The Development of ARTPOP

[gagzus 13,654]

1 hour ago, Italian said:

Does this mean that Jewels N Drugs was not her idea/vision

I think it was to a degree, I think she made the best of a bad situation (being told she needed at least one rap song since it was big) 

[seashellplay 512]

14 hours ago, dancewithnobody said:

As for me, it always seemed that ARTPOP had at least 3 different concepts.

The first one was "dead blonde", and Princess Die was the main song of that concept. Back then, she put on lots of vintage clothes in 2012, and then she dyed her hair that literally meant "dead blonde". 
Idk but I feel like it could be one of Gaga's ideas that blondes didn't have happiness and suffer such as Diana, Marilyn, Grace Kelly.  Besides, it was quite logical because ARTPOP = pop-art vice versa and it was a significant part of all the retro culture. 

The second one was connected with future and technologies. I guess she changed musical direction of the album very much after working with Madeon and Zedd. It was the time when she started wearing a bright green wig and showed us the glowing wig. That concept became a part of the final concept more or less. 

The third one is what we consequently have. Obviously, if she didn't have the trauma, ARTPOP would've been released much earlier and such songs as DWUW and Dope wouldn't have happened, but we have what we have. 

* it's just my thoughts from the prospect of an old fan * 

The thing is, I think all of these concepts were interlinked into a reversal of Warhol. It was evident she was striving to do the opposite of what pop-art had achieved. Instead of celebrating popular culture through an art medium, she chose to celebrate art culture through a pop medium (pop music essentially, utilizing her fame as a vehicle to educate the masses) 

The blonde-icon has always been the muse of pop-art, due to the fact it is a significant component in popular culture, it is the idea of beauty (blonde's have more fun) - it celebrates the demise of the blonde celebrity and their declining influence in pop-culture. Art-pop strove to liberate the 'dead-blonde', to re-situate the icon (the blonde celebrity) back into the artist's hands, the literal opposite of what pop-art had been doing, embracing commercialism for the sake of aesthetic.

The concept of ARTPOP would be executed through a.) visuals/some form of film, b.) the actual commercial record, and lastly, c.) technology (through the ARTPOP app) 

I don't believe much of the musical direction changed once Madeon and Zedd joined. They had always (for the most part) been heavy contributors to the project. The fundamentals of the project had always been DJ White Shadow and Gaga, but Madeon and Zedd still made significant contributions in the reverse-warholian revolution. The green hair was just an ode to the party-culture and prominence of Marijuana in Amsterdam. 

If I remember correctly, MJH was actually in development since 2012, particularly September of 2012 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Born_This_Way_Ball tour dates confirm she was performing in Amsterdam in September, and she had played a character coincidentally named 'Mary Jane Holland'. Venus had been completed in later 2013, safe to assume July/August 2013. Gypsy has elements of Born This Way, so it is safe to assume it was in production in mid-2012, and it is a shame it had never been separately released.

G.U.Y. had been in production ever since early 2012, as she had said several times a track named 'Go Under You' had been in development. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Born_This_Way_Ball also confirms that Gaga was in Thailand in May of 2012, and iirc, Gaga said her and Zedd 'were in Thailand making the song' (Donatella). To add on, she literally tweeted "I just landed in Bangkok baby! Ready for 50,000 screaming Thai monsters. I wanna get lost in a lady market and buy fake Rolex.", an absolut rich-bxtch tweet. Aura wasn't entirely produced by Zedd, for its demo was originally crafted by the famous narcissists, Infected Mushroom, though he handled some parts of it (mixing iirc). For the lovely opener: On October 29th, 2012, Gaga tweeted, "Been listening to **rq* all day". It is safe to assume this meant 'Burqa', which serves as confirmation the track was in development sometime in mid-2012. 

I know Dope is one of the younger tracks, but DWUW's history is so ambiguous and mysterious, we know it was originally built off of some audio Martin Bresso made, and Gaga and DJWS would later edit it and craft it into an RnB-electro track. I think it is safe to conjecture the track was finished written during October 2012, because she said she 'finished the track while on a plane to Milan', and according to the Born This Way Ball dates, she was scheduled to go to Milan in October 2012. 

