Ur So Gay Will Always Prevent Katy Perry From Being A Gay Icon

[Madame Goo Goo 3,565]

She is spineless with no opinions or values of her own. If it became en vogue to be homophobic, you best believe she would become homophobic.

[Madame Goo Goo 3,565]

1 hour ago, Didymus said:

 

She's been very wishy washy about it to the point of even her fans not being able to keep up with her sexual identity. That's her own business but she did intentionally seek out a gay audience in her early days and even worked with a dedicated company to make sure she had a gay audience that could launch her into stardom. This is documented and not a secret, nor is it unique.

She's just part of an industry that knows gay people make money, period. That has little to do with her personally but there's a big difference between that industry situation and, say, Madonna who was willingly risking her career to end by supporting gay rights in the middle of the AIDS crisis. Madonna is a gay icon for that reason and no other (good) reason.

And, yes, now that Gaga is aiming to be a Hollywood staple, she gets less vocal, surprise. Is that an improvement or her strategically choosing when to be an ally and when not? She shocked many of us by deliberately evading a question about her sexual identity (in the context of representation) as part of her promo run for House of Gucci and, instead, explicitly identifying as a mere "supporter" of the LGBT community. That was wild tbh, as that interviewer was clearly acknowledging her as being a queer nominated person and she basically threw it back in their face.

And then we have Justin Tranter saying plainly what some of us have been thinking for years: she just doesn't really care. That's fine with me. I don't expect straight or vaguely bi people to care about gay rights. But then maybe it's also time we stop categorizing these "supporters" as gay icons.

Name one example of Gaga claiming to be anything other than bisexual please. 

[Bonkers 27,021]

17 minutes ago, Madame Goo Goo said:

Name one example of Gaga claiming to be anything other than bisexual please. 

Maybe I took your question too literally 

[NATAH 35,904]

1 hour ago, Didymus said:

It's not one question. She's been making puzzling statements for years and has raised this question multiple times, most infamously on Drag Race where she again explicitly implied she is not part of the LGBT community. Her only unambiguous statement about being bisexual was in 2013, to Attitude, but in that same interview she also said she is not a "gay icon" and would prefer it if people called her a "gay supporter".

Also, I literally wrote in my post that her sexual identity is her own business and we shouldn't care about that. My point was about whether or not we've moved on from calling female pop stars "gay icons" when we actually have out and proud queer people who deserve that title. People responded to me saying "she is out and proud queer" and all I meant to say was she's clearly not comfortable with people addressing her like one.

If she is clearly distancing herself from being called a gay icon, then maybe let's not call her that? Anyway, I wasn't meaning to make a big statement. Back to Katy's song being hateful pls.

@NATAH @palma @Real Panda

no, on drag race she said she's not a "gay woman" which is true. she's not homosexual, she's bisexual

[ProfessionalClown 10,195]

it’s literally one of her best songs lmao it’s so iconic and campy and just out of nowhere for a first single. It’s fun 

[phantasmas 9,118]

3 hours ago, altern8version said:

From time to time I go back to the song to try and enjoy it in a silly way, but I just can't get over that "I hope you hang yourself" opening line. Not good.

if it were a metal song, that line would kinda slay 

[RAMROD 99,815]

She will always serving non genuine and the vibes are off since day one wbk

[Didymus 33,277]

23 minutes ago, NATAH said:

no, on drag race she said she's not a "gay woman" which is true. she's not homosexual, she's bisexual

I am referring to this part:

"[it's] that touchy sort of subject where -- can you stand up for people that you are not necessarily fully part of that community in a way that you can understand what you all go through?"

Yes, we can obvi interpret that as her saying bisexual people aren't "fully" part of the community (that would be wrong) but my question is: why does she say this at all? It's like the Oscars thing. An interviewer calls you a queer person nominated for an Oscar. Great. Why do you have to somehow respond to that by saying "Well, I am actually not representing queer people."

She seems to make these statements to somehow protect herself from unproblematically identifying as being part of the LGBT community. That is fine with me. It's just interesting. From her earliest time saying she's bi she has also immediately included the (unnecessary) statement that though she is attracted to women, she does not fall in love with women. So imo fans are wrong when they say Gaga is not ambiguous about her sexual identity. She is. She always follows up her "coming out" with something else that seems to "soften the blow". Me saying that is not trying to question or erase her identity. It's just me paying attention to what she's saying and listening.

She doesn't want to be called a gay icon, period. Clearly that has something to do with the statements I referenced above. That is all.

[Didymus 33,277]

1 hour ago, Madame Goo Goo said:

Name one example of Gaga claiming to be anything other than bisexual please. 

