Baby Kept On Vegan Diet Died. Vegan parents Arrested.

[SKANK 14,288]

Just now, Economy said:

Ok if u say so. It's possible by sheer coincidence those simply happened to be the ones I met

 

A coincidence or conformation bias, perhaps. I'd also keep in mind that not every vegan you have met told you they were vegan. In all likelihood you have unknowingly met, overweight, underweight, and healthyweight vegans.

This thread disabused the stereotype that it's vegans, and not meat eaters, who share bloody pictures and lecture others about their diet. So, we mine as well disabuse the "sickly skinny" vegan stereotype as well.

[derpmonster 22,412]

1 hour ago, xoxo Craig said:

Meat was not a treat... meat was our essential diet. Plant matter was only used if we needed it, and/or treat.

Your sources don't show that. This is your inference. Whereas the sources I provided directly state that the majority of early human diet was plant based. 

Your first source is about animals in general, not humans. 

Your second source talks about how we are omnivores. No one is denying that. We're omnivores in the way that chimpanzees are. They are our closest relatives and again you need to look at them. Mostly carnivorous animals don't have incisors and molars like ours. Look at a cat's (obligate carnivore) denture and look at a cow's. We're a hydrid, a more complete system that contains both types with small canines for the occasional tearing we needed. 

Eskimos eat mostly meat because that's what's available to them. Most human civilizations settled around rivers and rainforest, not the artic.

[xoxo Craig 55,649]

1 minute ago, derpmonster said:

Your sources don't show that. This is your inference. Whereas the sources I provided directly state that the majority of early human diet was plant based. 

Your first source is about animals in general, not humans. 

Your second source talks about how we are omnivores. No one is denying that. We're omnivores in the way that chimpanzees are. They are our closest relatives and again you need to look at them. Mostly carnivorous animals don't have incisors and molars like ours. Look at a cat's (obligate carnivore) denture and look at a cow's. We're a hydrid, a more complete system that contains both types with small canines for the occasional tearing we needed. 

Eskimos eat mostly meat because that's what's available to them. Most human civilizations settled around rivers and rainforest, not the artic.

Yes and what did we do? We went hunting for fish, and other meats. We didn't climb trees to eat bananas and stuff like chimps, we ate meat.       Humans are animals, we are a species of animal. 

[derpmonster 22,412]

Just now, xoxo Craig said:

Yes and what did we do? We went hunting for fish, and other meats. We didn't climb trees to eat bananas and stuff like chimps, we ate meat.       Humans are animals, we are a species of animal. 

Again if you look at sources from the Scientific American, National Geographic, and more, you'll see that the majority of the died was plants, herbs, shrubs, fruits, and some fish. The only reason humans started eating meat was once we had tools and fire. We adapted to be able to accept meat, not the other way round. 

And I never said humans aren't animals. I was merely pointing out how your source was about the first animal being a carnivore when we're talking about the first humans. Big difference. Invertebrates came much before humans did and have next to nothing to do with us. 

[Zander 14,944]

Whatever you do, don’t mention non-binary vegans. A certain someone might just implode.

[xoxo Craig 55,649]

Just now, derpmonster said:

Again if you look at sources from the Scientific American, National Geographic, and more, you'll see that the majority of the died was plants, herbs, shrubs, fruits, and some fish. The only reason humans started eating meat was once we had tools and fire. We adapted to be able to accept meat, not the other way round. 

And I never said humans aren't animals. I was merely pointing out how your source was about the first animal being a carnivore when we're talking about the first humans. Big difference. Invertebrates came much before humans did and have next to nothing to do with us. 

All those sources are backed by vegans. Its biased. We ate raw meat, just like the eskimos in the picture in the last article I posted. Infact, they recently discovered in fossilized poop that humans ate meat.  We didn't eat shurbs or plants, we aren't giant pandas lmao  

[derpmonster 22,412]

22 minutes ago, xoxo Craig said:

All those sources are backed by vegans. Its biased. We ate raw meat, just like the eskimos in the picture in the last article I posted. Infact, they recently discovered in fossilized poop that humans ate meat.  We didn't eat shurbs or plants, we aren't giant pandas lmao  

Scientific American, NatGeo, all those that cite studies are biased and you're not?  you don't have 1 source that's even close to that level of reputation. You're the biased one here.

Where is the source for your claim about fossilized poop? And literally no one is denying that humans ate meat. It's just that it was uncommon. We have chemical evidence from fossils but you'll just ignore reality because of what your anecdotal experience is.

[Economy 52,835]

23 minutes ago, Zander said:

Whatever you do, don’t mention non-binary vegans. A certain someone might just implode.

I don't identify as vegetarian or vegan. I'm a non-binary herbivore. Please respect my preferred pronoun 

 

 

 

[Alvaro Moreno Ullrich 1,554]

Ha ha. I love happy endings.