 

[JustJames 669]

I have no idea how credible the information is regarding potential EP releases during the timeframe, but I think this would have been a great idea -- as well as, or in addition to, a true greatest hits era, a collaborations mini-era, etc. I think that the increasingly extended timeframe should have been a major red flag for anyone familiar with Gaga's way of working; there was NO WAY an album started in late 2011 would be cohesive when finally released in late 2013. The final LP, even if you don't skip a single track, is still basically impossible to make sense of when you ask "what should have been the 4-5 singles planned, and what story/theme and visuals would link them consistently from start to finish in a way that would elevate Lady Gaga of BTW?"

What I'll never understand is how an artist that is so smart and so self-aware as to realize that the cycle of fame inevitably includes a period of "flop" followed by either total irrelevance or a resurgence, has always been so unable or unwilling to learn from the mistakes made during each of her eras. I love the entire album but in my mind, Lady Seashell Bikini / Aphrodite was/shoud have been THE look for the era. But, I can't think of a single way to introduce the GP to that character and carry it into successful singles 4-5. The artRAVE is AMAZING; this persona is so camp, so creative, and fits so well into the beautiful melodic explosiveness of the tour, but how could this ever translate to radio or the GP? Maybe it was never meant to?

I *want* to think that after Applause, the only truly viable single, introduced this character at the end of the video, a release of: Venus > GUY > MANiCURE > Sexxx Dreams > Gypsy could have woken Aphrodite in through the themes of sex and love, but ALL of these songs were going to be floppable when it comes ot radio/GP. Venus' verses and bridge would have never been given the time to catch on and its humor would have been lost. Sexxx Dreams' and Gypsy's titles alone were going to be problematic, and that assumes the oveproduction of Gypsy woudn't have rendered it outdated even before its release. 

Even if those singles were selected from the start, we'd have lost what should have been a much more prominent theme which was found in Applause and DWUW at least, as well as the MANiCURE demo ("I QUIT!"), Aura ("I killed my former"), ARTPOP ("Music not the bling"), and other cut tracks of killing the muse/persona for the art/music. But, DWUW in its final form was a ticking bomb because of its collaborators, Applause's message was pretty much lost and is seen as more narcissistic than a cry for help, Aura was a non-starter despite its gorgeous chorus, and the demos/cut tracks left this overall message extremely weak in the final LP. 

In the break between eras, "Aura ft. Beyonce" with more relatable intro/verses/bridge with the amazing chorus and Telephone conclusion MV could have slayed and kept GP interest and sustained hype, while cementing a direction and theme for ARTPOP. And, a light version of the app - assuming the problems with it would have happened regardless - would have allowed for songs like DWUW to be released between singles to promote the other themes of the album and help bring art to the pop. She could have released alternative productions for songs like Gypsy before their release to radio, given fan favs like Sexxx Dreams a full single treatment online without risking a public failure with a radio blackout, and left the album singles at Applause, reworked Venus, MANiCURE, and Gypsy because "sometimes the simplest move is right." ARTPOP could have been just our public side, and the melodies and color palettes we helped choose via the app could have rescued it and profitted us. Idk!

TL;DR VERSION:

BTW's backlash, really, could have easily been the 'valley' between two peaks within her career had she learned from its failures. It should have been a mega sucess and maybe it was. It's all about perception, though, and had ARTPOP truly delivered upon release, the narrative of her needing it in order to find motivation for a reinvention, etc., etc. would have never been needed and thus never formed. 

[JINNOCIDE 3,692]

On 12/15/2019 at 9:22 AM, gagzus said:

Ok, long read ahead so be warned idk how to put a spoiler on mobile so RIP this thread and bandwidth.

[...].

Nice read. Do you have any information about Troy leaving her management having something to do with her not pushing the app forward? I always had this theory that things planned to go along the era (a video for each song, the app, the second EP, etc) were tied to Troy, and when he left, she couldn't release them because of legal issues.

[gagzus 13,654]

1 hour ago, JINNOCIDE said:

Nice read. Do you have any information about Troy leaving her management having something to do with her not pushing the app forward? I always had this theory that things planned to go along the era (a video for each song, the app, the second EP, etc) were tied to Troy, and when he left, she couldn't release them because of legal issues.

I think you kinda answered your own question. Legally it seems like that’s why, she probably sued him BTS for selling her company behind her back (I think he sold Haus Labs and that’s why she took so long to release new stuff and forgot about her perfumes, because she was letting it die to buy the licence back off Coty hence why the logo is different) and they settled out of court under the condition she give up all her side of the businesses they’d invested in. That’s just my thought tho

[gagzus 13,654]

20 hours ago, reversewarhol said:

Where did you get this information?

