Sam Smith changes their pronouns to they/them

[ear condom 964]

3 minutes ago, TheQueenLG said:

There are only a few people in here that recognize the difference between sex and gender so I don't feel the need to dignify all the others who have not done the basic research. 

Sex is biological and is usually binary. Male or female. 

Gender is a social construct based on biology, but certainly not beholden to it. 

the precision .. the accuracy 

 

[ltlmnstr 2,771]

1 hour ago, giskardsb said:

We need a new pronoun.  They and Them are basically plural  except in specific context.

People have created Spivak pronouns all thats happened is some people adopt them and transphobes make fun of the entire queer community for these new pronouns.

For example:

Ey/Em/Eir/Emself

And the creation of neutral pronouns goes back to 1890.

Bigotry will always find a way. 

 

[uo111 5,265]

27 minutes ago, Akiki said:

There is a difference about sexuality and gender norms. One of them is changeable and the other isn't.

Wrong.

What was your documentary even about if you believe this? Neither are changeable, that's the entire reason why gender and sexuality issues are grouped together.

[SchwineLove 1,374]

That's why this could be a mess. In my language (Indonesian), there's no he/she, but just "dia" that could refer to anyone. iirc some european language also have gender neutral pronoun.

[ltlmnstr 2,771]

13 minutes ago, TheQueenLG said:

There are only a few people in here that recognize the difference between sex and gender so I don't feel the need to dignify all the others who have not done the basic research. 

Sex is biological and is usually binary. Male or female. 

Gender is a social construct based on biology, but certainly not beholden to it. 

Don’t forget Intersex people, too!

Heteronormativity and Cisnormative values have put Intersex people under damaging surgeries!

[FunkYou 352]

38 minutes ago, codymonster said:

I actually agree with you. I wish that gender stereotypes were a thing of the past and instead of feeling the need to change how you identify, I wish people could just dress, act, and be whoever they are, no matter the sex they are born as. But I also understand why some people feel the need to.

The "entitled idiots" I'm referring to are the countless people flooding this thread with ignorant, rude, and disrespectful comments towards the choice that HE has made for HIMSELF. Having a discussion on labels and society's outlook on gender is fine. Making fun of someone for choosing to live a certain way is another; nothing beneficial will come from that. Whether you agree with or not, it's none of anyone's business what Sam Smith would like to be referred to as.

I appreciate your response and understand your previous reply more. I respect every point of view and I find this subject very interesting to debate on. 

You know I go by "live and let live", I consider myself extremely open-minded, so exactly, it's none of my business what he would like to be referred to as. It would be if he'd call me out on the fact I just said "he". But then I think I read somewhere in the thread he said he would still be okay with "he". Which leaves me even more confused as to what is the point. Is it just a matter of self perception? Then it's personal and has no real use in being public, I think. Like, I'm a male, and as many, I don't really recognize myself in the man archetype either (I might not even have the same as yours, it differs depending on the culture). Yet, that doesn't make me less of a man. I'd even say that doesn't make me less of a woman, if we think inside these social constructs. But, all of this is only my business.

In the meantime, I know that being a "he" doesn't define me. Who I am does, and it goes way beyond my name, my looks, the culture I was raised in, my sexual orientation,... my gender.

Labels limit us. Binary, non-binary,... This is yet another social construct based on the same codes as the social constructs it tries to avoid. 

 

This is my take on it. In my opinion binary non-binary is not a good response to gender stereotypes, I just don't see how it solves anything. I see it as a symptom, but a good one, one that creates good discussions that could spark a change. Look at how this topic has engaged reactions. This is good, this is evolution happening right here. Talking about it can help opening minds and make people think about these gender stereotypes that surround us and act on them, and I understand where the binary/non-binary idea is coming from and I'm all here for the discussions on genderstereotypes that it opens. I just don't think of it as a good response to the problem.

Okay so I'm sorry if my post was long (I actually erased some good parts haha) now, only fools don't change their mind, so who knows, maybe one day I will want to be refered to as "they" too.  

[Akiki 3,900]

21 minutes ago, uo111 said:

Wrong.

What was your documentary even about if you believe this? Neither are changeable, that's the entire reason why gender and sexuality issues are grouped together.

Yes they are. Trough the times the gender norms changes, but sexuality don't. The way a gender acts is not only settled by your sex but your culture and time. 

