTPOP or not.

 

Strange that you never actually respond to what I say.

 

You did misconstrue my words several times by saying I dislike the subject of Fame in her work.

 

When I corrected you, you now tell me I misunderstood the point of your thread, about these collaborations leading to her being recognized as a legend. But I clearly did understand the point of the thread in my original post, which started this whole discussion between us, remember?

 

When I explained why I disagree that these collaborations make her a legend, you started with the fame subject.

 

I didn't bring the fame subject up, you did. 

Very strange, Bebe 

[Bebe 17,094]

Strange that you never actually respond to what I say.

 

You did misconstrue my words several times by saying I dislike the subject of Fame in her work.

 

When I corrected you, you now tell me I misunderstood the point of your thread, about these collaborations leading to her being recognized as a legend. But I clearly did understand the point of the thread in my original post, which started this whole discussion between us, remember?

 

When I explained why I disagree that these collaborations make her a legend, you started with the fame subject.

 

I didn't bring the fame subject up, you did. 

Very strange, Bebe 

Let's not with me misconstruing your words. When I never said you disliked the subject of Fame in her work. I said that what she is doing in ARTPOP is no different to what she has been doing throughout her career except that she is now collaborating with famous pop artists and re-creating the images associated with famous art. No different to TF, TFM and BTW when she was re-creating the imagery of modern famous musicians and celebrities.

What started our little conversation is when you said (and I will quote verbatim)

"Listing off collaborations is quite a weak way to "prove" Gaga's legend status."

"My comment was about how attaching yourself to perceived "legends" doesn't make you a legend yourself."

To which I responded by attempting to show that the whole point of Lady Gaga was the subject of Fame and how she manipulated images associated with modern day fame. Now she is just taking it one step further by manipulating images associated with pop art and classic art. Famous art. These collaborations are what has consolidated her as a legend rather than an icon because she is now associated with the history of these artworks.

 

Your comments where about how you don't think these collaborations are what is going to make her a legend, my comments was a response to why I think they will.

 

Then you started a random ass conversation about how you love the sincerity of BTW and how you don't like the music of ARTPOP if that was relevant to the discussion 

How strange Tokyo Rose

[VforVendetta 2,024]

Gaga may be making great strides in the art world, but in the music world, she's slipping.

It doesn't matter how entrenched you are in pop culture if your music isn't up to snuff.

Just because you didn't like AP doesn't mean its not good. :awkney:

[VforVendetta 2,024]

To end this whole subject. Gaga always does what she does now on ARTPOP. Her idea to work with names that represend famous art or even "commercial" pop art was an admirable one. It is definitely a + in her legacy. No it didn't make her a legend because the Era didn't stick with the public and wasn't noticable. She will return with a more successful era but we can always admire Gaga's work on AP.

[Knife 6,888]

Just because you didn't like AP doesn't mean its not good.

 

At what point in my two sentence post did I give the impression I was representing anyone's views but my own?

[Tokyo Rose 1,475]

Then you started a random ass conversation about how you love the sincerity of BTW and how you don't like the music of ARTPOP if that was relevant to the discussion 

 

That is a great example of how malicious and manipulative you have been throughout this discussion.

 

My words on Born This Way weren't random at all. In fact, you brought my feelings about Born This Way up before I even did.

 

And the whole point of Lady Gaga is not Fame. Fame is one theme of many. 

[VforVendetta 2,024]

At what point in my two sentence post did I give the impression I was representing anyone's views but my own?

The way you expressed it. :awkney:

[Bebe 17,094]

That is a great example of how malicious and manipulative you have been throughout this discussion.

 

My words on Born This Way weren't random at all. In fact, you brought my feelings about Born This Way up before I even did.

 

And the whole point of Lady Gaga is not Fame. Fame is one theme of many. 

 

I questioned whether you were familiar with her work before BTW. That isn't malicious. That was a genuine question because it seemed like you didn't get the point of her manipulating her music and imagery in a way that drew upon references from certain eras.

You brought up your feelings of BTW by saying  "I choose to associate myself with Born This Way more than her other albums for a very specific reason. I value sincerity over all else in art."

Which I also don't quite understand because she clearly manipulated her sound and her imagery during the Born This Way era in a similar way to what she is doing now.

It seems like during this conversation you have blasted the idea that Gaga will be considered legendary because of her collaborations and reinterpretations of archetypes as weak, without seeming to recognise that she built her career from exploring and reinterpreting.