It’s a combination of my own speculation and piecing together information from around the time when everything happened. We knew for example after MTN failed to break the top 20 they cancelled HML as the final single and wanted her to move swiftly on. She tweeted about meeting with her label back in 2012 and even gave us an official Partynauseous release date (September 9th I believe it was) and she had a meeting with her label 4 days before that, then when the date came and went she tweeted out about it not getting released due to creative differences. Since PN was for Gaga and BDKMV was for Kendrick it can be assumed PN was the original lead single from an EP or album. An EP seems more likely.

[Spock 20,290]

On 12/15/2019 at 7:59 AM, BARCODE said:

Does anyone remember how pissed off monsters were at that girl for saying "GAGA LISTEN TO MY CD" lmaooooo. That girl was a running joke all of 2013 lmao

even worse was the I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR NINEEEE HOURSSSS PLEASEE!!@!@!1111 girl lmao 

[seashellplay 512]

On 12/16/2019 at 11:18 AM, JustJames said:

I have no idea how credible the information is regarding potential EP releases during the timeframe, but I think this would have been a great idea -- as well as, or in addition to, a true greatest hits era, a collaborations mini-era, etc. I think that the increasingly extended timeframe should have been a major red flag for anyone familiar with Gaga's way of working; there was NO WAY an album started in late 2011 would be cohesive when finally released in late 2013. The final LP, even if you don't skip a single track, is still basically impossible to make sense of when you ask "what should have been the 4-5 singles planned, and what story/theme and visuals would link them consistently from start to finish in a way that would elevate Lady Gaga of BTW?"

What I'll never understand is how an artist that is so smart and so self-aware as to realize that the cycle of fame inevitably includes a period of "flop" followed by either total irrelevance or a resurgence, has always been so unable or unwilling to learn from the mistakes made during each of her eras. I love the entire album but in my mind, Lady Seashell Bikini / Aphrodite was/shoud have been THE look for the era. But, I can't think of a single way to introduce the GP to that character and carry it into successful singles 4-5. The artRAVE is AMAZING; this persona is so camp, so creative, and fits so well into the beautiful melodic explosiveness of the tour, but how could this ever translate to radio or the GP? Maybe it was never meant to?

I *want* to think that after Applause, the only truly viable single, introduced this character at the end of the video, a release of: Venus > GUY > MANiCURE > Sexxx Dreams > Gypsy could have woken Aphrodite in through the themes of sex and love, but ALL of these songs were going to be floppable when it comes ot radio/GP. Venus' verses and bridge would have never been given the time to catch on and its humor would have been lost. Sexxx Dreams' and Gypsy's titles alone were going to be problematic, and that assumes the oveproduction of Gypsy woudn't have rendered it outdated even before its release. 

Even if those singles were selected from the start, we'd have lost what should have been a much more prominent theme which was found in Applause and DWUW at least, as well as the MANiCURE demo ("I QUIT!"), Aura ("I killed my former"), ARTPOP ("Music not the bling"), and other cut tracks of killing the muse/persona for the art/music. But, DWUW in its final form was a ticking bomb because of its collaborators, Applause's message was pretty much lost and is seen as more narcissistic than a cry for help, Aura was a non-starter despite its gorgeous chorus, and the demos/cut tracks left this overall message extremely weak in the final LP. 

In the break between eras, "Aura ft. Beyonce" with more relatable intro/verses/bridge with the amazing chorus and Telephone conclusion MV could have slayed and kept GP interest and sustained hype, while cementing a direction and theme for ARTPOP. And, a light version of the app - assuming the problems with it would have happened regardless - would have allowed for songs like DWUW to be released between singles to promote the other themes of the album and help bring art to the pop. She could have released alternative productions for songs like Gypsy before their release to radio, given fan favs like Sexxx Dreams a full single treatment online without risking a public failure with a radio blackout, and left the album singles at Applause, reworked Venus, MANiCURE, and Gypsy because "sometimes the simplest move is right." ARTPOP could have been just our public side, and the melodies and color palettes we helped choose via the app could have rescued it and profitted us. Idk!

TL;DR VERSION:

BTW's backlash, really, could have easily been the 'valley' between two peaks within her career had she learned from its failures. It should have been a mega sucess and maybe it was. It's all about perception, though, and had ARTPOP truly delivered upon release, the narrative of her needing it in order to find motivation for a reinvention, etc., etc. would have never been needed and thus never formed. 