But poor soul :c

[Economy 52,835]

2 minutes ago, Alvaro Moreno Ullrich said:

Ha ha. I love happy endings.

But poor soul :c

What happy ending? 

[ALGAYDO 35,046]

I sometimes feel like y’all are the reason why alien civilizations don’t want to interact with us  “let’s torture and kill living creatures with enough brain functionality to understand pain/suffering/depression so that we can survive, just because it smells and tastes good! Even tho there’s enough plant-based resources to provide us with the same level of nutrition” 
I hate this epoch of human civilization lmao 

[Galactastica 318]

Looking through the long links xoxo posted, so many of them literally prove what he's saying is wrong. Which is really hilarious. You used the Forbes article to say we were only meat eaters and never plants and we can't even process plants in our stomach. The article, that YOU posted, literally debunks everything you are saying and gives a truthful and balanced answer as to humans being omnivores and even talks about stomach enzymes we have for plant digesting purposes.... 

Irony is better than Christmas. 

It's starting to get crazy. Saying humans should be meat eaters only, not a giant panda that eats shrubs, sounds just as silly as a vegan saying humans were plants eaters only, not some t-rex eating flesh. 

And comparing the vast majority of human population to the remote and small communities that have been meat based, is really skewed evidence to use. Why would that be any more useful as an example than the many remote and small communities that survived on plants only? I'm not remotely vegan or vegetarian and you are literally saying things that make no sense and have no science based evidence; posting stuff that counteracts your own ideas. You make my overactive sense of justice do some back flips. 

But really, this gets everyone heated up so much, I have learned how to deal with people like this. You literally can't say or do anything to reason with them, or even show them your perspective without even trying to influence theirs. There is literally nothing worth talking about with someone who is like this; like flat Earthers, climate change deniers, holocaust deniers, people who think the grand canyon was made by aliens, etc. etc. 

Just walk away, y'all. Just walk away and don't feed the conversation.  

 

byeeeeeee

[Bling 31,680]

This is propaganda. If you read closely, the baby was on a RAW food diet, not plant based which would include grains, nuts, etc. Using "vegan" instead of "raw food" is a huge error. 

[Adakam 2]

4 hours ago, Economy said:

Yeah... If he was fed enough breast milk along with it... I'd say the vegan diet alone wouldn't cause death... It might reduce some key nutrients if they didn't do it properly but they'd still have to probably be under feeding him for this to happen

 

Unless the milk portion of his diet was small and the vegan portion was insufficient or poorly planned. Again it's so hard to truly know without more information

 

As for here in Canada they recommend breast feeding bare minimum at least 12 months but by 6 months your suppusto start including a bit of solid food to supplement the milk

 

But there's a lot of foods they don't recommend before 2-3 years. And among that list is stuff like nuts (one of the few vegan foods that contains a fair bit of protein) because it's harsh food for young ones and can not only increase the risk of developing allergies to it but also it's unclear how well they are even able to digest it and absorb all its nutrients. Same goes for legumes

 

If he wasn't being fed enough milk, it's possible the vegan diet on the side just wasn't enough. But the article doesnt tell us how much his milk portion of the diet was, only that it included breast milk

 

Ppl are arguing hard on this thread but the article simply doesn't give us enough info to conclude that the issue was or wasn't the vegan diet... It's also possible that it's somewhere in between and it played a role but wasn't the sole issue.

 

Not going to the doctor certainly was part of the problem too. If the parents insisted on a vegan diet but they saw he was undernourished... The doctors could potentially have given them options to assist like supplements that are safe for babies or even suggestions on how to diversity the vegan diet to make sure it was covering ALL across the board nutrition

 

Without going to the doctor... They couldn't have gotten that advice

 

I get that ppl have moral reasons for wanting to be vegan. But u really need to do your research on a safe way of doing it and what variety you need to include to make sure you have all your nutrition especially if your gonna put a baby who's more vulnerable on it

 

I've met vegans who look perfectly healthy but I've also many many who look sickly and seriously underweight. It's very easy to screw it up without the proper knowledge

The mother's raw veganism most likely made her breast milk pretty much useless for the baby. 

They basically made every mistake in the book.

[Hyoha 1,633]

2 hours ago, derpmonster said:

Scientific American, NatGeo, all those that cite studies are biased and you're not?

There are great counterpoints to the studies you've cited. Researches from respected institutions that have shown a correlation between the consumption of meat and the development of our brains, starting out from 2.3 million years ago, which actually gave us the necessary intelligence to manipulate fire.

https://www.nature.com/articles/nature16990
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5417583/
https://www.npr.org/2010/08/02/128849908/food-for-thought-meat-based-diet-made-us-smarter
https://www.nasw.org/article/eating-meat-drove-evolution-our-big-powerful-brain
https://www.livescience.com/24875-meat-human-brain.html

Just a few examples.