"I like girls... sometimes"

Remember that controversy? (If you don't, she said at a pride rally of all places that some people might not include her as part of the LGBT community and implied that that was a legitimate stance she'd respect, as she wouldn't do or say anything to downplay the suffering "real" LGBT members have endured).

Obvi that was not her saying she's straight. But, once again, she distanced herself from identifying as part of the LGBT community, which clearly includes bisexuals. Some say her uncertainty proves bi people feel excluded, some said she actually contributes to bi erasure by questioning her own inclusion.

I don't fall into either camp, as I think both camps make a good point. But what I don't understand is that Gaga keeps somehow repeating the same stance: I like girls but I would never say I am part of the LGBT community, I'd prefer if you addressed me as a "supporter" (aka an ally). I'm kind of tired of people being so offended when someone like me points out that this is rather ambiguous. It is. And that's not me questioning anything about her. I don't care if she's straight or bi. I'm just wondering why she herself is uncomfortable being addressed as bi.

Edited 4 hours ago by Didymus

[WhiteWitch 690]

Honestly I’m sick of this talking point and as a queer person I love that and Billie’s “Wish you were gay”. The hate around these songs is victimization mentality and misses the point of the songs. 

[Guillaume Hamon 5,678]

4 hours ago, Just A Holy Fool said:

she ultimately has always been a panderer to the gay community with her music. Case in point, inserting a gay kiss in the Woman’s World music video, then editing it out in the so called “modesty edit”

Just this part says it all about her.

Phony. Traitor...

Should refund these gays with poor taste in music who paid for at least one of her villas going to her Nickelodeon-like/ giant toilet-including shows.

Edited 4 hours ago by Guillaume Hamon

[LaLa 18,737]

14 minutes ago, Didymus said:

She seems to make these statements to somehow protect herself from unproblematically identifying as being part of the LGBT community. That is fine with me. It's just interesting. From her earliest time saying she's bi she has also immediately included the (unnecessary) statement that though she is attracted to women, she does not fall in love with women. So imo fans are wrong when they say Gaga is not ambiguous about her sexual identity. She is. She always follows up her "coming out" with something else that seems to "soften the blow". Me saying that is not trying to question or erase her identity. It's just me paying attention to what she's saying and listening.

I'm a bi woman who's been married to a man for over 10 years. I completely understand why Gaga talks about her bisexuality the way she does. It's very familiar to me. 

I haven't been with a woman since my early 20s. I'm sure there are people in my life who think of my having a girlfriend as a "phase." I don't really talk about my sexuality, and I'm very very aware that my experiences are very different than those of people in queer relationships. 

I think Gaga, who's never publically dated a woman, is just very wary of seeming like she's using her sexuality for clout and is acknowledging that as someone who has only publically dated men, she doesn't face the same issues as gay people. 

We do feel slightly outside the community, for sure, and it's tricky (and sometime painful) to talk about. 

[Edonis 27,477]

she was never a gay icon to begin with. that phrase gets thrown around too much. almost all successful pop stars (or at least ones that used to be successful) have a sizable gay audience. that doesn't make them a gay icon. 

 

[RenegAde 16,676]

This is like someone discrediting everything Gaga stands for because of DWYW

Yall need to let Katy breathe forreal. theres like 5 threads everyday about her saying exactly the same thing in different ways . The song flopped in every way possible, you won. Can we all move on now

[Didymus 33,277]

1 hour ago, LaLa said:

I'm a bi woman who's been married to a man for over 10 years. I completely understand why Gaga talks about her bisexuality the way she does. It's very familiar to me. 

I haven't been with a woman since my early 20s. I'm sure there are people in my life who think of my having a girlfriend as a "phase." I don't really talk about my sexuality, and I'm very very aware that my experiences are very different than those of people in queer relationships. 

I think Gaga, who's never publically dated a woman, is just very wary of seeming like she's using her sexuality for clout and is acknowledging that as someone who has only publically dated men, she doesn't face the same issues as gay people. 

We do feel slightly outside the community, for sure, and it's tricky (and sometime painful) to talk about. 

Thanks for sharing This makes a lot of sense.

Part of me thinks that's sad because this feeling of alienation and somehow not checking the marks is a big part of the "LGBT experience", so I also understand the people who argue that Gaga's way of addressing this is actually counter-productive, even if it comes from a good place.

In truth we are not a community with set boundaries. We exist by virtue of an imaginary standard. In truth there are so many straight identifying people, even, who would (and should imo) technically belong to our LGBT "community". 100% straight people are an extreme minority, scientifically speaking. 100% gay people are too, research shows. Sometimes I wonder if we as queer people need to be a lot more non-dual about it so everyone feels like they can belong.