You have such an interesting answer! 

During the idea of '2 eps', I feel like she lacked a defined vision as to what ARTPOP actually was, and really wasn't definite on what would actually occur. She said BTW was her peak before its release, and it really felt as if she had 'done it all'. The concept of 2 EPs, one featuring experimental tracks (the 'Art' portion), and the other featuring more commercial content (the 'Pop' portion), would divide art-culture and pop-culture, contradicting the vision she had in mind (the concept was likely finalized in mid-2012, she said in May the project was taking 'definite form'.) The EP format could work if the experimental content was blended with the 'commercial' content, I suppose, and it wasn't so 'x goes to x ep, y goes to y ep'.

It was evidently some multimedia project involving art culture/celebrity demise in the beginning, a literal 'evolved' The Fame Monster, but everything is 'flourishing', starkly contrasting from the 'dead, decaying' visuals from TFM. The black and white nature dissipates and its replaced by color and brightness. She at first likely named it POPART, but then found ARTPOP to roll off the tongue better or something.

Once she came to the realization of this whole 'ARTPOP' philosophy, the reverse of POPART, (I'm assuming this again, sort of came into fruition during May of 2012.), everything kind of changed. 

She tweeted so much about the project during 2012, and it is safe to assume she expected the first single to drop sometime during early 2013, I think April-May. She had no idea about the BTWB cancellation dates/surgery . They had issues picking out the lead single, until interscope execs preferred applause, and she probably wanted Aura/Sexxx Dreams/some other track, to be a lead single. The concept/what singles would be released honestly kept changing so rapidly, one time she loved how Applause was the lead, another time she wished Aura was the lead. (In my opinion, Applause is the most lead-single worthy track, and the only non chaotic thing that occurred during the era/survived it. It embodies the record perfectly, the production summarizes the record, the lyrics are 'arguably repetitive', but that is the charm.) 

I think her increase confidence in the industry from BTW kind of made her naive as to what would happen. I think Applause was horribly promoted, and had the potential to reach #1; however she decided to play Dope at the youtube music awards, and it was released when Roar was. DWUW could've reached #8-9 with a proper music video. 

Her idea of an album cycle would likely follow: 

Burqa - Release sometime in April 2013

Sexxx Dreams -  Release during June 2013

ARTPOP - Release during August 2013 (Album release occurs) 

MANiCURE - Release during October 2013

Venus - Release during February 2014

I adore all of these tracks, except for MANiCURE, but I find these singles to be kind of be depressing because Burqa had always been the 'bizarre' track and it really didn't communicate anything for ARTPOP, it was kind of just an ode to the fact no one understood her 'behind the strange outfits', at least at face-value. The GP would have virtually no idea what she was saying, the track would be considered to have 'poor production', even the producers (Infected Mushroom) said something about the vocals being 'horrible' over the melodies, but then again I still like Aura, and am happy it is at Enigma. The GP really weren't concerned about the 'Paparazzi' trilogy completion because the majority probably didn't understand the link between the Paparazzi and Telephone. 

Sexxx Dreams is self-explanatory I feel. ARTPOP is my favorite Gaga track of all time; however, I think it would do poorly on the charts. The lyrics were widely considered to be pretentious and nonsensical, even though they're really not. MANiCURE has some potential, due to the trap elements, and Venus has been released before, and didn't do so shabby. 

I suppose an ideal 'single' mixing what she wanted and what the execs wanted would be (if she hadn't broken her hip): - the only really viable singles off of ARTPOP were Applause, DWUW, and Gypsy, but Gypsy has no relevance to the ARTPOP concept whatsoever

Applause - May 2013 - Celebration of the performing arts and her relation to public.

Venus and Gypsy Promotional - June 2013 - Birth of Venus.