 

[Economy 49,881]

7 hours ago, thierryrreiht said:

Well now they truly are the first gay non-binary person to win an Oscar I guess

They is plural it makes no sense

 

another word needs to be come up with for this

 

and it cant be “IT” as that sounds like ur refering to a useless object

[doppelganger 3,933]

1, Yay for Sam. This is how you use your game for good. Bringing light to an issue that affects a vast number of people

 

2, On the pronoun "they", I get why some are confused. Heck, it takes a bit getting used to. My own language does not gendered pronouns so for me it isn't that much of a stretch. 

[uo111 5,265]

10 minutes ago, Akiki said:

Yes they are. Trough the times the gender norms changes, but sexuality don't. The way a gender acts is not only settled by your sex but your culture and time. 

 

Sexuality “norms” have changed drastically even in our life time.

Sexuality and gender identity are not things people can change at will.

This isn’t a debate. I am literally just stating facts.

[Akiki 3,900]

37 minutes ago, Gagaloo92 said:

First of all, LGBTQ isn't all about sexuality. Trans isn't a sexual orientation, it's a gender identity. In other words, the LGBTQ community is about both sexual orientation and gender identity, sexual minorities and gender minorities. Yes, there's a difference between them, but the community encompasses both. 

As to your examples, these are false equivalencies. Being "emo" is about expression, not a gender or sexual identity. Expression is a part of gender, sure, but is not the identity itself. 

And to bring in the whole dolphin thing is absolutely ridiculous and intentionally misleading. 

How is it so hard to understand that some people are born with a body that does not match what they know themself to be? It's analogous to being born male, identifying as a man, but being attracted to those of the same gender and not the opposite gender. The argument you're using is the same one people used to make to gay people, the whole "first we have to accept gay people next we'll have to accept people having sex with animals" teas. 

Completely irrational and all about false equivalencies. And why? Because people didn't understand it before. Same thing here. You don't understand it. But that doesn't make people who are nonbinary invalid. 

You're literally doing to gender minorities what used to happen (and still happens) to gay people. 

I'm sorry but I can't even compare Trans people with non binary. 

Trans people do not feel okey with their gender in a massive way. They are literally in the wrong body. It's a very complicated situation. 

People born with two sexes also have a medical condition that needs evaluation and to be followed. 

I'm pretty cool with this two and I can understand cause there is evidence to back it up. From my experience, you can tell very clearly that there is something wrong.

But in some cases, non binary people fall short of it. 

When we did the documentary I found the concept very interesting, but I didn't feel the exact same way that I did with my trans friends. We did many interviews and some were even very interesting but I saw no depth to it. Everything seemed shallow with little to no reason.

I do believe in breaking the gender construction but I dont think that Non binary people are a thing besides... people trying to express themselves freely. It was what I felt the most. 

But hey, who knows... everyone is different. 

[Gracious Gaga 17,163]

Great for them.  Clearly there's a lot of people in this world (many of who are on this site, commenting on this thread right now) who are extremely uncomfortable with and unfamiliar with issues regarding gender identity.  It is great that Sam is doing this and raising awareness, whether you guys like it or not.  This is a real thing.  Real people struggle with this.  and one thing about the world and society, it is always going to be changing so y'all better get use to it and stop sounding so ignorant and stuck up and CLOSE MINDED.  WHO CARES WHAT SOMEONE ELSE WHATS TO BE CALLED.  Worry about you and learn how to respect and ACCEPT others.  y'all sound like you have major PHOBIAS.

[Akiki 3,900]

2 minutes ago, uo111 said:

Sexuality “norms” have changed drastically even in our life time.

Sexuality and gender identity are not things people can change at will.

This isn’t a debate. I am literally just stating facts.

You are either born a male, female or with both sexes. But the way you deal with your gender and the perception of it is not set in stone. It changes freely from time to time, from era do era. 

What is a woman today is not the same 100 years ago and this is what messes me up about  non binary people. They go to the streets wearing lipstick claiming that "Hey, today I feel more like a woman and tomorrow maybe it's my masculine side that comes out". 

So, you have two different ways to see it:

I dont identify with the gender construction... Or you physically dont feel like a man or a woman.

And most people I know that claim to be non binary focus in the "cosmetic side of things". They try to blend the two genders and to me it doesn't make any sense. It's just confusing.

 

[aaron l 11,999]

Oh wow people I actually have liked on here for a long time are actual trash. 

[bloody g 31,746]

That's really brave, I'm shook to the moon and back 

Good for them. And it's weird because in Spanish we don't have official gender neutral pronouns. Guess we'll have to use adapt our language.