DWUW - August 2013 - Liberation of the blonde icon w/ video and no R.Kelly

MANiCURE - October 2013 - Puns

G.U.Y. - February 2014 - Liberation of the blonde icon act ii

Aura - May 2014 - Final single, ode to paparazzi being the final single.

mine would be Applause - (some form of venus promo) - DWUW - G.U.Y. - Gypsy - Aura 

[guigomartins 10]

ARTPOP should have been cancelled the moment she broke her hip. New concept, new songs, new artistic direction. Maybe recycle some songs and that's it. Change everyting. I can bet the first single was supposed to be released in the BTWBall final dates, similar to what happened to Born This Way song and the Monster Ball. And even in that time the songs were already "too old", cause she was totally lost and Interscope didn't stop to push her to what they wanted. The album was a mistake from the start, and after the injury and being postponed it just got unsustainable

[seashellplay 512]

16 hours ago, guigomartins said:

ARTPOP should have been cancelled the moment she broke her hip. New concept, new songs, new artistic direction. Maybe recycle some songs and that's it. Change everything. I can bet the first single was supposed to be released in the BTWBall final dates, similar to what happened to Born This Way song and the Monster Ball. And even in that time the songs were already "too old", cause she was totally lost and Interscope didn't stop to push her to what they wanted. The album was a mistake from the start, and after the injury and being postponed it just got unsustainable

I think they expected a lead single was to be release in April/May, not Feb/March. The project hadn't been fully completed until like, August/September 2013, and even if she had not broken her hip, Applause likely wouldn't have been completed until approximately April. Plus, the idea of her kind of just, going on tour, and then dropping a single, is frustrating in the sense she's slowly deteriorating in the process.

I don't think ARTPOP should've been cancelled at all. I don't believe the concept of music 'dating' is valid, due to the fact these 'kitsch' music movements are eventually rehashed. I think the album would've done better, if it had an earlier release date. Despite this dreamy solution, this is absolutely unrealistic, due to the hip-breaking, and just her hectic schedule of 'dropping single - tour - music video - interviews - drop single - drop album' and whatnot, it is exhausting and the 'failure' or whatever that means of the record was inevitable

It is hard thinking of a concept differing from ARTPOP for her fourth album, because it definitely felt as if she had done everything. She did the commentary on fame, with the more appealing compared to the decayed. She had done the fantasy/rebellion blended with identity record, and then there was ARTPOP, the 'filosawphicawl album', seemingly the manifesto of all of her artistry and work. My bet is that LG6 is likely going to end up becoming some evolved Born This Way, with elements of Joanne/her earlier work, and the 'polished' visual concept of ARTPOP. 

[Ziggy 10,393]

25 minutes ago, seashellplay said:

I think they expected a lead single was to be release in April/May, not Feb/March. The project hadn't been fully completed until like, August/September 2013, and even if she had not broken her hip, Applause likely wouldn't have been completed until approximately April. Plus, the idea of her kind of just, going on tour, and then dropping a single, is frustrating in the sense she's slowly deteriorating in the process.

I don't think ARTPOP should've been cancelled at all. I don't believe the concept of music 'dating' is valid, due to the fact these 'kitsch' music movements are eventually rehashed. I think the album would've done better, if it had an earlier release date. Despite this dreamy solution, this is absolutely unrealistic, due to the hip-breaking, and just her hectic schedule of 'dropping single - tour - music video - interviews - drop single - drop album' and whatnot, it is exhausting and the 'failure' or whatever that means of the record was inevitable

It is hard thinking of a concept differing from ARTPOP for her fourth album, because it definitely felt as if she had done everything. She did the commentary on fame, with the more appealing compared to the decayed. She had done the fantasy/rebellion blended with identity record, and then there was ARTPOP, the 'filosawphicawl album', seemingly the manifesto of all of her artistry and work. My bet is that LG6 is likely going to end up becoming some evolved Born This Way, with elements of Joanne/her earlier work, and the 'polished' visual concept of ARTPOP. 

I concur. Tbh  after Joanne it's hard to figure what she'll do next and i think she herself was in a similar boat (at least conceptually). When you're someone who runs full speed to make seismic impact with each album, you run out of themes that you can explore eventually lol

[Ziggy 10,393]

On 12/15/2019 at 6:22 AM, gagzus said:

Ok, long read ahead so be warned idk how to put a spoiler on mobile so RIP this thread and bandwidth.

———

The album started production in late 2011 around the time of Marry The Night being a single. But she already had the next album title in mind by the release of BTW in May 2011. Gaga started working with Zedd in 2012 when he was her opening act for the BTWB writing and recording with him and Paul on the road, Fernando was also working with her on a few songs (Partynauseous being one eventually) and Madeon came into the fold in autumn 2012 presumably to replace Fernando, around this time Zedd became the main producer on her record for a time, with Paul replacing him in 2013 as the main producer when they had to redo most of the album during her downtime. She had two major meetings with Interscope in 2012, I’m not sure of the first one but the second one was in September. Then she had a major meeting with them in 2013 again after she had fully recovered and went out into public view again.

(Please remember some of things I’m saying from here are based on me putting information together and some we know for definite or some I have heard from knowing people who met her and asked stuff backstage at the BTWB in the UK, so take what I say lightly and not purely factual)

By the time the September meeting was done she had recorded ARTPOP, G.U.Y., MANiCURE, Sex Dreams, two versions of PARTYNAUSEOUS, part of Bitch Don’t Kill My Vibe, probably other songs we’ve never heard and other demos too for Ratchet and Red Flame existed. September was supposed to be a finalising meeting because Interscope wanted her to release an EP ASAP instead of an album just to keep her name out there and release ARTPOP in 2 EPs so she could get streams and keep herself in the charts (an idea she later expanded on but never completed) during the last meeting in September she was supposed to turn in an EP but didn’t have one ready so they extended her time frame and she was to drop at least a single by April 2013 with a summer 2013 release for an album instead of an EP. In this meeting her collaboration plans with Azealia and Kendrick fell through because they wanted her to distance herself from Azealia’s bad image and Kendrick’s team wanted her to make PN the lead off her album and make it solely hip-hop because her gay fanbase and dance music wasn’t good for Kendrick’s image (as he was just starting to get major notice in the hip-hop world at the time), she wouldn’t compromise and Kendrick’s team wouldn’t give her more time to perfect her part of BDKMV so the collabs were all shelved. Then obviously by April she had had her hip injury and pushed everything back to recover.

Interscope pushed hard for her to do some hip-hop/rap collabs because they were gaining traction on radio at the time (and basically ruled airplay for the majority of the 2010s in the end tbh) so they had setup the collabs for her, later they still wanted a collab with rappers even more as rap became bigger in 2013 and that’s when she collabed on Jewels & Drugs.

In terms of songs the majority of the songs from the final cut of the album were written and recorded between August 2012 - October 2013. Mary Jane Holland was written in September/October with Aura, Do What U Want was written and mostly finished in Nov/Dec 2012 and R Kelly was added in early 2013, Donatella was written on a plane to Thailand and had a demo recorded over email with Zedd in October/November (the day after she was in Italy to see Donatella and was throwing flowers from her chateau balcony she wrote it).  MANiCURE, Sex Dreams, G.U.Y. and her more happy/fun/sexual tracks were recorded in 2012 mostly when she was happy, high and unbothered. sadder and darker songs like Swine, Dope, Gypsy (in context not sonically) were made when she was either touring in pain and after her hip broke. Applause had a concept by late 2012 BEFORE her hip injury, conceptualised when she was in the UK for the tour (as the leaked concept demo proves, with her talking to Helen in the background, and a friend of mine who met her backstage at the BTWB said that she said she was making a song that would include her fans on the record (presumably the cheering and screaming recorded at the show- we can assume the cheering sample in the song is from the O2 Arena in the UK, but obviously at the time they didn’t know what she meant).

Conceptually the album went through many changes that Interscope stunted her from doing, the original concept was the decay of the blonde superstar as the media- and the world turned against her slowly. Interscope felt the concept was too dark with songs like Princess Die being about suicide and other dark themes weren’t appropriate. Around this time we can assume they had a talk where they told her “we just want you to be pretty and make pop music” and thus the second concept started; Disney Princess in a rave, which was stunted because 1) Disney is a brand so copyright concept issues and 2) she was associating a brand with raves, drugs and sex which we can assume Disney wouldn’t have taken lightly had she went ahead with it. So the deeper concept about making the art come first and making technology, fashion and art become one with her music. Where the music was pop with art imagery, and her educating people through her medium about art. And we know how this went down. We can assume the disney princess concept was around till early 2013 when she was probably told she couldn’t do it because brand image association. 

The first few songs she made that ended up on the album were ARTPOP, G.U.Y., MANiCURE and Sex Dreams. With Dope and Venus being two of the last ones. Hip-Hop collabs were pushed by Interscope and as we now know her management/label had her voice heavily filtered, layered and auto tuned on the final outcomes without her knowledge so they could get the album out as fast as possible. And she basically said that fame went to her head during this time and after the era was a disaster behind the scenes, Tony came to her rescue.

Would also like to add that Venus was very clearly inspired by the Applause era and was likely both written and produced then (which would make sense given how relatively unpolished the song is--to its strength, I might add).

[seashellplay 512]

1 hour ago, Ziggy said:

Would also like to add that Venus was very clearly inspired by the Applause era and was likely both written and produced then (which would make sense given how relatively unpolished the song is--to its strength, I might add).

THIS. 

Iirc, Venus was the last track to be completed on ARTPOP. After Gaga wanted Aura as the lead single, execs essentially came to the conclusion Gaga was insane - later to no longer really wanted any form of opinion/insight from her. They had no idea what the future really held for ARTPOP, though imo the single choices were best, especially for the situation they had been in. 

Interscope and Gaga regularly disputed, in terms of funding and what singles would be released.

a.) Gypsy:  Track would be considered for release, and Gaga would agree; however, nothing would ever happen. 

b.) G.U.Y.: Gaga would convince executives why the track deserved to be a single, and it would work, which was very rare. 

c.) Sexxx Dreams/MANiCURE/Aura/Swine: Gaga would suggest these tracks to have separate releases, to shortly be ignored.

Sort of expanding more on the 'cluelessness' and 'mystery' of ARTPOP, it is safe to assume Gaga wanted Venus to receive a separate released. This would be executed, as Interscope had no faith in the album content, and were kind of like 'The hell with it, a Lady Gaga album needs more than 2 singles, so whatever.' They knew DWUW was a quality track; however, they believed the ElectroRnB quality of the track to be to controversial, so DWUW was kept as a promotional single. A general audience might not be accustomed to that kind of sound coming from Gaga - they want her to sing in French, they want her to have a trance instrumental and play the femme fetale. Interscope was later proven wrong, and DWUW would earn a near top 10, even though it had no music video or genuine promotion. 

-

1 hour ago, Ziggy said:

MANiCURE, Sex Dreams, G.U.Y. and her more happy/fun/sexual tracks were recorded in 2012 mostly when she was happy, high and unbothered.

I don't know why,but this is so horrifying to me. 

Especially during later 2012, when she was sort of just rotting away: getting the munchies and getting a nice, juicy big mac, writing content about indulgence, performing and seemingly being so powerful, and smoking up a storm. This whole pre-ARTPOP era was kind of just... 'sex n drugs make me so sos so sos so happy' hence tracks like MJH, Donatella, Jewels n' Drugs, MANiCURE (the original lyrics), Sexxx Dreams, and G.U.Y., like you said. And of course, she had been unaware of what was going on in her hip. After February 2013, everything seemed to be gradually crumbling. It wasn't DEFINITE the ARTPOP was going to be messier than her previous efforts, but by the time of Summer 2013 the whole dream sort of shimmered away.

1 hour ago, Ziggy said:

sadder and darker songs like Swine, Dope, Gypsy (in context not sonically) were made when she was either touring in pain and after her hip broke

Safe to assume tracks like these came into fruition yeah, during mid 2013. Essentially mediums for her rage. Especially here, the concept of ART fueling POP shimmered away - ARTPOP was becoming more of medium for her anger and sadness. Gypsy almost feels as if it is a song she wrote in an attempt to 'move on from everything'. Obviously she is comparing herself to a Gypsy as she travels frequently, but the track occurring after MJH and Dope is for a reason, it is the 'feel good no more drugs happy' whatever track. In reality, this feels more like something a depressed person would write to 'escape' their sorrow, and 'try' to move on, later to just end up returning to their sorrow. This is why for me, I can't stand Gypsy n feel it is not a genuine 'positive' song, compared to Marry The Night or Applause. 

It feels super coincidental Applause had nothing go wrong with it. DWUW had a rapist, no music video, and was swapped with Venus. Venus didn't do marvelous, and had no video - G.U.Y. would follow in the same steps. Yeah, sure, it had the 'Katy' feud, but that is no where near as bad as what would occur during the era. It is the literal 'closer' to all of ARTPOP, in terms of era and record, the 'embrace the hell and start fresh'. 

 

[27monster27 9,549]

Development started in June of 2011, shortly after the release of Born This Way. Backstage at the MMVA awards on June 18th Lady Gaga revealed that she had already begun writing new material. Early teasing for album started to become more prominent during Marry the Night.

[seashellplay 512]

10 minutes ago, 27monster27 said:

Development started in June of 2011, shortly after the release of Born This Way. Backstage at the MMVA awards on June 18th Lady Gaga revealed that she had already begun writing new material. Early teasing for album started to become more prominent during Marry the Night.